throwing up my hands - VENT

[asichacker]

No DYB, I don't think I was harsh at all. He was condescending, so I fed it right back. He's a big boy, he can deal with it.

 

"Surely, as a baseball coach yourself, youve encountered parents of kids who think their son is the next Manny Ortiz, but who can barely swing a bat or, conversely, parents of kids with real talent who think Johnny is wasting his time playing ball and would be better served practicing the violin because, after all, they now whats best for their boy?"

 

Absolutely! I coach only Rec league ball of 13-14 yo's. Every season I'll have good players and players who have never played organized baseball (or any baseball) before. I talk to EVERY parent as well as every player to find out what their opinion of their abilities and their goals are. But in EVERY case, I and the Parent rule, not the player, apparently not so in Scouts. I don't put a first year player at third base, and I don't put a 14 year old in the Grand Canyon with a pack.

(This message has been edited by asichacker)

[Nike]

It all comes down to trust and letting a boy not only stretch his wings and fly but fall flat on his face as well. Parents should stand by to render first aide and advice. If you aren't buying in to that, can't buy in to it, then watching a Scout troop that fully implements the boy-led method is going to be a most excruciating experience.

 

I recently asked a 13 year old Tenderfoot how he liked the leadership method of our troop vs. youth group or a sports team. He was ecstatic that the boys decided things and had to implement their plans. "The adults actually let you do stuff you want to do instead of telling you what they've decided you want to do."

 

I know that our SMs/ASMs along the way didn't doubt my son's abilities nearly as much as I thought they should, since they didn't "know him like I do." And, it was all for the best. I trusted the adults, the adults trusted the boys. Everything turned out okay.

 

[Lisabob]

It is funny that this thread came up again this weekend because I really am at a point where I want very little to do with scouting right now, I'm so fed up. The thread may be a year old but things have not changed and the same issues continually manifest themselves. Few people are willing to address the issues, and I have gotten absolutely nowhere.

 

It is a weird combination of:

1) adults doing the boys' jobs (happened yet again at this last campout, where the former SM evidently informed my SPL son that the boys who my son had authorized to build quinzees a little ways away could either tent with the troop or rip their unit #s off their sleeves and leave - these boys were trying to earn their wilderness survival MB, are among the oldest, most skilled, and most responsible kids you'd ever meet, and ended up leaving the camp out early instead of sticking around)

2) adults not stopping the true problems that are out of control (perennial trouble maker Life Scout ceaselessly talking about how he admires Hitler and about "white power," including insulting the one non-white kid in the troop all weekend long. The only adult who was willing to stand up to him was the parent of a first year scout who has never camped with the troop before. Former perennial trouble maker who aged out and is now a troop adult "leader" at age 18, causing trouble for the SPL all weekend instead of behaving as an adult ought to, and the former SM, who has always watched out for him, backing this "adult" instead of the SPL.)

 

I am really ready to encourage my son to walk away, something I rarely support and don't take lightly. This isn't the environment I had in mind for my kid when he joined boy scouting though, and I'm tired of watching it. We've tried working within the system. We've tried allowing that no troop is perfect and that any group of boys will have their moments. I certainly know that my own kid has his moments. Personally, I like a lot of these adults and appreciate their time and skills. But I'm done sitting back and making excuses for this baloney.

 

 

 

[Oak Tree]

Are you sure you don't want to move to the south? We'd welcome your son and you in our troop any time. We let our older Scouts hike ahead with no adults. Sure, this one time they got lost at night in winter on the Appalachian Trail... :-) Hmmm, maybe that doesn't sound as good as it did in my head... Anyway, they knew enough to realize they had made a wrong turn and they turned around. There is always room for debate over where exactly the right line is - but in my experience the Scouts are generally way more capable than parents and some leaders are willing to presume.

 

Sorry that you're frustrated. I'd say, let your son go and have fun (or not), and try to let go. It's a shame, because you'd be a great adult asset to the right troop.

[click23]

Lisa, Does the COR and CC know the issues that you are having with the troop? And does your troop have a UC?

[asichacker]

Wow Lisabob...

 

Scouts evoking Hitler?

 

I would have be out of that troup that day! I guess the KKK does still run some troups after all.

 

At some point, the decision is not your son's...it's your's!

[JoeBob]

Dang LisaBob,

 

That's pretty scary.

 

The most frightening thing about your situation is that it happened to you! Many of we forum lurkers have come to know you through your posts. And if a competent informed individual such as yourself can't steer a troop back onto the right trail, then we mere mortals would certainly be lost as well.

 

I'm tiptoeing along a similar path with our Cub Pack; I hate having my time wasted by leadership that likes the echo of their own voice. But my son is still having fun, so I'll take a patience pill (12 ounces of malted beverage after meetings) and suffer a little more.

 

I couldn't tolerate what you've put up with. You're a better person than I am.

 

JoeBob

[Knot Head]

Baby steps. At least you got it to 6 on 4!

 

I'm surprised you have that many adults attending. We NEVER outnumber the scouts. It's 4:1 or 5:1 for a campout depending on how many scouts + gear the cars can carry. With the trailer we can go 7:1 if all the drivers own an 8 person SUV.

 

At summer camp this year we were 4 adults for 35 scouts and things went great.

[MomToEli]

Hitler and white power? Your troop has issues far deeper than whether or not parents want to tag along. I'd say run, don't walk, as far away from that as you can and take your prized possession with you. I can't imagine any chartered organization wanting that kind of exposure, either.

 

If you are close enough to commute you can come hang out with us

[Nike]

A creepy little Neo-Nazi, a troublesome scout now an ASM, and a former SM who won't support the SPL. I would definitely pull up stakes and go. Go to your UC, CO, COR, and IH and tell them exactly what you've witnessed and that you want to see some significant changes in 30 days or you and your boy are gone. It's gone way beyond meddlesome parents.