SPL Responsibilities

[Stosh]

Somehow I get the feeling that it is acceptable to have the SPL run the troop.

 

According to that logic the CC is responsible for running the Troop on the adult side.

 

What's the true chain of command for the boys?

[jr56]

Yes, the SPL runs the troop. The adults are there to teach him how to do it, and provide guidance while he does.

[scottteng]

Actually the PLC runs the troop the SPL runs the PLC and the JLC. Chain of command for the individual scout is first to his patrol leader and if the patrol leader is unable to handle problem it will go to the SPL who will solve it, delegate it to one of the other JLC or kick it upstairs to the adult leaders. The poor SPL cannot personally run everything in the troop. Patrol leaders run the patrols and are members of the PLC (patrol leadership council) SPL chairs the PLC and his staff is the JLC plus others that are in troop POR. In our troop JLC is only for star and above and they are their own patrol under the SPL not that there are scads of them. RHIP they more often eat with the adults and have their own camping area and perks and all hold a troop POR but are not the only ones to do so. SPL is an elective position not by rank so our current SPL is first class still working on Star and has Star and Life scouts that he is the leader of.

[Stosh]

This whole process and the accompanying lip service to the patrol method have always intrigued me. Whereas the basic tenents of scouting solidly support the patrol method, very few if any really use it anymore as it was originally intended in the beginning. The patrols are there for the troop and the SPL runs the troop and that person isn't even a patrol member. How can that logic apply and make sense to the patrol method? A non-patrol member runs the patrol method program. Please explain!

 

The chain of command in modern scouting is the reverse of what scouting was set up to be in the first place.

 

First of all a patrol was 8 members. Well what if your local town had 12 boys interested in scouting? Start another patrol. Each patrol was independent and was it's own highest authority in the program. If the boys wished to go to a common campout, they might have gone together, but not necessarily. When they camped they separated themselves to the tune of a suggested 200'. Does this dynamic even remotely suggest the "patrol-method" program of today's scouts?

 

The reason the patrol method doesn't work today is because we have no idea what it means. We have the troop-method and the "patrols" support the troop. The dynamic of Baden-Powell's ideals have been totally reversed. This is why the dynamics of scouting have been watered down and redefined in order to accommodate a program far different than what scouting was intended to do.

 

One of our districts even suggested that in order to build inter-troop espirit-de-corps, troops would be redivided into patrols of mixed boys for the competitions. Excuse me? But not to fear, when I suggested at our camporee that the boys register as patrols instead of troops, I was basically ignored. There will be a troop gateway competition and if the boys want patrol gateways, they can have them but they won't be judged.

 

Modern scouting is not patrol-method scouting, no matter how one wishes to excuse it. We promote troop-method scouting, period.

[BrentAllen]

Stosh,

I think you misunderstand the relationship between the patrols and the troop. Yes, the patrol is the most important unit, but it operates under the umbrella of the troop. Under your scenario, why would you ever have troop meetings? The boys would only meet as patrols.

 

This is from B-P himself:

"The Patrol system has a great character-training value if it is used aright. It leads each boy to see that he has some individual responsibility for the good of his Patrol. It leads each Patrol to see that is has definite responsibility for the good of the Troop. Through it the Scoutmaster is able to pass on not only his instruction but his ideas as to the moral outlook of his Scouts. Throught it the Scouts themselves gradually learn that they have considerable say in what their Troop does. It is the Patrol system that makes the Troop, and all Scouting for the matter, a real co-operative effort."

[Stosh]

This is from B-P himself:

"The Patrol system has a great character-training value if it is used aright. It leads each boy to see that he has some individual responsibility for the good of his Patrol."

 

Yes!, the primary focus for the scout is on the patrol. This is basis of what I have been saying all along. Others seem to contradict B-P at this point and say the troop is primary. When this happens I refer to it as troop method rather than patrol method.

 

"It leads each Patrol to see that is has definite responsibility for the good of the Troop."

 

Each patrol has a responsibility to other patrols which comprise the troop and at times it will be necessary to work together with those other patrols. Thus a means by which this can happen is with a supportive troop structure. If all the patrols decide on attending the local camporee, it would be rather wasteful of time and talent if all the patrols were to have their own trailer and try to line up their own rides and find their own drivers, etc. so a cooperative interpatrol council is needed to coordinate this type of activity for the patrols. Every time the boys decide what the patrol is to be doing, the patrols then decide what the troop will be doing. Democracy in action.

 

I don't have any problem with a troop structure taking on this supporting role for the patrols. The patrols, banding together, can accomplish greater things than they can do on their own.

 

"Through it the Scoutmaster is able to pass on not only his instruction but his ideas as to the moral outlook of his Scouts."

 

Unless someone does the Chinese Fire-Drill approach to patrol membership where no one knows who's buddy will be from one year to the next and the patrols are so mixed up so as to have experienced and inexperienced boys mixed together there shouldn't be a major problem. The younger boys will get more of the SM's assistance than the older boys, who have already had that opportunity and won't need to sit through it for the sixth or seventh time. They can go off and make plans more appropriate to their interest and skill level.

 

"Throught it the Scouts themselves gradually learn that they have considerable say in what their Troop does."

 

Yes, the patrols direct the troop rather than the troop dictating some program of no interest to the scouts that someone else though would be a good idea for them.

 

"It is the Patrol system that makes the Troop, and all Scouting for the matter, a real co-operative effort."

 

Absolutely!!! It's the patrol method that makes the troop, not the troop that makes the patrol method. The real cooperative effort is when those patrols come together to direct the work of the troop so as to support the patrol autonomy. This is the guarantee that the SM or SPL won't grab the reigns of some arbitrary authority and begin dictating to the patrols how they should or should not operate, thus destroying the whole patrol method process with some dictatorial mandate that the patrols must follow. Where's the democracy in that process? "I don't care what you voted as a patrol, you will be going to the camporee and that's final." No, final is when none of the boys show up from that patrol and go somewhere else and hang out for the weekend... B-P knew what he was talking about!

 

Great quote! Thanks for posting it.

 

There is nothing that says the boys always have to meet as a troop. As a matter of fact, the national honor award for a patrol requires two meetings a month of patrol along with another outing as a patrol, and if one does the math: add to that the monthly meeting of PLC planning, that leaves one week a month left over for the inter-patrol needs of a troop meeting. Otherwise, you have 1 PLC planning meeting, 3 troop meetings, 1 outdoor activity, 2 patrol meetings and 1 patrol outing per month. That means the scouts in order to do both the patrol method AND troop method have to meet twice a week to get it all in. I don't think there are that many out there ready for that much activity.

 

When patrol method is used effectively each "troop" meeting means rather than the continual mix and remix of patrol members at the whim of adult arbitration, the NBP works on advancement with the troop Instructor and Troop Guide, (i.e. map and compass), the next older patrol does a refresher on orienteering getting ready for camporee competition, the next age patrol level is out playing with a GPS, the next age patrol is working on the Orienteering MB with a qualified MB counselor, and the venture patrol is out learning how to set up the COMPASS GAME so they can lead the compass competition at the next camporee instead of some other adult leaders. Yes, a truly boy-led camporee.

 

Everyone in the troop can be together for the opening flag ceremony and then splitting up each patrol scouts end up with an age and interest appropriate activities to keep them in the program, and coming back together at the end they end up with a closing ceremony, SM minute, song and then break for the evening, everyone having a relevant experience of scouting.

 

I simply can't understand why people wouldn't think this patrol method is such a terrible thing? It's too bad B-P isn't here to explain what he thought he explained in the first place.

 

Stosh

 

[BrentAllen]

I think most of us understand exactly what B-P meant when he put together the patrol method. I think you still fail to see the relationship between the two. According to you, there really isn't any need for a troop at all. Why would the boys in your patrols even need to be part of a troop?

 

Question - when your boys join your Scouting group, do they join the troop or do they join a patrol? Who do they write the check to for their annual dues?

 

According to B-P's method, the SM would choose the patrol leader - he would not be elected by the boys. How would you feel about that?

 

As for the National Honor Patrol, those two patrol meetings take place AT A TROOP MEETING. Do you not have a Scoutmaster Handbook? It is clearly described in Chapter 5 (Troop Meetings), on pages 24, 25 and 27. The Seven-Step Troop Meeting, with Step 4 - Patrol Meetings.

 

Does your PLC decide your annual calendar? Does your PLC meet once a month to plan the troop meeting? Would you describe what happens at your troop meetings?