CNYScouter Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 I've seen the term "Troop Method" (vs. Patrol Methid") used on the forum a few times. This kind of shoots off of doing MB's at Troop Meeings. I am seeing a good number of Troops and had a poster comment that there are many troops that are pushiing advancement (the so-called Eagle or MB mills). With these types of Troops the first method that seems to go is the patrol method. Another thing I have noticed that Troops that use the Troop method over the patrol methid are more adult-led than boy-led So to borrow from Jeff Foxworhty: You might be using the Troop Method.... .... if your prime focus of weekly troop meetings are MB's. .... if you use "virtual" patrols (creating new patrols for each activity) .... the Troop committee meets more often than the PLC. Any more? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwd-scouter Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 You might be using the Troop method if... Everyone is eating the same well-balanced, nutritous and perfectly cooked meals at campouts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eamonn Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 You might be using the Troop Method.... if none of the leaders know how to tie a square knot. You might be using the Troop Method.... If all the leaders are un-trained. You might be using the Troop Method.... if the tweaks get out of hand. You might be using the Troop Method.... when all all the Scouts bring digital voice recorders to meetings. You might be using the Troop Method.... When a Scouts says "Camp? You mean outdoors?" You might be using the Troop Method.... When PLC stands for Planned Leader Conference. You might be using the Troop Method.... When each and every Scout in the entire Troop is wearing identical merit badges on his sash. You might be using the Troop Method.... When the only leadership skill the SPL has ever learned is how to line the Scouts up outside of the mess tent. You might be using the Troop Method.... If all the adults have dish-pan hands. You might be using the Troop Method.... If everyone in the Troop thinks that a Patrol roster is some kind of bird and a dining fly is some sort of pest. You might be using the Troop Method.... When Scouts buy airline tickets to Amsterdam so they can find out about Dutch Ovens. Eamonn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scouter4321 Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 If the scoutmaster is in front of the group more than the SPL is... If the committee is afraid to give scouts a fairly simple job to do because "it needs to be accurate"... If the younger scouts in the troop are being taught by adults while the older scouts form cliques and goof around during a meeting cause they've learned it already... If a member of the PLC has to fill in for the SPL to perform the opening, and none of them willingly volunteers to do so ("I don wanna do it, you do it..." ... If new scouts who crossed over from Webelos in March and April don't know the name of their patrol or their patrol leader.... If your son has no idea what is planned for the next Troop meeting, but will find out when he gets there... If scouts individually bring poptarts for their own breakfast and cold sandwiches for their own lunch to an outing, rather than cook as patrols... You might be using the Troop method... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evmori Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 You might be using the Troop Method.... if the adults are planning everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 If the Patrol Leader is not taking a attendance and following up why a patrol member is not there and why he did not inform the Patrol Leader that he was not going to be there, You might be using the Troop Method. If the Patrol Leader is not at all PLC pushing for advancements to be taught at the troop meetings for his patrol members to advance, You might be using the Troop Method. If you do not have patrol completions, You might be using the Troop Method. If all patrols do not sing a patrol song, have a flag and a patrol yell, You might be using the Troop Method. If the Senior Patrol Leader spends more time talking to patrol members than the Patrol Leaders, You might be using the Troop Method. If the adult and scout Leadership do not eat with patrols, You might be using the Troop Method. If Patrols do not have patrol outings, You might be using the Troop Method. If every patrol does not have its own, cooking gear, rain fly, You might be using the Troop Method. KUDU where are you? I think you could add some good insight into this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
t158sm Posted February 9, 2006 Share Posted February 9, 2006 If a Scoutmasters two favorite pieces of equipment aren't his coffee cup and a comfortable chair... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theysawyoucomin' Posted February 10, 2006 Share Posted February 10, 2006 more! more!! please more!!!! This is very accurate! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNYScouter Posted February 10, 2006 Author Share Posted February 10, 2006 ...your Scout has never recieved a phone call/e-mail from his PL. ...your Scout has been given a POR and no one has told him what he needs to do in the position. ...Scouts are told to "find" their own canoe to bring to go on a canoe trip. ...the Troop has stopped doing patrol meetings at weekly Troop meetings because they were too "noisy". ...when it comes time to elect an SPL, no one wants it because its the only position in the Troop that a Scout is required to actually do something. ...adults select and plan all the camping trips then complain when it is canceled because no scout in the troop wants to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyomingi Posted February 12, 2006 Share Posted February 12, 2006 If the troop owns a tent that takes several scouts and leaders to pitch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kudu Posted February 13, 2006 Share Posted February 13, 2006 You might be using the Troop Method if: 10. Your summer camp has a central dining hall rather than Patrol cooking because it makes "Advancement" more efficient. 9. You train Scouts how to be leaders rather than how to run a Patrol. 8. Your most dynamic non-SPL leaders are ASPLs rather than Patrol Leaders. 7. At game time, the SPL lines everyone up and they count off by twos. 6. Your Patrols camp closer than 100 yards apart. 5. Friends are not concerned about being in a different Patrol from their buddies (or haven't noticed). 4. Your Patrol Leaders have never outvoted the SPL in the PLC. 3. You only have one "Troop" Quartermaster, rather than one (qualified) POR Quartermaster per Patrol. 2. You have regular "Troop" elections because allowing Patrols to replace their Patrol Leader when they want is not practical. 1. You would be offended by a Danish cartoon that suggested that the Eight Methods are not all of equal importance :-/ Kudu "The Patrol Method is not ONE method in which Scouting can be carried on. It is the ONLY method!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNYScouter Posted February 13, 2006 Author Share Posted February 13, 2006 Kudo- To expand on #1 ... if your told "your not living in the real world" when you suggest that the Eight Methods are of equal importance and should be aplied equally. The funny thing is I was told this by an ASM in my son's troop. She is a middle scool teacher with a Masters degree in Education. I'm glad she's not teaching my kids! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Proud Eagle Posted February 20, 2006 Share Posted February 20, 2006 if I have ever been at any of your troop's meetings or activities. Patrol method is, sadly, a far more esoteric and theoretical subject than any I have studied in college, at least within my experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hacimsaalk12 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 well, i would have to say that you guys remarks are about 1/4 true. i am in a mostly troop method troop ( we are really trying to change it to patrol) but, back to the subject, i think i should know what it is like. i think some of you guys need to open your eyes and experience this method sometime, instead of slamming something you dont know much about. ya know, we may not be run that well ( as you say), but we have an awesome time. it kind of reminds me of how everyone sterotypes rednecks. everyone thinks they are stupid, gross, un cultured, ect. well, guess what, i'm pretty much as redneck as you can get, adn we arent like that at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CNYScouter Posted February 22, 2006 Author Share Posted February 22, 2006 hacimsaalk12 - The point of this thread is that a Troop, no matter how fun or how well run it is, should not be using the "Troop" method. If you look at Kudo's post he ends with a quote: "The Patrol Method is not ONE method in which Scouting can be carried on. It is the ONLY method!" I've seen this attributed to both BP and his contempory Roland Phillips so I am not sure who exactly said this. One thing I can say is that this quote is right in the beginning of the Scoutmaster Hnadbook and its the first thing that is taught at SM training. The Patrol Method is one of the things that distinguishes Scouts from other youth organizations. If your Troop is not really using the Patrol Method you are not really in a Scout Troop. If you visit a troop that uses the "Patrol" Method the way the BSA intended, you can notice the difference. It is really tough to understand what you are missing if you never have experienced the Patrol Method in action. You said: i would have to say that you guys remarks are about 1/4 true Well, to let you know, I have experianced or have seen Troops do just about everything on this list. I grew up with Kudo's version of scouting obtaining Eagle in '72 or '73 at 14 or 15, just before they went to requiring 24 MB's for Eagle. I'm beginning to think that the BSA should take a relook at the program back then and reincorporate much of it. One thing I remember from back then is that even the "bad" troops, the ones with few members or didn't do much, knew how to use the patrol method and teach leadership. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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