Im going crazy as SPL!!!

[Ryon_Nayr@email.com]

I am SPL in my troop. We have a small troop, about 7 active members. 5 have ADHD. They goof-off, never listen to me, and one of them is a patrol leader and doesnt do his job at all and just fools around. My Adults in my troop think it should be boy-lead so dont help out much. There is no other person in my troop that could be SPL. My ASPL is pretty worthless. I need help on getting them to do what their supposed to and listen. I have tried several different approaches. At night they never stop talking and fooling around, while everyone suffers. then the adults yell at me because i am supposed to keep them quiet. I have punished them in many ways including, latrine duty, getting up early, have a SM going over scout oath and law for a long time, and even making them get up earlier. Our troop is suffering. Please help!!!!

[mk9750]

Ryon,

 

Hang in there. If it was easy, everyone could do it. You have the job because you are either qualified, or have the potential to be qualified.

 

A few suggestions:

 

1) Make sure you get trained. It sounds like the resources might not be available in your Troop for JLT, but even if they aren't hook up with another Troop for this very important training. And get to Council JLT as soon as they offer it.

 

2) One of your jobs as SPL is to train your replacement. This is the best oppurtunity you have to make your ASPL valuable to you. Use him and his tallents, whatever they are, wisely, and the job eventually will become easy.

 

3) As much as everyone would like to think, you're not supposed to be good at the job right from the start. It's supposed to be a learning experience, not a demostration of how good you are. Failure occasionally is expected, even though no one likes it. It's admirable you desire to do a better job. It means you care.

 

4) You mention some of the negetive inducements you have tried to get your Troop mates to fall in line, but have you used anything positive? Even how you frame things can make them appear more positive. Rather than "OK, if you don't quit talking, you'll have to clean your tent", try "If you stop talking, I'll make sure you don't have to clean your tent". Instead of "If you haven't washed your hands, you'll have to eat last", try "First one with his hands washed eats!".

 

5) Lastly, it just might be that your Scoutmaster, whom you say doesn't help much, is doing you more of a favor than you can appreciate right now. If you become successful, you will have earned the respect of the boys in your Troop on your own. If the SM makes you successful, which he could do, probably, do you think you will get the same level of resect from the guys? Speaking fromn the side of the adults, one of the hardest parts of our jobs is to sit back and let you struggle. It really is hard to do. It's our natural instincts as parents to want to make things easier for you. But if we do, it's not going to teach you the life lessons youshould get out of the program.

 

btw - Don't tell any of your fellow Scouts about this last paragraph. you guys are supposed to think it's all fun and games, and what you learn is supposed to happen without you knowing it. So don't let on there's really a purpose to the game! (LOL)

 

good luck!

 

Mr. K.

[Bob White]

First of all Ryon there is no method of scouting that includes punishing anybody.

 

Here are a few tips that might help you. Whether your troop is 7 or 70 your job as SPL is to work with the Patrol Leaders. So if you have 1 patrol in your troop you should be working with one scout. Lets say you had 40 scouts (5 patrols) you would work with 5 Patrol Leaders. Each of those Patrol Leaders in turn are responsible to work with their own Patrol members.

 

Lets look at the campout you described. Think of how the outcome would have been different if.

At the PLC you and the Patrol Leaders reviewed the rules of the campout. Everyone agreed on a 10 PM alls quiet. When 9 PM rolls around you remind your patrol leaders that they need their patrols settled down and all quiet in one hour.

After 10 PM there are some scouts in the Raccoon patrol that are still too loud. You go to the Patrol Leaders tent (wake him if you need to) and remind him of the time. Let him know you depend on him to follow the rule and lead his patrol. Ask him to speak to the scouts and remind them of the same thing. It wouldnt hurt to bring up a scout is courteous and obedient.

 

If the scouts dont settle down go back to the Patrol Leader. Remind him you depend on each other to lead the troop. Let him know that it is neither your job or his to punish scouts, that job belongs to the troop committee and the parents of the scout. Ask him to remind the noisy scout of that and that if he is unable to behave as a scout then the committee and his parents will have the opportunity to come up with a solution.

 

Your primary job is to help Patrol Leaders succeed. Ask for things to be done dont tell people what to do. Focus on your relationship with the Patrol Leaders. Remind them that their role is to get things done in their own patrol by building teamwork and mutual respect not bossing people around.

 

Finally ask your Scoutmaster to buy you the NEW Senior Patrol Leaders Handbook it will give you more information on your responsibilities and how to do them.

 

Bob White

(This message has been edited by Bob White)

[LauraT7]

I have to laugh - the scene you paint would be trying for any ADULT much less a teen - even a well trained, and well intentioned one....

 

How about some help from an ADD Mom of an ADHD scout?

 

If you truly have that many REAL ADHD kids - and not just some who egg the others on - you DO have a problem. Some are bound to be more "intense" than others. And as you've already found out - punishment doesn't help - it's more work for you and doesn't (usually) make any impression on them.

 

With ADD - EVERYTHING is RIGHT NOW. very impulsive - planning and forthought and consequences are all totally foreign concepts to them. of couse, it depends on how old they are and the severity of their ADHD - but for the most part, that's true. and by the time YOU see them, IF they are on medication, the medication has worn off, and you have unvarnished, unleashed ADD. If they are hyperactive, as many are - they are also physically bouncing off the walls like superballs!

 

Make a call (preferably with your SM) to the parents of each "problem" boy. ASK them to help you, by

1. telling you what strengths and weaknesses the boy has,

2. What works and doesn't in motivating and controlling his behavior

3. ASK them to help the TROOP in a specific way - to free up another adult or older scout to work with their child.

 

Armed with the knowledge of what makes each of your 5 problem children "tick" - now you can work out a "plan"

 

1st, talk to your SM about making APL a "position of responsibility" for the APL of the patrol with the ADHD PL. The SM CAN do this and it might help the ADHD PL get more organized - they can truly work as a team.

 

2nd - overkill - in any communications, for most ADHD'ers 'listening' is the absolute worst way to get any instructions across. Before you finish you're sentence - they've lost it and gone on to something else. WRITE IT, post it, send it home in a flyer, put it on a website, and MAKE SURE THEIR PARENTs KNOW - what is expected of them. If a boy has a particular job, make it the family's responsibility, until the boy learns.

 

you can't possibly hold the hands of FIVE boys, and no one should expect you to!

 

USE their strengths - even when your patience is wearing. For example, we have one ADHD boy in our troop who is mostly obnoxious - he is also a rock expert - his dad is a geologist - so he teaches geology on hikes to anyone who will listen. His obnoxiousness dissapears in the face of pride in his knowledge! My ADHD son's interest is science, aviation and stars - get him talking about those and he stops fidgeting and whistling!

 

At meetings keep things VERY ACTIVE, keep talk short and to the point.

 

Our troop has started "Fellowship fun" - games and time to "hang out and play basketball or some active game in the church gym AFTER meetings - but only if they accomplish the goals set for meeting and keep on schedule.

 

hard and fast and consistant rules - NO EXCEPTIONS, and no anger, either - and Phil - our SPL, is adamant about sticking to the schedule - and he is the best SPL we have ever had!

 

On campouts -

 

Do you have two man tents? if not, get some - or make the boys sleep 2 to a tent anyway - and spread them out so they can't talk between tents. Try to pair a natural early riser with an ADHD. It's hard to talk all night to someone who's snoring! Face ALL the doors toward the fire and keep the tents where they can be seen.

 

Wear them out! Try some long Bike Trips or hikes or hard physical activitiy for some of your first campouts - tired boys don't yack at night!

 

Our troop has sometimes gone overboard in this respect, but it does work - we have many 1 night campouts where we bike ALL DAY, eat on the trail, get to camp just before dark, set up, cook, cleanup, campfire, skits & music, bed and they are OUT FOR THE COUNT.

 

For the first 3-6 campouts, get an adult to agree to sit up and "mind the fire" - they don't have to DO anything, but their prescence is your backup authority. Come up with a penalty for any boy out of tent after "lights out" other than to latrine. use a latrine pass if you have to (at first) - one at a time.

 

Boys who sleep in, miss breakfast,& do dishes & chores (whether they ate or not) no discussion, no holding food for them.

 

We have one (NOT ADHD) who does this regularly - his choice - he'd rather sleep than eat. So be it.

 

If you have a campout where you are doing advancements or badgework - be aware of medication schedules. Most ADDer's take meds breakfast and noon. Some last 6-8 hrs - some about 4. Meds take 30 min to an hour to "kick in" so prime attention time is mid to late morning, and early afternoon. Plan intense, but sit down stuff for those times - learning knots, safety lectures, badgework - and make sure to allow for movement and breaks. Plan really interesting, active, and unstructured things, stuff they really look forward to, for late afternoon and after supper- when the meds are worn off and their attention spans are shorter. Athletics, hand's on activities, free time. (not too much free time - an hour or so - or they'll FIND some trouble!)

 

The more "serious" an activity - the smaller the groups should be - break up the ADDers - or they will "feed" each other's restlessness. If possible, make them 1 on 1 or 2 to 1, teacher / student.

 

whether they like it or not - your ASM's are gonna have to help out - no 1 person can handle 5 ADDer's out of 7. they don't have to run the show - but they should be willing to "monitor" a couple of specific boys each and help keep them in line until they learn. It's not fair to make you and the two non-adders take all the weight of supporting these.

 

Sorry this is long, but i hope it gives you and some others some ideas for boys who probably NEED scouting more than the average.

 

If there is any thing I can do to help, andy insight or advice i can give, please feel free to e-mail me.

 

tlaurat7@hotmail.com

 

YIS

 

Laura

 

 

 

[LauraT7]

http://www.scouter.com/forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=9718

 

This is a good link to another thread on ADHD in scouting -