Troop activities attendance as a requirement for rank advancement.

[hikingdad]

Hi! I'm new to the Scouter's Forum and I would like to tap into the knowledge and experience that is represented here.

 

Question: To what extent can a troop hold a Scout to attendance standards for rank advancement?

May a unit establish a percentage of meetings and/or activities attended to qualify a Scout for his next rank Board of Review?

Is there a written policy or recomendation from National?

I know that " No council, district, unit or individual has the authority to add or subtract from any advancement requirement ", but it would seem there may be a gray area here.......

Any experiences on this issue?

[KoreaScouter]

Hikingdad:

 

Welcome to the forum; hope you get as much enjoyment, advice, and information from it as I do.

 

With regard to your question, there is no published national BSA standard regarding attendance credit. In fact, that's one of those areas that is largely subjective. The very literal among us (and you'll learn very soon who they are) will tell you that "active" means registered, and nothing more.

 

My personal recommendation, if you want a standard based on your troop customs and expectations, is to have your PLC determine what's "reasonable" for active-participation consideration (such as 75% of troop meetings and 50% of outings/fund raisers, or something like that). Then, ensure the PLC-determined guidelines are part of your Scoutmaster conferences with every Scout. I think that does two things for you. One, the Scouts are determining themselves what their troop standards will be. And two, there's no misunderstandings when a Scout is nearing BOR time, and has been late to every troop meeting and attends no troop outings, as an example.

 

Brace yourself; there have been other similar discussions along these lines, and there is much divergent opinion.

 

KS

 

 

[evmori]

hikindad welcome!

 

In my Troop, we use attendance as a measure of a Scout being active. We have set up guidelines for the Scout with positions of responsibility. You can check them out at http://www.bsa.net/pa/t1 Go to the Positions of Responsibility page.

 

As far as the Scouts who don't have a position, I expect them to be at at least 75% of the Troop meetings and outings. To me, this goes hand in hand with Scout Spirit & being active.

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

[rlculver415]

Greetings, hikingdad!

 

In our troop, we have never really defined attendance/participation policies per se. (I think it might be a good idea to do so.) The scoutmaaster is pretty well left to determine how this falls in with the Scout Spirit requirement. Even so, those of us who comprise the Board of Review are also active Scouters and also aware of how well our scouts participate. We all, SM and BOR, tend to get more narrow in our expectations of attendance and participation once a scout advances in the higher ranks. This we tell the boys so there is no surprise. Usually by this level, this is really no issue. Of course, there are exceptions to that. When this arises, the scout is cautioned by the SM (and other Scouters more informally). Lack of adequate attendance and participation will adversely affect advancement in the higher ranks, especially Eagle. By the way, for us participation includes wearing the correct uniform correctly, ie - Class A during the school year, class B in the summer.

[acco40]

One big distinction that I make is the difference between announced and unannounced (did somebody say announcement?) absences. I stress the importance of letting your patrol leader (not ASM, not SM, not CC, etc.) know in advance if you are not going to attend a troop meeting, camping trip, event, etc. If one does not, that shows poor scout spirit in my book.

 

P.S. Ed, I like your troops web site. Very good job!

 

Our troop had a "three absences" rule that stated if a scout had three absences or more per year a meeting with the Scoutmaster was needed. To my knowledge this was rarely if ever enforced. One of my pet peeves is having rules that are not endorced. Right now, we are in the process of reviewing and updating our troop bylaws. One of the changes that I recommend is changing the three absences rule to "three UNEXCUSED absences." An unexcused absence is any absence where the parol leader was not notified or where the patrol leader was notified but the SM did not deem the reason as worthy. The main goal is to teach the scout that their absence affects not just themselves but the troop as a whole. In practice, if prior notification is given, we rarely judge the absence as unexcused regardless of the reason given.

 

As related to scout advancement, as many others have stated, the "shows scout spirit" requirement has a broad umbrella that includes attendance in my opinion. We treat the term "active" as simply a "registered scouter", i.e. has paid his $7.00 (soon to be $10?) membership fee. Therefore, theoretically, a rank advancement could be denied for lack of attendance due to not showing scout spirit. (Sort of like the military eqivalent of conduct unbecoming an officer. It leaves a large area for interpretation.)(This message has been edited by acco40)

[evmori]

acco40,

Thanks.

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

[OldGreyEagle]

Hi Dad, Welcome

 

I am a member of a troop of 90 scouts. We have no requirements of attendance, meetings or events. We know we will lose some scouts in the spring to baseball, in the fall to band and football, in the winter to basketball and wrestling and when the season is over, we will see them again. Our requirements for advancement is that the scout fulfull the prescribed requirements and show scouting spririt not only when they are present but every day. Scouts who do not go on events or attend meetings dont advance and when they ask why their active friends are leaving them behind, this is explained. They soon learn their descions have consequences.

 

 

 

(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

[dan]

The BSA policy for being active is:

Pay the dues. Thats it. Read the Scoutmaster Handbook.

Anything else you are adding to the BSA requirments.

Boys have many other things going on, sports, band, homework.

I miss more than 3 meetings a year because of the above and family. Your expections are to high.

[eagle90]

The only requirement our troop has is for attendance at Summer Camp and/or High Adventure activities. In order to be eligible, a scout must attend 75% of our troop meetings throughout the year and 3 of our 8 weekend campouts. New crossovers must attend 2 of our 4 spring campouts before going to Summer Camp.

 

This criteria was set up by the PLC and is reviewed every year. We did this so that the scouts have the necessary experience learned during the year. It also keeps older scouts active and not just using the troop as a travel agency for a Summer trip.

[sctmom]

This thing about 75% attendance at troop meetings has been gnawing away at me. When school is not in session, my son is at his grandparents house 100 miles away. The school year is about 75% of the calendar year. So if my son was in your troop he could have perfect attendance when he is in town and STILL not meet your criteria!!

 

Not to mention days for being sick, tired, too much homework, sports, etc.

 

I know I'm not the only one in this type of situation. He goes to his grandparents house for a few reasons -- 1) childcare (he can't stay by himself all day and is getting to old for daycares) 2) he and the grandparents want to see each other 3) he wants to see his friends in grandma's neighborhood.

 

This is NOT just summertime I'm talking about. Our school system is going to a new calender where every 6 weeks the kids have AT LEAST 1 week out of school. So he can't just go to a troop in grandma's town for the summer and solve the problem.

 

IMHO if you have a problem getting boys to attend troop functions and meetings, maybe you should look at the quality of the program. I don't think you should penalize boys who are involved in other activities such as sports, ROTC, Civil Air Patrol, whatever.

 

my 2 cents worth

 

[evmori]

dan,

So what you are saying is as long as a Scout pays his dues, he doesn't need to show up for anything and be considered active? And on what page of the SM handbook does it say that? How does this relate to Scout Spirit?

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

 

P.S. I will be on vacation until 8/4. Just didn't want anyone to think I was ducking out.

1 Peter 4:10(This message has been edited by evmori)

[tkwetzel]

Hi everyone. I am the SPL of my 90 member troop and we have no attendance requirement. Active scouts who don't attend any of the meetings or campouts don't advance and that is their problem. The scouts who want to do it will come. I play sports year-round. This past year I struggled through Monday nights when we had our scout meetings, because I would go from school, to practice, to the scout meeting, and then go home and not have time for homework. The only reason I went to all of the meetings was because I was the SPL. I think the 75% attendance is crazy.

-Tyler

[bt01]

The troop can set their own attendance standards for there rank advancement. The troop that I am involved asks the scout to attend 50% of the meetings and activities. Most of them attend 75 % of the meetings. And most of the other activities. The attendance standards can be diffent form one troop to another.

Is there a written policy from National??? I have not seen or heard of it but that does not mean any thing.

 

[ScouterPaul]

Tyler you sound like a mature young man. Keep up the good work.

 

YIS

Paul

[sctmom]

Troops can NOT set their own attendance standards for rank advancement. That is adding requirements which is strictly prohibited by National Policy. This issue has been hashed out here before.

 

Where is Bob White when we need him?

 

If a scout is not attending meetings and events the natural consequence is that he most likely will not be advancing.