Eating as a Troop

[CNYScouter]

Just got back from our Training weekend and I had, what seems to becoming a tradition between another staffer and myself, a discussion about the Patrol Method.

 

This time it was about Troops that cook and eat meals as a Troop.

 

He thought that in any case that a Troop that does this is not using the Patrol Method.

 

I disagreed with this as I know of a Troop that does this but I think they use the Patrol Method.

 

This Troop is large (~80 scouts).

PLC decides the menu for the whole troop.

The Troop has a Gubmaster that is in charge of buying the food for the whole Troop.

Duty roster is done by the PLC, on a patrol basis, with things like cooking assigned to a whole patrol or multiple patrols, same with other duties on Troop activities.

 

One of things the other staffer didnt like about this setup is that some patrols may not have duties to perform at every meal, but this may happen in a large patrol where not every Scout may have a job at every meal.

 

Is this tweak the Patrol Method?

 

[ajmako]

Strictly speaking, no. Even less so because of the size of the troop.

 

In my experience I have discovered that there are times, regardless of the size of the troop, when cooking and eating as a troop would be adviseable. In some troops, particularly small or brand new troops, cooking and eating as a troop is really the only practical thing to be done. So it's not always necessary to do patrol cooking.

 

As far as the Patrol Method is concerned each patrol should plan its own menu, purchase its own food, and handle the work of cooking and eating on its own. It's all part of being an independent group. What you describe is the patrol cooking process, just applied to the whole troop. I wouldn't condemn a troop for doing things this way, but I'd spend some time talking to the SM about the reasons it's done that way.

 

As far as the other staffer's objections, it sort of misses the point. The Patrol Method is about being an independent group, not about everyone having a job to perform. You're right, even in average-sized patrols it's possible that not every Scout has an irksome task or weighty responsibility for every meal. It all evens out by the end of the campout, so everyone does pretty much the same amount of work.

 

AJ

[scottteng]

Our troop vs patrol cooking seems to run in inverse relationship to the distance we are traveling for the event. If an on the road meal is needed then troop cooking and menu are indicated. Or if we are going to a scenic or touristy destination where more time is wanted for sight seeing troop cooking is used. All have their assignments. All local outings are patrol menu and patrol cook except for wilderness survival where each boy must plan bring and cook his food.

[EagleInKY]

We've done the "one patrol cooks for the troop" approach. It has its advantages in certain situations. I don't think it's best, and I think some troops may use it as an excuse to avoid the hard work of building the patrol method. If the PLC is thinking through the process and making decisions based on sound logic, then I don't have a problem with it.

[Gonzo1]

CNY,

The example you cite is the epitome of Troop Method. The PL didn't decide anything for his patrol.

 

In a troop of 80 scouts, say 8 to a patrol, that's 10 patrols, it would every other campout before each patrol did something. Each patrol should plan and do it's own menu, cooking, etc.

 

2 side notes:

1 A troop at 80 scouts could easily multiply into 2 or even 3 troops and still remain healthy.

 

2 Just wait until Kudu gets a hold of this thread, watch out!

(This message has been edited by Gonzo1)

[FScouter]

The PLC does not have the prerogative to dismantle the patrol method, regardless of how sound they think the logic may be. One reason the Scoutmaster attends PLC meetings is to help keep them on track and within the bounds of Scouting.

 

The patrol method is more difficult than the troop method. But we're not in this Scouting thing to figure out the most convenient or most efficient methodologies to go camping and feed a big group.

[SR540Beaver]

"Is this tweak the Patrol Method?"

 

No....and I don't see how it could even be mistaken for such.

 

We on rare occasion do the troop meal. Our campout two weeks from now is one of those occasions. Our troop is holding a Pin Fair for the Webelos dens in our district as a recruitment tool. The boys will be doing the teaching. We will actually go out to our local scout property on Thursday night and set up camp. That way we can hit the ground running on Friday night when the Webelos show up. Everyone is supposed to eat dinner before arriving at camp. Breakfast and lunch will be served and the event will be over before dinner on Saturday. We made it a one nighter since Sunday is Mothers Day. We'll pack up camp and haed home on Saturday evening. So in this individual case, the boys will be freed from any menu planning, shopping, meal prep or KP so they can interact with the Webelos and teach them the pins.

 

Any other time and it is there job to do......because that is what the patrol method does.

 

[Stosh]

Rule of thumb: If adults or PLC dictate, decide, direct, manage or run the patrols, then NO, it is not the Patrol Method. If adults or PLC support, encourage, assist the patrols, then YES, it is the Patrol Method.

 

Stosh

[FScouter]

"So in this individual case, the boys will be freed from any menu planning, shopping, meal prep or KP so they can ..."

 

Are you acknowledging that in this case they are departing from the patrol method?

[acco40]

Why do so many resist following the BSA program? Nobody said the patrol method was the most efficient or "best" way to plan, prepare, eat and clean-up for meals. However, it is the program.

 

Look at the following requirement:

Tenderfoot

On the campout, assist in preparing and cooking one of your patrol's meals. Tell why it is important for each patrol member to share in meal preparation and cleanup, and explain the importance of eating together.

 

Maybe we should make those leaders who like the "troop method" to go complete the above basic requirement.

 

Have you ever looked at how troops are instructed to prepare meals for the National Jamboree? Even though meals are identical, the eating method so to speak is to prepare and eat by patrols, not by troop.

 

I'll admit, on some of our outings the exception is troop preparation. This occurs for those special events when time is of the essence.

[SR540Beaver]

FScouter,

 

Ummmmm, yes.....that was exactly what I was acknowledging. We always employee the patrol method except on rare occasion like this one night recruiter. It is a one nighter due to Mothers Day which was the only weekend that would fit the calendar for May. The boys are doing the teaching and need all the time that would be taken with cooking and KP. So in this instance, Biscuits and gravy for breakfast by adults with some scout assistance will be the order of the day. Lunch was originally supposed to be sandwiches, but has recently been changed to tin foil dinners over coals to help with one of the Webelos pins. So, even though everyone will be involved in cooking, it will not be by patrol.

 

Last month was the "annual" chili cook-off between patrols and the adults too. Each patrol had to have a pot of chili, cornbread by dutch oven and dessert. We were in a state park and enlisted the services of a nearby RV'ing family to act as our impartial judges. I'm proud to say that our NSP actually won the contest.

[Beavah]

Yah, as SR540 describes, there's sometimes an occasion where it makes sense for a change of pace to fire up the Really Big Grill and just have a massive whole-troop burger fest or somesuch. No big deal, eh?

 

But for da rest, the patrols should be independent entities, dependent on the troop for... nothing. I agree that a troop of 80 doing whole-troop cooking needs to have their leaders strapped to trees and threatened with bodily harm unless they repeat "I will work to properly implement Patrol Method" a thousand times.

 

Thing is, especially in mixed-age patrols, patrol method cooking is far more fun and time efficient than trying to set up a cafeteria/restaurant to feed 80-100 people.

 

Yah, so "follow da program", eh?! Maybe we should make program materials more clear, though, if training staffers aren't quite sure how things work.

 

I suspect, though, that a big issue is having the unit pay for all the individual patrol gear. It is tough sometimes to explain/justify the patrol method in terms of its relative inefficiency with regard to duplicating gear. Kinda like having kitchens in every house in da neighborhood, instead of havin' just one industrial-sized kitchen at the end of the block. Economies of scale and all that.

 

Beavah

(This message has been edited by Beavah)

[scoutingagain]

Going back to the great ketchup debate, I'll bet that big troop buys the big 64 oz. size ketchup bottles, thereby proving beyond a reasonable doubt they use the Troop method.

 

Not that that's a bad thing once in a great while! But I agree, it should not be the norm.

 

SA

[OldGrayOwl]

My council is having a big activity soon (it involves 2 councils)

A few parents in the troop are concerned that the boys, (I like to use the word "Scouts"), won''t have enough time to enjoy themselves during the weekend event and they (the parents) want the troop committee to do the cooking for them (the boys), so they (the boys)won''t have to worry about cooking and cleaning, etc.

 

The troop uses the patrol method on all of our other activties throught the year, this event only happens every four years.

 

What do you think?

The parents are a mix of both new parents to the Scouting program and those that have been around for awhile.

[FScouter]

Have a competition to see which patrol can cook, eat, and clean up the quickest.