Should The Adult Step In or Stay Out

[Beavah]

Where was da SM, eh? Was he not at camp?

 

It would naturally be the SM's place to gently direct/redirect the ASMs. A good lesson that if the SM's not in camp, one of the ASMs should be appointed as "SM for the week" to make "final authority" decisions with adults.

 

Everyone deserves some understandin' for occasional boneheaded moves. I certainly have made my share. But there's a need for eventually recognizing boneheaded moves after the heated moment has passed, eh? Even so, I'm inclined to be forgiving of mistakes that don't form a pattern. But the SM and CC should be informed quietly as a matter of course, since they are in a position to track patterns of behavior.

 

Unit leaders or assistants who do this kind of thing regularly merit a quiet coffee with the CC and COR inviting them to serve in a different capacity.

[CA_Scouter]

Let's not mince words, eh? The adult leader acted like a major JERK and blew this situation totally out of proportion. The JASM handled it appropriately and the adult should have stayed out of the situation entirely.

 

SM needs to speak to this adult leader about his unacceptable behavior. No free pass on this one.

 

JASM should be commended on his handling of the situation and should also be told that he should use this adults tantrum as an example of exactly how NOT to behave.

 

That's my take on it...

 

 

 

 

 

 

[evmori]

CA_Scouter is right on the money. This guy is a JERK, a MORONIC JERK. If someone treated him the way he treated the JASM, who sounds like an excellent individual, he would be highly offended.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[ASM59]

Thanks again for the replies;

 

Regarding where the SM was and having him step into address these issues: The SM was the third adult at camp. He was actually there when this happened and he was the "other adult" that interfered in the second incident that I mentioned. At the time of the first incident the SM is the one who told me what happened. I told him that we (the adults) should stand back when one of the boy leaders handles a problem. If correction is required in the way the incident was handled, we need to gently correct the boy leader and instruct him how he could have better handled the situation. This type of instruction requires dialog. But simple dialog to the first adult (ASM that called him a punk) constitutes disrespect from the boy.

 

I suspected that there might be trouble because of the way 'Tom' (the so called punk) was being talked about by the other ASM. Many times on Monday and again Tuesday morning, he referred to 'Tom' as a punk and how his way of dressing was indicative of an attitude that goes to his core. I should point out that aside from wearing pants that are two sized too big and wearing his hat at about a 45 degree angle from straight, he dresses fairly normal not what I would call extreme at all. This adult just wasnt going to give him a break. I believe that he was just waiting for his chance to get on to him about something. This lunch incident was his chance.

 

ASM59

[SR540Beaver]

I realize that the "jerk" ASM's wife is the CC and that this could cause problems for the SM, but ASM's fall under the direction of the SM. This is his problem to resolve, not the committee's or the CC's. He needs to set the guy down and tell him he was wrong, he needs to apologize to the boy, never ever ever do it again......and if he does, his services will no longer be required. We are a large troop with 63 active boys. I have not counted recently, but I bet we have between 6 to 9 ASM's. Our SM trusts us and gives us lots of leeway. But he sets the tone and we follow his example and ideals. I'm responsible for the 20 new boys who crossed over. He put me in charge of it because he felt that I would get things taken care of while he concentrates on the total program. Even so, I always keep him informed of what I'm doing. He is after all, the SM. Yep, the SM needs to set this guy straight or cut him lose.

[MaScout]

(An aside...here I was, thinking how I'd done so well on cutting down on my responses, and I log on this morning to reply to a gazillion messages! ;P )

 

This person's position, coupled with the wife's position IS a tough situation to deal with, but this program is FOR and ABOUT the youth. Figure out how, but DEAL with it. NOW! I want to share 2 stories about similar situations, which may explain why I am so adamant about it.

 

1) CC wanted to attend Philmont on hike. (Wife is SA.) Youth said, "CC was potty-trained at gun point." (This is NOT a compliment!) CC has an opinion, he yells it at people right in their face, he disrespects youth leaders, and generally wants to run the program HIS way. The Scouts ultimately said, "If he goes, we don't." Now, we could have allowed him to go as an adult, but then the only youth we would have had would have been his. As SM, I had to tell him, "No thank you, we have enough adults." (Trust me, it wasn't that simple.)

 

2) An adult (not our troop) who had a history of yelling at & disrespecting youth was NOT asked to stay home. SPL told all boys at summer camp to keep all food OUT of tents & hanging in a tree due to skunks (per instructions at SPL daily meeting). Adult (who was not in camp when instructions were told) became upset because a day pack was hanging in a tree instead of stowed in tent. When Scout tried to explain, adult became enraged at the "disrespect" & grabbed the Scout around the throat & began to choke Scout. One other adult present & 3 Scouts pulled him off. He saw nothing wrong with his behavior. (It took several adults to stop the father of this Scout from taking care of the situation.) This man is NOT allowed at any Scout events, and was brought up on assault charges. The point is -- you never know when they will snap. Guard your Scouts! Before it happens! Please.

 

Ma

[SR540Beaver]

I had kind of managed to push it out of my mind, but this discussion brought it back. There is a largish troop in town that has been around for at least 40 to 45 years. In fact, many of my friends growing up earned their Eagle in this troop back in the day. The troop has their own bus and hut. Back when my son was a Webelos, we obviously were checking out troops for the boys to join. I asked about this troop and found out that after what had happened the previous year, our pack avoided recommending this troop. They had an adult who thought he was a drill sergeant and barked orders at the boys and our pack leadership determined they didn't want to steer boys in their direction. One weekend, we are at a Webelos Woods and one of our leaders points this guy out to me. Low and behold, he is my ex-wife's nephew by marriage. While it isn't scoutlike and I usually don't speak ill of others.....this guy is a blooming idiot who has a number of issues. I totally understood why they steered clear of this troop because of him. His son aged out and he has since left. The troop survived him and is now back on the list of troops to look at. A good number of Cub leaders did make it known back them about their concerns. What if anything the troop did about it, I don't know.

 

One of the bad sides of a problem adult isn't just how it affects the current boys, but also how it affects recruiting. That is one way to approach the problem adult. Ask them how they think prospective boys and their parents would react if they saw this during a visit?