Why Kids do what kids do?

[Eamonn]

In the other thread it was stated:

"I really don't think it matters what size it was or what it was intended for or if it worked. The only reason to make any type of bomb is to blow something up and cause destruction."

Having once been a kid, having a home-grown kid and having worked with kids for some time I have to respectively disagree.

Was it it really silly and dumb thing to do?

Of course it was!!

Should people go around building bombs?

Of course they shouldn't!

Why did he do it?

We don't know.

Kids do dumb and silly things because they are kids.

Why do kids throw knives?

Why do they carry frogs in their pockets?

Why are matches and lighters so fascinating?

Most of the time they do this just because they are kids.

Of course some kids do intend to cause harm and being a kid in not a good enough reason to excuse this.

As Scouters we try to "Offer young people responsible fun and adventure" I look at what we try to provide as an alternative to fun and adventure which isn't responsible.

Eamonn.

 

[evmori]

Building a bomb isn't "kid stuff". And it really makes no difference why the bomb was built. This isn't the same as carrying a frog in your pocket or playing with matches. This is a bomb. Bombs kill people. Bombs hurt innocent people.

 

If you don't see the difference then there is a bigger problem than a boy making a bomb.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[Greg Nelson]

Well, there are bombs, and then there are *bombs*.

 

Eamonn has a good point when he notes that we provide safe® adventures. Scouting will attract a larger-than-average number of adventure-seekers, and not all the boys pay as much attention to safety as they should.

 

Rewind almost 30 years - I can remember shooting off a "Polish cannon" with the other guys in my patrol. What is safe? Heck, no! Was it legal? Probably not. Did we get chewed out when finally caught using it? Yes, sir!

 

The truth is, a fair number of boys like to blow stuff up, as evidenced by the Wolf Cub I had running around at our last campout, yelling, "I want to blow stuff up!" I'm not sure how he got into his head that Cubs blow stuff up, but I digress.

 

Back to the point at hand, the issue of intent is critical. Did this teen intend to use this bomb for something more than just shooting it off? If the pipe bomb was intended to be blown up down by the lake (or maybe even in the lake), that's still not good, but not as bad as if he intended to rob a bank with it.

 

 

If it were me, I'd let the legal system play out, and take my cues from there.

 

 

[SueM]

Ah..that's what I was trying to remember..what we called them when we used to make them growing up.."Polish cannons"!! I can't tell you how many pop cans and whateverpiecesofpipe/downspout or other materials that we could fine to use to make them!! Were they dangerous??? Absolutely! Were they fun to kids? Absolutely!! As Greg N. said...kids love to blow up stuff!! And where would we really be if they didn't? There'd be no rockets to the moon, etc. Do I think kids should be making bombs?? No way!! I'd like to hear more of what the intent was with making the "pipe bomb"..if it was just to hear something go boom!!..then though the danger of it hurting them in the process is real, I'd hate to put a permanent stigma on the boy just for doing something momentarily stupid!! It's a well know scientific fact that teenage brains do not function in the same way adult brains do..especially when it comes to things of danger.

 

That said, I think the scout should also be expected to -prove- himself as being "repentent" for that deed before being before an Eagle BOR! JMO

 

Sue M.

[evmori]

Wait a minute! Is everyone saying because we made Polish Cannons when we were younger what this Scout did was OK? That logic doesn't even make sense!

 

A pipe bomb is a very dangerous device. It can explode while one is making it! And they do a large amount of destruction.

 

Who cares why it was done! The fact is it was done & the Scout was caught. There are consequences for his actions and not receiving his Eagle is one of them.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[GernBlansten]

Intent has everything to do with it.

Building and setting off a pipe bomb could either be an act of youthful indiscretion, or an act of terrorism.

Kids are fascinated by explosions. Whether it be a firecracker or an M-80, you gotta admit its pretty cool. Dangerous, but cool.

Did you ever drop some dry ice into a soda bottle filled with water and put the cap back on? Biggest boom you ever heard.

 

If the youth's intention was to harm or terrorize, then yes, he should be chucked from scouting. If it was youthful indiscretion, he should be given every chance to redeem himself.

[SueM]

Ed,

 

I can understand why you'd think that's what is being said but I know that for myself at least, that's not the intent. I think that there should be consequences for sure, but I'd also like to know first that we're getting the whole story before passing judgement, which sometimes is not the case..and also whether or not this could be a case of just being at the wrong place at the wrong time...guilt by association or just plain didn't know any better.

 

Sue M.

[Eamonn]

In this age of the 30 second sound bite, it seems to me that very often we don't get or ever find out the real story.

We are taken in by words and terms that I find to be misleading.

What the heck is "Action News?"

Why is the weather report now "The Severe Weather Storm Warning" even when there is no storms?

I was unsure of the use of the word "Felon" in the thread that started all this.

The word "Bomb" has many meanings.

Add to all of this that many judges don't have very much leeway when it comes to what to do and what sentence to pass.

A few years back OJ won a pie eating contest at the October OA weekend, the prize was a small pocket knife. He forgot to remove it from his coat, took it to school, was dumb enough to show it to someone at school and ended up being suspended for 3 days for carrying an "Deadly Weapon" It was a 3 inch pocket knife!!

I'm 100% for the zero tolerance policy that the school has in place. I wasn't happy that he was suspended, that that seems to be the going rate for that crime!! I do however object to the "Deadly Weapon"

Eamonn

[evmori]

The situation is that a young man in a neighboring community has been convicted of a felony. He and some friends were caught in possession of a pipe bomb.

 

This is from the beginning of the other thread.

 

Being convicted of a felony makes one a felon.

 

And this isn't a "Polish Cannon". It is a pipe bomb. A bomb made with a piece of metal pipe & gunpowder.

 

This is serious stuff, folks. Minimalizing it does none of us any good.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[Eamonn]

"The situation is that a young man in a neighboring community has been convicted of a felony. He and some friends were caught in possession of a pipe bomb."

A felony?

The term felony is used for very serious crimes, whereas misdemeanors are considered to be less serious offenses. It means a crime against the government. It is principally used in criminal law in the United States legal system.

In the United States, a felony is one of the highest types of offenses, and may be punishable with death or imprisonment. It is a crime punishable by one or more years of imprisonment.

I would respectfully suggest if indeed this Lad had been convicted of a felony,that he would not be around to be a Boy Scout.

Eamonn.

 

 

[FScouter]

Maybe the kid ought to be crucified. Ed, you can drive the first spike.

[OldGreyEagle]

As a loyal Kielbasa eating, Pierogie dipping, Czarnina sipping son of Krakow, I have to ask just what is a Polish Cannon in this context. It's not a term I have heard before. Now, if someone would have said Polish Rifle, I would have said Ron Jaworski and moved on.

[nldscout]

OGE,

I am glad you asked, because its been bothering me all day as to what a Polish Canon was, just didn't have the sense to ask.

[evmori]

Google Polish Cannon.

 

FScouter,

 

Now was that really a necessary comment? I don't think so.

 

At this point in time, this Scout should not be awarded his Eagle. I really don't think being convicted of a felony is living into the Scout Oath & Law. In time if this Scout is truly remorseful & toes the line then he should be given a second chance. If he is awarded his Eagle now, we have done nothing but cheapen the BSA's highest youth award.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[OldGreyEagle]

Gee, I guess I didn't wear my subtle shoes. I don't know why we have to revert to the bad old days when everyone knew anytime anything Polish was mention it was shorthand for crude, ignorant and unseemly. It's funny how with all the ethnicities in the world, the forum kept talking about Polish cannons like there was no problem with it. No one put the phrase in quotation marks and I was even directed to Google the phrase as I guess I am too Polish to know to do that myself. With all the cracks about Wood Badge for the 21rst Century, I dont understand why no one commented on Diversity and the need not to use disparaging labels. Madame Curie was born Maria Skłodowska in Warsaw, Poland. Copernicus, the Astronomer who first denied the earth as the center of the Universe was Polish and Pope John Paul II was Polish and Lech Walesa, the man who helped found Solidarność (the first independent trade union in the Soviet bloc) was Polish. We all know no one would post the N-word on the forum because it would be removed. No one would make reference to the supposed penurious nature of Jewish people, comments about what a woman can and can't do are debated with passion, but Polish Cannon is thrown about with no regard to its utterly offensive nature.

 

Yes, I am a little sensitive about this and I don't want any PMs on this topic, just knock off the Polish bashing crape