JLT Training

[flowerchild]

My son recently took the week long JLT course. We wanted him to go because we felt he would learn skills that he can use his whole life and it would also benefit the Troop since he was the first one to attend.

 

We have a relatively small Troop. There are about 22 boys registered but only 10-12 active. It is about 6 years old and started as a boy run troop - sort of. The SM is great but sometimes forgets the boy-run part - he's getting better at it.

 

Anyway, back to my son. I was hoping that he would come back from JLT and have some great ideas to help the Troop. He was elected SPL the week before JLT so I thought the timing was good for him to use what he had learned. Well it's been 3 weeks now and nothing has changed. Apparently all those great skills that I read about the boys learning at JLT were either not taught or my son does not remember them. I find the latter hard to believe but I will admit it is possible.

 

What I guess I want to know is am I wrong in thinking that a boy should have a better sense of how to run a meeting after attending JLT? Am I expecting too much?

 

Sorry this is so long.

[dan]

Did your son, attend JLTC or the new course NYLT?

 

Either course should help your son. One thing that I did when running the course was to make sure that all of the participants new that this week long course was really a condensed version of A Month in the life of a Troop. With ideas for Troop meetings, how to run PLC meetings, etc.

 

Did your son bring a book home after the meeting? I sure hope so! If he did maybe you could get it out and look at, and start asking him questions about different things in the book, maybe it will jog his memory.

 

 

[PNScouter]

Flowerchild,

 

You are not wrong in your expectations, but you need to give it time. This leadership stuff does not happen over night even after the training course. Also, is your SM keyed into the course? Does he know what was taught? Get a copy of the course outline for him. Your SM also needs to let it happen. If he (SM) is use to taking the lead then your sons training will not be seen.

 

Good luck.

[Cutter]

I was on a NYLT staff earlier this summer and it is not too much to expect that your son should be able to run a meeting. That is covered in the course along with a lot of other leadership material. It may take awhile to implement in a troop particularly if it has a history of being adult run. I believe that adults could get a lot out of the NYLT course too. The course works well with Wood Badge and covers a lot of the same type of material. If you have been through Wood Badge for the 21st Century, the course would be very familiar. The youth staff in our course were fantastic and I highl recommend the course to the troops I work with.

[Eagle74]

Your expectations are appropriate, but give it a little time. Often, and many times depending upon the troop environment, it just takes awhile for things to click and for the newly trained boy leader to test the waters.

 

It is very helpful if the adult leadership provides the encouragement and environment for the boy leader to implement those things learned during leadership training. It is quite a satisfying thing to see them try things learned through the training and come away thinking "this leadership stuff really works." There may be a few stumbles along the way, but even those incidents will serve to build a stronger leader when taken in proper perspective.

[Lynda J]

I am always astounded when a boy go off to JLTC and the parents think they are going to come back a different person. That they will suddenly be this great leader. It isn't that simply. It is a growing process. As he gets comfortable with his new learned skills he will start using them.

Our last two boys that went to JLT didn't come instantly great leaders. In fact I had decided it had been a waste. Then suddenly we started seeing small changes in them. It simply takes time for them to start using those tools.

[mdutch]

I agree with what has been posted here. I took JLTC 2 years ago. when I came back, if you asked me (and in some cases even if you didn't ask) I would tell you that it was a waste of time. They taught us that you needed to bring pots and pans with you to go cooking. For months after I left I thought it a waste of time, the most important thing that I got out of it being meeting a DE from another council (and getting invited to go to their camporees).

 

However, over time, I slowly proved myslef wrong. I would be leading my troop and suddenly I would realize, "Oh, that is why they told us to do it this way!" I can't think of any good examples right now, but I know that with me, it took me almost a year to put the ideas that were taught into practice. Don't give up hope, eventually you will find that it was worth his time.

[flowerchild]

Thanks for all your responses. Let me say that I wasn't expecting him to leave as a boy and come back as a leader but I did expect some stories or even complaints about the way things were done. All I got was how they walked in circles around the camp to imitate a backpacking trip and that all the food, etc was at the site when they got to their 'campsite'. Or that the boys were burning ant hills by spraying bugspray and lighting it with a lighter. I was always told that aerasol were not allowed and I have to wonder where the 'leader' was when they were playing with fire. BTW they did manage to burn the side of one tent. I can say with confidence that my son was not involved with the fire incident.

 

I did ask him about receiving a book. He said it was a photocopied phamplete and he couldn't find it (typical teenager). I have contacted the council office to see if I can receive another copy for him and one for the SM.

 

Again, thanks for all your responses. I'll just have to be have more patience I guess.

[ScoutNut]

When boys get together they can come up with the dumbest things that they seem to think are just brilliant, and manage to do them no matter how closely they are watched.

 

Weather it was a JLT or NYLT course your son should be able to tell you more than that he walked in circles & burned ants. With JLT there was a good bit of "bookwork" involved & he should have brought home lots of handouts with lots of notes scribbled at the very least. JLT also had a kind of "ticket" that the boys were to work on.

 

NYLT did away with the "ticket" item & went to more hands on stuff, but he should still have brought home more than 1 pamphlet. Ask him about his patrol's "Quest for the Meaning of Leadership".

 

 

[stlscouter]

Great thread

Having done JLT and NYLT either as a Program director or SM young men do indeed do some amazing things-burn the bills off of their hats-all patrol members did this so as to be distinctive or beg to be given a good KSA rating so they could be on the staff the next year. Good boy leaders change one thing at a time to achieve their goals. in other words they start small and end big. The ultimate boy leaders practice, practice and practice.

[wadahoot]

My son went to White Stag leadership training http://www.whitestag.org/ for a week the summer he was 14, and was ready to go home the 2nd day. It was boring - lots of classroom work and stuff they have gone over and over at school and in Scouts. It's 2 years later, and he still considers it a huge waste of time. He seriously considered volunteering to be on staff to try and liven up the program and make it meaningful, but decided he didn't want to devote another 2 weeks of staff training and then volunteer 4 weeks for a program he really didn't believe in!

The really sad thing is that he's the only Scout in his 50+ Scout Troop. The adults go on and on, that he should be able to preform virtual miracles because he completed White Stag training! They expect so much from him, when he received so little.

Too bad the program stinks (at least in our area).

[Spiney Norman]

Our troop sent to boys to the new JLT course this past summer at Three Fires Council's Camp Thunderbird.

I was the lucky guy that got to pick them up after a week at camp, from their appearance it looked more like two weeks. On the drive home I tried to pry some conversation out of the boys. You know things like what did you think about the course etc. etc.

Their responses were, "it was boring" and "They taught us a lot of acronyms". Needless to say I was a bit worried.

Our esteemed SM sent the boys a questionaire asking some very specific questions about their experience and asked them to return it to him before the August PLC meeting. The SM seemed very pleased with the responses he received. Both boys felt they had learned something and that it would be usefull to them.

That being said, these are young men and one weeklong seminar is not a panacea. They still need to be shown how to put the things they've learned into action. Whether this be by the hand of an adult leader or , preferably, by an older experienced scout, it will take some time. Boys can learn just as much from failure as success. They just need the opportunity and some feedback.

 

[btphelps]

Wadahoot, I'm sorry your son had a terrible experience at White Stag in the Crossroads Council. However, you have confused the web site for "White Stag" in California with the CrossRoads Council's web site:

 

http://www.crossroadsbsa.org/FunctionsofScoutingMenu/Training/CouncilTrainingEvents/WhiteStag/tabid/139/Default.aspx

 

White Stag in Monterey, California

 

http://www.whitestag.org

 

and in the San Francisco Bay Area

 

http://www.whitestagcrew122.com

 

The Cross Roads council program currently utilizes the standardized nationally-mandated NYLT program. The White Stag programs in California utilize their own curriculum which they have developed over 50 years. There is NO classroom time and a LOT of hands-on learning.

[Eagledad]

>>Weather it was a JLT or NYLT course your son should be able to tell you more than that he walked in circles & burned ants.

[wadahoot]

Mr. Phelps, Thank you for bring to my attention the fact that the link I posted is NOT the one I thought it was. I was told (back in 2003 when my son went to White Stag) that the link was for the National program, upon which Crossroads of America Council based their program. Apparently, this isn't accurate! I tried to edit my post to show the correct link, however, we can only edit within 1 hour of posting, and 2005 has been a bit longer than an hour ago! LOL! I wish my kiddo had been able to attend one of your White Stag programs ... it sounds a LOT better than the bore-fest he attended!