Ethical Choices

[evmori]

Instead of hijacking the other thread, this one seemed to make sense.

 

FScouter posted

 

Ethical choices come from within, using your brain, applying principals, morals, character, and knowledge. Ethical choices need no rules or guidelines to limit choices.

 

I agree with the 1st sentence but not the 2nd. If there are no rules or guidelines, how is one to know what is ethical?

 

Ed Mori

1 Peter 4:10

[scoutldr]

If you have to ask...that's your answer.

[Stosh]

Principles, morals, character and knowledge are the rules and guidelines. The two statements contradict themselves. That's why one would ask for clarification.

 

Stosh

[Gunny2862]

ev, there's the rub - unless everyone buys in to the same moral basis or the moral basis are, in practice if not theory, equivalent then there's no universalizability of ethics and one is back to describing what they mean about their ethics in any given situation.

[evmori]

I understand that Gunny, but even situational ethics have rules & guidelines.

[FScouter]

The ethical choices point arose from the suggestion in the parent topic that enforcing a policy would solve the problem of untucked shirts, to which it was suggested that there might be another approach based on our Mission.

 

Ethical choices are not made by following a list of rules or guidelines. Teach principles, values, and morals, ethical choices follow; no rules needed.

[evmori]

Ethical choices are not made by following a list of rules or guidelines. Teach principles, values, and morals, ethical choices follow; no rules needed.

 

What are the principles, values & morals you are teaching based on?(This message has been edited by evmori)

[FScouter]

Well, they're certainly not based on a list of rules.

 

Ed says "If there are no rules or guidelines, how is one to know what is ethical?"

 

So tell us the rules that are needed to ensure ethical choices are made.

[evmori]

Well, they're certainly not based on a list of rules.

 

Ed says "If there are no rules or guidelines, how is one to know what is ethical? "

 

So tell us the rules that are needed to ensure ethical choices are made.

 

I'd be more than happy to share as soon as you do FScouter.

 

What are they based on?

[FireKat]

the Ten Comandments

the Golden Rule

the Bill of RIghts

Enough for a start?

[Gunny2862]

ev, I'm sorry, but I don't think you do get my meaning in this case.

 

I wasn't proposing situational ethics but that sans a universal basis for the underlying morality that each person then applies their own moral basis and thus their own ethical theory to each situation whereas the central theme of ethics, as I have been instructed, relies on the ability for all(regardless of group affiliation) to be able to agree on what would be the ethical choice. This implies a universality of understanding of what the ethics are based on and why we don't just say "the moral choice" rather than "the ethical choice".

 

The lack of a universal basis renders the term ethics useless unless you are only applying it to a specific group which agrees on the basis.

 

For instance, and only as a possible example you, certain others or even possibly myself might posit that ethics that aren't biblically based are meaningless, others as you well know who will certainly choose to disagree with that idea. So unless their ethical basis mirrors the biblical basis for ethics then you and the other person will be talking about divergent ideas of ethics because your basis for ethics are different.

[FScouter]

The Golden Rule is a good principle upon which ethical choices can be made. The twelve points of the Scout Law are principles that when learned lead to ethical choices. I dont think there are any rules that are going to force one to make ethical choices. Anyone can follow a rule, and doing so forces a direction that was predetermined by the writer of the rule. A choice is made amongst a variety of alternative directions. The ethical choice leaves out the undesirable alternatives. One chooses the ethical alternatives from learned values.

 

I see no place for rules anywhere in the process of making an ethical choice.

[Horizon]

Rules are society's way of codifying generally agreed upon ethics (the good old Social Contract as explained by Rousseau). We come from different backgrounds, and even people of the same faith in the same church can find disagreement on ethical decisions in certain situations. From these debates we get rules. Rules should reflect ethics.

 

e.g.: It is ethical to be safe. However, each of us has a different definition of safety. The rule is that you need a Tour Permit. The Tour Permit reflects the BSA's thoughts regarding safety (along with the G2SS). Now, if we all were in 100% agreement regarding what is safety, we would not need the G2SS and Tour Permits.

[OldGreyEagle]

I don't see ethics as a base of rules, rather it is set in the values that a Culture holds dear. Trustworthy, Loyal, Helpful, Friendly, Courteous, Kind, Obedient, Cheerful, Thrifty, Brave, Clean and Reverent are all values that might have served a Roman Centurion or a Knight Templar or a Tenderfoot Scout well.

 

In another Culture, such as that of the Ferengi none of the above values are of much use since they do not add profit to the individual.

 

That which is ethical depends on the accepted behavior pattern of the society in which one lives.

 

It is well to remember that just because something is legal, it is not immediately ethical.(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

[Stosh]

the Ten Comandments

the Golden Rule

the Bill of RIghts

the Scout Law

 

Are all codified rules/regulations by which ethical decisions are made. Without such codes, there is no such thing as an ethical decisions, only a decision based on an individual's personal "code" of their own creation. It is ethical only to themselves.

 

Stosh