sending boys home

[Lisabob]

What does it take? Where is your personal line? I'm not asking for a "book" answer. I'm asking, what behavior would you throw up your hands and say "that's it, you're going home now" to a boy?

 

 

[Bob White]

I would never say to a scout "that's it you are going home". I would make sure that scouts knew from day one what was acceptable behavior and what was not (Scout Oath and Law) and make clear that if they do not act as scouts then they do not participate in scout activitities. I don't need to tell a scout he is going home. The parents can tell them when they get there to pick him up.

 

 

from the Scoutmaster Handbook:

"A boy who continually disrupts meetings or whose actions endanger himself or others during Scouting activities should be sent home."

 

Seems pretty clear doesn't it.

 

 

[Lisabob]

OK let me be more concrete about this. I'm curious. Under what kinds of circumstances HAVE people actually sent boys home? Bob, I know what the book says and I also happen to agree with the basic logic of your first paragraph. It just wasn't really what I was asking, is all.

 

 

[John-in-KC]

The boy was in EagleSon's year group. He had made Star Scout, and we had nominated him for a camp honor. He was the current ASPL.

 

He was one of three troublemakers in the Troop, and the ringleader. I won't go into the details, but we had a visit from the lead commissioner of our camp after he'd been ejected from a range. That was Day 3. On Day 4 (we have a 10 day camp), he did something else ... whatever it was, it was enough to have the Camp Director visit our camp Scoutmaster and CC. He'd been disruptive at meals, to the point a staff member had chosen to sit at his table twice.

 

One of our Troop resident Grandpa's is a respected Scouter in our Council, an active member of the Executive Board. The adult consensus was to withdraw the camp honor (it had not yet been given). Our sage Scouter looked the camp Scoutmaster and CC in the eye... if it's enough to pull the honor, it's enough to send him home.

 

We called his parents. They had to drive 2 hours to be at camp by 7PM. CC and one other adult, under two-deep, held the boy back as the rest of us started off to campfire. Two other adults packed his gear and brought it to the roadhead. When we came back from campfire, we held a brief all-hands meeting.

 

That was the last time we saw him in the Troop.

 

I hope this helps.

[evmori]

When the unit suffers from the actions of a Scout.

 

When a Scout blows off all his merit badge classs.

 

Theft.

 

 

[Stosh]

I've never been in a position where I have had to send a boy home.

 

Stosh

[Gunny2862]

I haven't had to and hope I won't have to send anyone home.

 

But, if they won't follow reasonable directions from their PL, the ASPL, SPL (or the leader of a camp program area) and wind up facing an ASM or myself and still don't care to play the game then they simply don't need to be there.

 

If there is inside the unit theft and the proof is there then the offended might get to help make the call.

 

If it's theft outside the unit they're probably going home.

 

A safety violation on the range isn't probably enough for me to send them home, to keep them off of the range according to the rangemasters wishes, yes, but not necessarily home.

 

But it's all speculative for me at this point, haven't seen it yet, would want to know the Scout involved and the circumstances of any of the above situations and talk it out with him before this decision was made.

 

Exceptions to my fairly soft line would be any battery, especially if a weapon of any type is involved. Go straight home, do not pass go, do not collect a merit badge or $200.

 

I agree with BobWhite here, I shouldn't have to tell them they are going home, they should know they are going, and that is only reinforced by their parental transportation arriving. On the other hand, I probably would have a sit down with them and inform them of the Who What When Where and Why's of their shortened Scout outing(because if I can't do this then how do I KNOW they KNOW why they are going, and give them the opportunity to learn from it) and would make sure they were either in the immediate presence of myself or another adult until their parent arrived. No 300 foot space for a Scout who is having to be sent home, sorry.

 

Question: If you do send them home, do you refund any portion of their Camp, HA or other fees? Or is that part of their discussion with their parents?

[Knot Head]

A buddy of mine has a son in a troop across town where a scout was sent home from summer camp a few years back for repeatedly throwing his knife at a canvas tent while another scout was inside. He also stuck and ripped holes in the tent with his knife. The scout was caught & stopped, knife taken, sent home immediately. I tell our scouts this story before every summer camp and stress we will send them home if they do something to deserve it.

 

evmori's list is a pretty good one.

When the unit suffers from the actions of a Scout.

 

When a Scout blows off all his merit badge classs.

 

Theft.

 

[John-in-KC]

Gunny,

 

That particular year, I was re-taking BSA Lifeguard (first time since my WSI in my 20s). That's a full-time class in and of itself. I was a little busy to know exactly what had happened at the range. Many of us knew the range director, normally he visited quietly with a SM if he ejected a Scout after the fact. That he sent the Lead Commish implies something fairly egregious.

[BrentAllen]

I know an old SM who would never send a boy home (unless the camp director made him). He figured the boy would be getting off easy if he sent him home. Instead of being sent home, the boy had to do KP, clean the latrines and shower house, collect fire wood, etc. for the rest of the week, or until his behaviour improved. The boy might quit the troop after camp (which might also happen if you send him home), but odds were strong he wouldn't misbehave in the troop again, if he stayed. The other advantage to keeping him in camp was the other boys got to see some of the consequences, which wouldn't happen if the boy was sent home. Fortunately, I haven't had to deal with that type of behaviour in our troop.

[Bob White]

I have sent scouts home twice in 32 years. Once for bringing marijuana, and once for threatening to hurt an adult leader.

[NJCubScouter]

From what I understand, our troop has had two such incidents in about the past 10 years. One involved a Scout who was chasing another Scout(s) with an axe, on a weekend camping trip, and his parents were called to take him home. The second involved a Scout who stabbed another Scout with an eating utensil at Saturday breakfast at summer camp. Technically he was not "sent home early" since this was the last meal of the week and all the parents were on their way to the camp to pick up their sons anyway. However, it was made clear to the parents that their son was subject to some disciplinary action (probably unspecified at that point) and he was never seen in the troop again.

 

We did have a "borderline" incident where two older boys decided to "snowboard" off the roof of a boathouse at a weekend camping trip. The campmaster was not a happy camper (so to speak) regarding this incident. I think their "punishment" was having to listen to him, and then the Scoutmaster, express their displeasure at their conduct. Of course, we have had lesser incidents of misbehavior, but this was probably the closest anyone came to getting sent home who wasn't sent home.

[NJCubScouter]

I don't get the logic of the SM not telling the boy that his parents have been called to bring him home, and why. It is the SM making the decision, not the parents, so it should be the SM who announces and explains the decision. The parent wasn't there and may not fully understand what happened. I also think that in some cases, a parent who has just been required to make an unanticipated two-hour drive (or whatever, plus the return trip) may tend to think that the SM is exaggerating and what little Johnny did couldn't have been so bad, and why did I have to drive all this way, etc., and is not necessarily the best person to be explaining things to their son at that point. Some version of this did occur in the first incident I recounted above.

[kbandit]

Our troop has sent 1 scout home last year from summer camp in Tenn. We are from Ohio. The decission was made by the adult leadership at camp.

 

Monday-visit from camp commish-talking X-rated stuff at waterfront

 

Tues-injury-wanted x-rayed at hospital- no problem - done

 

Wednesday-Camp director, 3 staff members from class - throwing open knife over his shoulder with total disregard as to anyone behind him- kicked out of class

 

Wednesday-ripped off class A (unwearable) to fight with another scout from another troop.

 

Wednesday nite adult meeting. Call mom to come and get him.

 

Scout stayed with adults until ride arrived.

 

Mom sent grandma and grandpa on Thurs to get him. He was not told until they got on-site that he was going home by scoutmaster because of what he might have done to himself or others. Mom works shift work and was unable to make to trip due to time involved.

 

Fast forward to present. As of today this scout is suspended due to stopping all the toilets up at CO (intentional). Meeting will be in Aug with CC, COR, and SM if he and his mom choose to return. We will see what happens.

kbandit

 

 

[Gunny2862]

John-in-KC,

I get it about being at BSAL and the time commitment there. I did it this year plus the BSAL Counselor/Instructor section. The Scouts did really well this year, everyone including my ten day Scout, advanced at least one rank or merit badge. Maybe I should get further out of the way more often. But that's a goal too.

 

I was in no way intending to say anything about your situation with the Scout on the range, I wasn't there and don't know the details, plus, I am confident that you handled it well.

I was simply saying that for me in regard to the range situation that it would depend on the Scout, his attitude, and what the violation was. I'm not sure that who came down to tell me would make that big a difference to me(but camps handle things differently too, the Scouter who came and told you may have been a message in itself that I am not familiar with, we usually find out things from whomever Staffer is available at the moment to tell us).

 

NJCubScouter,

I agree that whoever makes the call to send the Scout home should fill him in on the 5 W's of his new destination but depending on the situation it may then be necessary to "constrain" his activity until the parents arrive. In some cases, this is best done by delaying the talk until the parents have charge of him. Remember we are talking about any and all levels of offense that might be serious enough to send the Scout home. Not necessarily just one example you might be thinking of.

 

I prefer BrentAllens old SM's approach in his post above, if possible, rather than sending a Scout home but that will often depend on the Scout and his attitude.