Other Reasons Kids Drop Out

[Scoutfish]

I have to vent! I'm mad, upset ,and also irked !

 

I was just sitting here and reading various posts, when I got a phone call from my brother-in-law.

 

He had a question about the axle spacing on a PWD car. I told him what he wanted to know, and also gave him a few other pointers as I am working with the PWD committee.

 

He then says to me: " Nobody should know that %$#$ kind of information!"

 

Then he procedes to tell me about how %&*$# stupid this is, why he's $%^^%$# po'ed at the PWD chair, and that boyscouting in general is just "$%$^%%#$# STUPID!"

 

Apparently, he's pretty upset that HE has to cut out the car. He tells me that there is no way he will let his 8 year old son use a skill saw, chop saw, drill press,belt sander ,table saw , or scroll saw.( not sure what kind of car they were planning on!) He then says he's about ready to tell the Cub Scouts he wants his money back!

 

Okay..what could you possibly say to anybody with this mindset? What could you say to a person who has that kind of thinking?

 

Basucally, this guy...my brother-in-law...thought he'd just carry his son to and from scouting and that would be all of his generously gracious involvement with his son.

 

Now, I'd like to think that, this is not only the exception, but the very rare exception!

The rare "Oh great, I have to disturb the dust on my body, get up and actually interact with my child!"

 

I mean, when my B-I-L signed up my nephew at the roundup, it was very well explained that scouting is a family oriented activity. It was not only said many times, but also implied MORE times that at least one, if not both parents plus the family should be involved.This was also explained, told,said and mentioned repeatedly at the first pack meeting for new scouts and their parents. You know the ones...you have to fill out all kinds of info about you and your child, You also hand over some cash too.

 

But then again, if you have that mindset, how could anybody explain that to you?

 

Okay, I'm done venting now.

 

But I just wanted to point out, this is another reason we lose a few ( hopefully, very few) scouts: Parents who only get involved at Christmas and birthdays and think all child raising duties are over!

[Eagle732]

Cub Scouting is a family oriented activity for sure. Kids have to have the support and encouragement of their parent(s) or they end up dropping out. After all how long to you think a kid is gonna want to go to meetings when dad is complaining all they way! Dad does not understand the value of Scouting and probably never will. I feel for your nephew.

 

By the way I had a great time doing PWDs with my son, our pack even had a special race for the adults and I raced my old 1969 vintage car one year. It was slow and it almost made it to the end of the track!

[Eagle732]

One other thought. As a Cubmaster and later as a Scoutmaster one of the saddest reasons I've seen kids drop is because of divorce.

[Eagle92]

I kinda had a dad like that. Only thing that kept me going as a CS was I was having some fun and older cousin was an Eagle and i heard some of his stories. Also read my brothers' BSHB and knew ther ewas more out there than CS.

 

One reason is boredom. My first den really didn't do much, one parade, and one field trip. That's it. Luckily I transferred to another den.

 

Divorce is big. Moving is another. finances seems to be hitting a few of my parents. esp. sincemy packis the most expesnive inthe area, $67/year with BL, plus the event fees, i.e. campout, PWD cars, etc.

 

 

[ScoutNut]

There are a number of folks out there who consider BSA to stand for Babysitters of America. There are quite a few who refuse to work with their son at all. That is the reason for the Cub Scouts 2010.

 

I would have said that I was sorry he felt that way, but one of the main reasons for the PWD is to help the parents and sons have a fun, quality experience they can do together.

 

Also, there is really no need to cut out anything on the PWD car.

 

A bit of hand sanding on the corners, some nifty paint, and they are good to go.

 

I have had Scouts do just that and win a number of races. Lots of fun had by all.

 

 

[DeanRx]

I've lost 3 scouts from our pack this year because parents don't want to be involved with their kids. I had one father actually state, "He's just going to do basketball this winter. I can just drop him off at practice, run an errand, and pick him up when its over." Dad of the year material. I know at least 5 other cubs in our pack that are there with their fathers only because the WIFE makes the dad come to scout functions. They'll never make it out of cubbies. We have a couple families (not single parent) that the mom comes on family campouts and dad stays home. Not that he's working, he just doesn't like camping / outdoors, so mom does it instead. For some parents, and even more fathers their kids are not their priority in life.

 

Maybe I'm the odd one out, but I love getting to do things with the kids (not just mine, but all the kids). Maybe its because my father took the time to do it with me, but it seems the way it shoud be. Maybe I'm really just an inmature kid myself.

 

Far too many parents (especially fathers) want to bring home the paycheck, buy the kid whatever new video game he wants, and then be done with him. Its really a sad thing.

 

Divorce is HUGE. I know of 4 families (including a former cubmaster) that saw the premature end to the son's scouting career when the parents split up. Such a selfish way to try and deal with one's problems (but I won't jump on that soapbox right now...)

 

As for the PWD thing... get a C-clamp and a wood rasp for christ sake! That and some sanding paper will cost you all of $10 at Home Depot, maybe another $5 for the paint at the hobby shop. Worst thing the kid can do to hurt themself is scrape their knuckles or get sawdust in their eye. The kids doesn't need to use power tools to make his car (its cool if you do and can teach him a little about them - espicially about safety), but it can be done without.

 

Your B-I-L would flip if he saw the time my son wants to put into his car. We spent 3 hours on Saturday just deburing and polishing axles (he did a total of 8 from two sets). Then my son sits at the kitchen table with my dial calipers and matches the 4 best out of the 8 that he wants to use on the car... (my adult car) gets the rejects for my tires. I've literally had to tell him it was time to stop and go to bed 3 nights this week because the only thing he wants to do after homework and a quick bite is work on that car.

 

I have no more important thing to do than help him with the car. The day will come soon enough when he wants to pretend that he doesn't know who I am. Until then, I'm taking all these moments I can get.

[Scoutfish]

I'll be the first to admit, that my first year, I was just accomadating my son. My wife asked me to take my son to school that night for the Cub Scout Roundup. I listened to a DE talk about how great scouting was.

 

To be honest, the guy was a bit over the top and too eager for my taste. He kinda scared me! LOL!

 

So I signed up my son and filled out the paper work and handed over some cash.

A week later, I went to our first Pack night. The kids were taken outside by the existing den leaders and we got the whole "We ARE NOT babysitters!" speach. I was explained about how scouting and the scouting program was about all the values and morals and such, but also explained what was supposed to happen on the FAMILY level!

 

I filled out more paper work and handed over even more cash!

 

So I went home and asked my wife what nights should she take him and what nights I should. She looked at me and said :"Oh! No no! This is your thing that the two of you will do together!"

 

WHAT?

 

So, for the first month or two, I grudgenly took my son. Too many times I wouldget off work, rush home, drive past the pack CO and pick up my son just to back track 12 miles. I wouldn't get to shower or eat supper until almost 8 pm each meeting night.

 

Now,I always helped out though , even if I wasn't thrilled about being there. That's just courtesy.

 

Somewhere along the way during that first year- I don't know exactly when..., I sorta had fun. Then I helped out during a pack campout.

 

My eyes were opened and I saw things differently.

I plan on being a den leader next year and told both my wife and son, that I'll probably continue being a del leader even after my son goes onto Boy Scouts. I'll continue being a DL even if he decides not to go to Boy Scouts.

 

So maybe I'm biased a bit, but I can't figure out why a dad won't at least do the basic minimum with his son without blowing his top!

[Eamonn]

Some years back one of my co-workers was a female nurse, a single parent.

To be honest she was a real pain and I could see why the guy she had married had seen fit to head for the hills!

Her son had received the Boy Talk at his school and was wanting to join.

She was having no part of this!

Her eldest son was an Eagle Scout and she talked very highly of Scouts and Scouting but she said she just didn't have the time to invest. She offered to buy her son a fish if he gave up on the idea of becoming a Cub Scout.

I have friends who have kids and at th start of each new school year they sit the kids down and let them pick X number of after school activities that they will be involved with.

It's all too easy to put these people down.

Where we live there is a lot of activities that kids can be involved in. Back when I was a little fellow the choice was the local Boy's Club which was all about boxing or Scouts. Being as I never liked being hit, I opted for the Scouts. My older brother was a Scout and he ended up giving me the odd whack anyway!

My parents were never in any way involved in my Scouting activities. I think if we'd had Pine-Wood Derbies in the UK Dad would have paid someone to make my car. - He was busy trying to "Do Well."

 

Since HWMBO found out that she had cancer, I find myself doing less and less and the more I'm out of the groove, the less time I seem willing to spend on Scouting.

I never used to miss a meeting, would drive a couple of hundred miles each way! Now I find myself looking out the window looking for reasons not to attend.

I have been asked to take on several projects that a few years back I would have jumped at and loved to do. Now I can just say "No!"

I'm happy that my son was a Scout.

I'm grateful for all that he got from Scouts and Scouting.

I never ever planned to get as deeply involved as I allowed myself to become.

 

I really dislike the Baby sitting stuff.

While it's great to have parents that are interested and involved, my feeling is that we are here for the kids and it's not their fault if they have parents like mine who for whatever reason decide that they don't want to be involved.

Ea.

[Lisabob]

"We have a couple families (not single parent) that the mom comes on family campouts and dad stays home. Not that he's working, he just doesn't like camping / outdoors, so mom does it instead."

 

OK this one struck a nerve a little. I know what you meant. It is very sad that some parents don't seem to actually want to spend time with their own children (if they don't, who do they think will want to do that?). On the other hand, some dads really DON'T like scouting and camping and outdoor stuff, and some moms really DO like that stuff. It doesn't necessarily mean that those dads are not part of their kids' lives. There are many other ways for dads and sons to connect than camping. To my mind, we should be happy that the kids have a parent who supports them. But some things are not for some people, gender roles aside.

 

Scoutfish, I hope your B-I-L doesn't live nearby. Sometimes it is easier to deal with pain in the tail relatives when they live elsewhere. But it is a shame he feels that way. It won't be long before his kid doesn't want to waste his time doing things with his dad, either.

 

 

[Eamonn]

I have always thought myself luck and given thanks that OJ was a boy.

Friends of mine who have girls have had to suffer through dance recitals.

I've lost count of the number of times when I had the bar open, that a Dad would load up before attending one of these things.

Almost an entire day spent watching lots of little girls clod-hop around a stage, dresses in ridiculous dresses and costumes that cost an arm and a leg.

I was never that wild about attending OJ's track meetings. It's kinda hard to get excited watching the shot!

But my idea of hell would be spending eternity at a dance recital. -I'll take a PWD any-day!

Ea.

[dewASM]

I am going to play devil's advocate and defend your BIL. Perhaps his frustration is not with the time spent in Scouting but the craziness that has become the PWD in many packs. There is more pressure on winning and perfect cars than on the father/son moment. Perhaps he is not comfortable in his ability to create a car with his son which will not be derided for being too slow.

 

My son loved PWD and worked hard with his dad on his car. Two years in a row he was a winner in the pack. The third year as he approached the final rounds (he did not win by the way) he was actually booed by people assembled in the gym. Truthfully that was almost the end of Scouting for our family.

 

I have heard stories from other people as well. PWD is not always a shining moment so I wouldn't condemn your BIL for his dislike of this one activity. FWIW

[Scoutfish]

dew,

I wish that was the case, I talked with my B-I-L since that night. He was mad that his son did not get called up and get an award at the pack meeting.

 

I asked him what award. He didn't know, but thought his son should have gotten "some or any" award by now.

 

So I asked :"What is he and his den working on?"

 

BIL: "I don't know what they are doing...It's not my concern!"

 

So I ask why he thought his son should get an award?

 

BIL: "Because he's there!"

 

So Then I asked him if his son even earned his Bobcat yet.

BIL: " His what? What's that? Look, I take him to meeting and take him back home and (wife's name here) is lucky I do that $#@%$% for her!"

 

Basically, it's not scoutimng he has a problem with, it just happens that scouting is what is going on right now. If it wasn't scouting,it would be something else that was the problem.

[IM_Kathy]

it's always sad when you lose a good kid because of a parent's idea of what should or should not be done or their own wants.

 

I'm reading this and laughing because you are describing my husband in my son's early couple of years - though he didn't cuss and throw fits, he would just chat with me when away from the kids. He wanted his son to be a football player, and thought scouts would get in the way of that. He got to the point that he was trying to bribe our son for him to stop scouts. He was having so much fun and making great friends that he didn't take any of the bribes. And it's a very good thing, our son played football 2 years and wasn't very good and decided it wasn't for him. And now he's in boy scouts and enjoying it even more - he has gotten to do so many different things. He loved being historian and is now really jumping into the deepend as being elected as SPL and is only 14 one of the youngest we've had. And football? just about every campout the boys all play for at least an hour - and he loves it then.

 

reason's some leave?

* back in cubs we have 1 leave because his dad wouldn't go camping with us because alchol wasn't allowed and the boy didn't want to go to camp without his dad.

* we had another one that stayed until his last year of Webelos - he was from a split family and dad would be involved only during pwd and his cars were always obviously dad made, but other than that if dad had custody then he wouldn't be at scouts - I finally got a hold of mom and got their schedule to set up our den meetings around her custoday.

[jeff-o]

Just think -- in some of these cases, these boys need scouting more than anything else. I know of one boy who has parents that are currently undergoing a divorce, and fortunately he's still with Scouting -- and Scouting, right now, is the one solid thing in his life.

 

When you see the parents that don't seem to care about the Scout, work harder to help ensure the boy doesn't grow up the same way.

[Scoutfish]

Okay, I have mixed feelings about this. I don't want to label his parents but..... They are just FLAT OUT LAZY!!!! They will do something as long as it interests or benefits them and that's about it. Dad is the greatest dad alive on birthdays and Christmas and that's about it.

Mom, means well, but that's as far as she goes..meaning it, not doing it.

 

So I kinda want to help guide him, but I have to be careful. I already drive( I take turns with my wife) my son and nephew to school . If my wife and I can't - like when I had surgery, MY mom drove him. She also drove my nephew because somehow...it didn't occur to his parents that they could drive the boys to school. Completely oblivious.

 

So If I start driving my nephew to den and pack meetings too..where would it stop? I already paid for half his patches as well as picked them up, got then sewed on his shirt, picked up his belt, slider,neckerchief and hat. I went and got him his PWD car after his mom asked me to, and pretty much , I'll be paying for it too since it's been 3 weeks and they haven't paid me back.

 

Sure, it hasn't added up to an enormous amount yet, but you see the trend right?

 

I also turned in his application and fee (which his parents actually paid). Okay, that in itself wasn't a biggie, but you'd think they would have turned it in themselves at a meeting.

 

So, if I take my nephew to meetings, am I gonna have to do it every meeting? Will I have to not only take him to campouts and such, but will I have to start paying for it too?

 

I guess it comes down to the principle of it: he's not my son. It's not my job to be his dad when he has a completely capable dad and mom too.

 

But on the other hand, not only is he family, but as some of you said... a boy who probably needs scouting more than some of the others do. Scouting might be one of the few and far in between places he'll ever get that mentor- father/son type atmosphere while growing up.

 

I guess I want to help, and I'm mad his parents don't do it themselves, but at the same time...I don't want to set a precident here with him.

 

That make sense to anybody?