Parents as MB Counselors

[Bob White]

Close Ed,

 

It is the scoutmaster's responsibility to make sure the scout meets any prerequisites listed in the merit badge requirements and to make sure he has the name and contact information of a registered merit badge counselor.

 

The scout does not need your "permission" to work on or complete any Merit Badge. To require such permission adds a requirement, and we do not have the authority to do that.

 

Also this should not be delegated. As the Scoutmaster a mjor part of your job is knowing each scout's needs and characteristics. Knowing what their interests are and what MBs they are working on is a big part of that.

 

Bob

[evmori]

Bob,

Correct me if I'm wrong (like I needed to say that) but doesn't the blue card need to be signed by the Scoutmaster or other adult Troop leader prior to the Scout starting to work on the badge? (page 187 Boy Scout hand book)

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

[Bob White]

Actually Ed, the scoutmaster signs the blue card twice. first when it is issued to the scout the unit leader signs under "and is qualified to begin working on the merit badge noted on the reverse side."

Then when the cars is returned a unit leader signs the applicant section as a receipt to show that the scout "has given me his completed application for the______________merit badge."

 

So at no time is the leader asked to give permission. They just verify that the scout has met any prerequisites, and then signs to show that the card was recieved on completion.

 

Bob

 

[shemgren]

Bob White:

 

I read the document you referred to and you are correct. I will immediately have the troop change their policy to comply. If you have read my post in other threads, I am fighting againist a old SM's influence within the troop and slowly getting all back in line, with bylaws and policies next on my list.

 

In addition, the advice for that policy can from my district avancement chair, who I will present a current copy of that book.

 

Thank you for bringing this to my attention and this proves that even after over 30 years of Scouting, I still don't know it all.(This message has been edited by shemgren)

[frankj]

Bob White: re: your May 2nd post. Page 10, column 2 of MY policies and procedures manual talks about religious principles, so I will keep looking for the reference you cited. In the meantime we are going to be careful about parents acting as counselors on the Eagle required merit badges. Your advice on the Advancement Reports, i.e. getting them turned in promptly is exactly what we do. Usually, the badge is awarded at the very next meeting. I have been aware of the whole reward/incentive scenario from Tiger Cubs through the present! And we do split up the MB cards between counselor, Scout and Unit. It is the Unit's portion of the completed cards that I was referring to in the earlier post. I view these as the bottom line if a question comes up at some point. It has been enlightening reading all the posts on this topic. To anyone out there who is involved with a troop, helping the Advancement Chair, or being the Advancement Chair can be fun and it really makes a contribution to the unit. No, you don't have to know each and every requirement inside out, although if you do, that would be a bonus. It is an opportunity to get to know the boys as individuals, and to help them complete their requirements for the various ranks. Recordkeeping is a big part of it but there are tools available to help with that.

[evmori]

Bob,

By signing the card prior to the Scout starting the badge, isn't the Scoutmaster in a way approving the Scout to work on that merit badge?

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

[Bob White]

No Ed,

You are verifying that the scout meets any prerequisites as listed in the merit badge book, and that he has the name of a registered merit badge counselor. Read page 187 of the Boy Scout Handbook. You approve only in the sense that they meet the prerequisites and that they have a qualified MB counselor. The scout cannot begin meeting with the counselor until they obtain the blue card. It is not as if you can determine whether or not they are "ready" age wise or maturity wise.

 

Bob

 

 

(This message has been edited by Bob White)

[LauraT7]

this thread has my head whirling - alot of wrong ideas that I have been taught.... and just recently, too!

 

And Julia, we have a council list - on CD no less! but members of our troop have had a terrible time getting many MB counselors on the list to answer their calls - much less actually meet with them.

 

We have been trying to build up our troop counselor list, too - and been trying to duplicate counselors, because we thought that a couselor could not sign off on their own child.

 

Can anyone tell me where, exactly, I can find the regs on MB counselors and who they can counsel? I would love to show it to my troop and get them to drop that "requirement".

 

In recruiting counselors, we have gone on the theory that a person does not necessarily have to teach the badge - just have the knowledge to know wheather the boy has learned the requirements adequately.

 

For example, I am a counselor for Photography - and know the requirements well enough to test a boy on his knowledge. But I do not have access to a photo lab, equipment and the like to "teach" the badge. I thought that the point of badgework was that the boy was supposed to learn on his own - not be shuffled through a "class"?

 

 

 

 

 

 

[MomScouter]

In our troop parents can counsel merit badges.....registered or not! I have been trying to compile a listing of counselors in our troop and found out much to my dismay that no one (except myself and another parent) who is counseling badges in our troop is registered! This includes the SM who counsels quite a few badges, including EAGLE badges. In addition, the SM does NOT use blue cards...has anyone ever heard of that? He just keeps track in some book he has then turns in the advancement report. It get worse....the SM is also the District Advancement Chair!!!!

 

We have not been with this troop long, we left one in April because of too many problems with not following BSA policy...well here we are again with a SM who is ready to retire and still doing things like he did them 30 years ago. The DE is aware of the 'no blue card' situation, but no one will say anything because the SM is elderly and has been around a long time, and is basically a good guy (but stubborn). How do I deal with this??? I am a committee member outnumbered by a committee that has been with the SM a long time and will not go against anything he says or does.

[Bob White]

LauraT7,

You will find the merit badge information you seek in the Boy Scout Handbook and in the Advancement Committee Policies and Procedures manual.

 

Bob White(This message has been edited by Bob White)

[Eagle74]

Just had to add my two cents worth!

 

On the original question; there is nothing that prevents a parent from being the counselor for his/her own son or signing off on rank requirements. From the ethics standpoint I personally try to avoid this for my sons, unless they are working on a merit badge together with another Scout or group of Scouts. If another counselor is available and reasonably convenient I have them go to someone else. Just gives me some backup to say that no "favoritism" was shown. Same with requirements. I usually have them demonstrate the skill and be signed off by one of the other leaders unless again the work is being completed together with others.

If your troop has a limited list of counselors for the Scouts to go to, by all means don't put them at a disadvantage just because they are your son. I would hope that ethics of Scouting and Merit Badge Counseling apply in either case.

 

Another good way for the Scout to retain his part of the "blue card", the merit badge card, rank advancement cards, etc. is to use the baseball trading card notebook pages. They fit perfectly and make for a tidy way to keep it all together. We emphasize to the Scout and parents that they retain all records in a notebook this way and bring it to all Boards of Review. Thanks to the thoroughness of our Troop Advancement Chairpersons through the years, there has never been a disputed piece of the advancement puzzle, but the Scouts are able to provide verification this way, if questioned.

 

It also makes for a nice display at an Eagle Court of Honor or simply as a memento to stash away for when "Junior" has a "Junior" of his own.

[evmori]

Bob,

Considering you have been espousing nowhere in any BSA manual does it say the Scoutmaster doesn't approve merit nadges before a Scout starts to work on them, how do you explain page 123 of the Scoutmaster Handbook that says:

 

"Scouts may work on any merit badge at any time, assuming thay have the approval of their Scoutmaster."

 

Approval - not ensuring the prerequisites are met - Approval.

 

Looks like my not quit just turned into yes you are correct.

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

[Bob White]

Ed, I think you know the answer, read the blue card. Then read the entire page 123. You are signing that the boy is ready to begin, not prejudging whether he is capable of completing. You are signing that you know he is beginning on the MB and that you gave him the name of a qualified counselor. Just like page 123 says.

 

What purpose would the BSA or you have for telliing a boy he cannot investigate a topic that interests him? That's not the aim of the program. And I have to believe that you would not do it just to be the guy in charge, and feel you know more about what the scout should be interested in than the scout himself could possibly know.

 

So why say no if he meets the prerequesities of the BSA. What would be the benefit for you? What would be the benefit for the scout?

Why create hurdles where none were placed?

 

Bob White

[evmori]

Bob,

I'm not trying to create hurdles. The point I have been trying is our job as adult leaders in the organization is to teach and guide. We are to teach the Scouts from our knowledge and guide them along the path to Eagle. We teach the leaders how to lead and guide them over the rough spots. Common sense MUST come into play. If we blindly do what the manuals tell us then we serve no purpose and the Scouts learn nothing.

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

[Bob White]

If one did what was written in the manuals it would be called a scouting program.

 

As troop leaders we train junior leaders. Nowhere in the program are you asked or instructed to tell a boy what merit badge he should or should not be interested in, or what educational opportunities he can or cannot pursue.

 

Why the aversion to what is written in the manuals. All they contain are the methods and procedures of what we are supposed to be doing and how we are expected to be doig it.

 

Bob White