Parents on Troop Campouts

[mikecummings157]

How do other troops handle parents who are non-registered leaders attending troop campouts? It's our desire this year to get more parents involved with the program, including coming on campouts. The benefit of the extra hands and the added involvement in what their son is doing is tangible.

 

On the downside, these folks have not been background screened or trained in how BSA does things.

 

Is it as simple as briefing them ahead of time on some of the behaviors to avoid (smoking in front of the boys, one-on-one contact, not cutting their sons meat for him, etc)?

 

We've never had a problem in our troop, but I've heard of other local troops having serious issues.

 

What say you?

[Basementdweller]

Create an adult Patrol, yes the parent will appear on the duty roster, cook and wash dishes. the adults will camp as a patrol, put one of the ASM in charge of the Patrol.

 

Everyone who attends is youth protection trained.

 

We tried having the adults eating with the patrols but that didn't seem to work that well. They tended to interfere with program delivery.

 

 

 

 

[shortridge]

As was suggested in another thread, your unit can have a local requirement that all parents attending campouts must be registered leaders.

 

At the very least, if you don't want to go that far, you can require that everyone be YP trained. Anyone can take that course online without being registered, and print out a certificate of completion to show you.

 

You certainly should develop a list of do's and don'ts - no smoking in front of kids, no alcohol, etc. - just so everyone knows the rules of the road.(This message has been edited by shortridge)

[Eamonn]

I know that I might be the odd man out.

But I don't like and really don't want parents on camping trips.

I think there is a reason why we select and train leaders.

 

I'm not sure I would have made a good SM for my own kid!

I was Cubmaster for a couple of years when he was a Cub Scout and try as I might, when a group with him it were doing something that they ought not to have been doing, his name was the first that came into my head.

I felt I was at times being unfair to him and was maybe even picking on him.

Even with a large Troop, I found things worked out well with a Leadership Team of adults of about five or six.

Guys who knew what they were doing and when to do it.

Guys who could work together with no fear of anyone treading on anyones toes or upsetting anyone.

Most Scouts (Not all) Tend to act differently when their parents are around. Especially Scouts ho are new to Scouting, with parents who are also new.

It seems to me that the main reason for bringing a herd of parents is transportation.

I do have to admit that living where we do we are spoiled having so many camping areas and areas that can be used for Scouting activities close at hand. Driving to the area and dropping a son off, going home and then returning is not a big deal. Even when I had a Troop in down town London, where a lot of the parents didn't have cars or when we were traveling a long way we found ways of overcoming any obstacles.

If you need more leaders?

Have the committee form a Nominating Committee and select the right people then go about training them in both the ways of the BSA and the ways of the Troop.

If the Troop needs more support than maybe people can be selected to serve on the committee.

But having a bus load of parents tag along to camping trips (One a year might be OK!) Is my worst nightmare. I'm a Scout Leader, not a Scout Parent Leader.

I do like parents, I am one and had a couple myself. But not at camp.

Eamonn.

[kenk]

I'd agree that an untrained parent is hard on the program. They usually simply don't understand how it supposed to work. They find it very hard not to interfere. Some also tend to irritate the adult leaders since the adult leaders' attention should be on the youth, and not on wrangling the parents.

 

If the untrained/unregistered parents NEED to come to campouts - like others have said - your ultimate goal is to segregate them from the youth. The easiest way to do that is to give them some pre-trip training of the rules, put them into the adult patrol, have them do patrol duties, place the patrol well away from the youth patrols, and tell the parents that they should NOT interact with the youth patrols, and that all their interaction will be with other adults.

 

Most of the parents won't like this and actually will find it difficult and irritating.

 

By the way, first year ASMs go through the same thing. Its hard not to interfere with the youth patrols. As an ASM myself, I tend to think of myself as a more of a "lifeguard". My job is to stand off to the side, try to prevent really bad stuff from happening, and be there to jump in if it does happen. What do I mean by "bad stuff"? At one campout - at the very last minute - I managed to prevent a 1st year Scout from trying to fry an egg using a plastic plate on the Coleman stove. Sheesh!

 

BTW, the root cause of this was that he was in a new Scout patrol, the troop guide wasn't doing his job, the new Scout didn't know that a cook kit was available to him, and had he ever cooked an egg before. All we had to do was to pull the troop guide away from his friends in the Venture patrol and make sure he did some teaching.

[CA_Scouter]

I make a general proclamation that we do not permit parents to attend troop campouts.

 

I then state that if an adult would like to attend as an observer in the adult patrol, then that's ok. Emphasis on 'observer'. No interference in patrol activities permitted.

 

If you set the boundries beforehand, you tend to avoid issues at the campout.

 

 

[Eagle92]

My troop had both good and bad experiecnes with parents on campout who were not leaders

 

Good: Definitely provided drivers

Was able to add to the camp out experience. One gentleman was prior military, and we were going to an air station he

was very familiar with, being part of the teaching cadre at one of the schools there. made the tour VERY interesting.

Used as a recruting tool to get more leaders.

The yearly family campout and canoeing instruction.

 

Bad: One set of mothers refused to let their sons go on a hike in the rain, despite the scouts not only being prepared for

it, but also wanting to complete the hike after a 7 hour drive to get to it. No one was happy, and the little brothers

that tagged along as well caused over $1000 worth of water damage to the facility we were sleeping in. It took about 4

years before we tried that again.

[BrentAllen]

I don't mind having parents come along, as it is a good time to educate them about the program. First, they must be YP and Haz. Weather trained. If we are going swimming, they must be Safe Swim trained. If we are going boating, Safety Afloat.

 

Once there, the only thing I usually say to them is to stay out of the patrol areas and while you are on the trip, and Johnny isn't your son, he is a Scout in this Troop. We haven't had any problems, mainly due to the "regulars" showing the new adults what to do.

 

As SM, having new parents along gives me a great opportunity to learn more about the family and their son, from the parent's perspective. The more I know about the boys, the better job I can do.

[boomerscout]

we flat out tell them No Families-that this isn't summer vacation. only one parent may come, has to go thru some yp training, and we make them sign a statement that they cannot be in the same sub-group as their son in any activity, nor as an activity judge, that they are there as Troop Adult Volunteer.

most of the "volunteers" have sons in the New Scout Patrol (and that is probably why they worry-Jr. away from home for the first time), for which we do a couple of cabin camps first. We tell the volunteer we could really use them as kitchen help and clean-up. Most then change their minds. The ones that do come get the subtle hardsell on becoming part of troop's adult cadre

[SMT224]

Troop which required parental units to be YP, HW, SSA, & SA trained, how do you do it?

 

What with on-line BSA training for the above requiring a BSA # (as can be found on the BSA membership card), how are non-BSA registered parental units trained?

[BrentAllen]

A member number is not required to register with MyScouting or to take the training. You can register as a non-member.

 

As for our Troop, I just tell the parents they have to complete the training before they can attend. No training, no attend. We haven't had any problems getting parents to take the courses.

 

We also require all of our parents who want to be MB Counselors to go through MB Counselor training (conducted at the Troop level) and complete YP.

[AwHeck]

We do an annual 'new scout' campout shortly after most cross-overs. It's been at the same site for the past 5 years or more and the site works well for us. Most of the older scouts go up on Friday night to set up and prepare to be instructors, the new scouts don't arrive until Saturday. For this campout, we welcome the new scout parents to come along if they want. Any new parents who come are assigned to a 'new parent' patrol and they go through the same trainings that their sons' go through, but not WITH their son. Typically, we include the Tot'n chip and Firem'n chit along with how to set up our troop tents, setting up the camp stoves, basic first aid etc. This gives the parents a chance to see the troop in operation and even have a little fun 'learning' what their kids are learning. Some catch the bug and eventually sign up as ASMs and go through training, for others it gives them a level of confidence as to what goes on at a campout.

 

So far as siblings - NO! We may have one family campout during the year if the scouts plan one but that is the only time that siblings are allowed.

[Stosh]

Our parents are invited to attend any and all scout activities as observers. They can drive the boys to the event and back and observe the rest of the time. Because they are only observers they are not required any youth protection, safety afloat or safe swim training. If they wish they can go off to a hotel, stay in camp and loiter, or whatever, but because they are observing only they cannot participate in any activity except sitting around and observing. The minute they become "trainined" they feel there's an implied invitation to participate in some fashion. Why train them if the only expectation is to observe?

 

If we are canoeing they can get their own canoe and stay in the general area to observe. The only exception to this whole process is when a non-swimmer is required to have their parent in the canoe with them. They are then required, per BSA rules.

 

This has always worked well. It satisfies the parents' need to know and yet keeps them from interferring with the operations of the patrols.

 

Stosh

[Lisabob]

Mike, what is your goal in encouraging other parents to attend? You say you want to increase adult involvement, but to what end? For example, is this a troop that struggles to have enough drivers or 2-deep leadership, resulting in canceled events? Or is this more a matter of just wanting parents to have a better understanding of the program, or more bonding opportunities with their sons?

 

Depending on where you're coming from, the answer to your question might be different.

 

My son's troop has a large adult leadership contingent. Sometimes the troop has gone on events where more adults than youth attended. Often these adults are there to hover and parent. Some of them are there because they enjoy camping and seem to use the BSA as their family camping club. Others are there because they really want to be mentors to young men. And of course many are probably a combination of all of that. I don't go often. Not that I don't like camping, but it is my son's experience and I think it is important to respect his ownership of it. He and I spend plenty of time together doing lots of other things (and driving to and from scout events). Also, I have a hard time putting up with adults who spend the entire time tailing after their kid or usurping the youth leadership's roles. In the name of preserving friendships with some of these folks (who I like very much) it is probably better I don't go.

 

In my son's troop then, more adults are a) not needed and b) often a management problem. When people in troops like his start advocating for more adult involvement, it is usually because they don't understand the roles adults are supposed to play in a troop. If that describes your troop's situation, you will need a very firm SM and CC who "get it" in order to educate and enforce the roles of the additional adults. Otherwise they'll end up overwhelming your program.

 

On the other hand, there's another troop in town that has had so few adult leaders that they've frequently canceled outings due to inability to provide two-deep leadership. The SM also kept saying he wanted to step down, but there was no supporting cast of adults waiting to step up and replace him. Those folks desperately needed to get more adults signed up. I hear that the solution they chose was to tell every family that they were required to be involved in some way (whether as ASM, committee member, or just occasional parent helper/non-registered). I'm not sure what they did to over-come the helicoptering issue though, as the CC herself tends to be a very protective individual.

[BrentAllen]

jblake writes: "If we are canoeing they can get their own canoe and stay in the general area to observe. The only exception to this whole process is when a non-swimmer is required to have their parent in the canoe with them. They are then required, per BSA rules."

 

I didn't realize they had changed the G2SS. When was it changed? The online version still shows the previous text:

 

3. Swimming Ability

 

A person who has not been classified as a "swimmer" may ride as a passenger in a rowboat or motorboat with an adult swimmer, or in a canoe, raft, or sailboat with an adult who is trained as a lifeguard or a lifesaver by a recognized agency. In all other circumstances, the person must be a swimmer to participate in an activity afloat.