2005 Jamboree

[Eamonn]

In past jamborees there has been a participant patch that is worn over the pocket on the right hand side. There has been a souvenir patch that I suppose could be worn as a temporary patch. There has also been a participant hat and neckerchief and a souvenir hat and neckerchief. You can spend last months pay check in the trading post on souvenirs if that is what you want to do.

The cost of the jamboree is $595.00. Other costs that are passed on to the participants will include travel costs. While it may not seem fair, it only makes sense that those who are coming from further away end up paying more.Some council contingents plan sight seeing tours on the way to or from the Jamboree. And some even plan these ahead unlike the contingent that Proud Eagle was part of. Last time we had a VIP tour of the Pentagon. In part thanks to one of the leaders having a sister in law that worked there. We had planned this and done the paper work months in advance. Some councils include all sorts of "Add ons" as part of the Jamboree fee. We include tee shirts, jamboree CSP that the Scouts can use for trading, equipment costs and the cost of shipping the equipment to and from the site.The training / Shake down weekend costs, troop number patches, food costs while traveling, Council office costs.

I have never attended NOAC. I think the cost is $350.00 plus the costs that the Lodge passes on to those attending. Please don't quote me but I think that our Lodge has come up with a cost of $600.00 per person. As far as I know and I could be wrong attendance at NOAC is about 7,000.

I sure as heck wouldn't want to organize an event for 7,000. But it seems that the big colleges can accommodate this number. I have never seen a break down on the costs incurred setting up AP Hill for the Jamboree. However just thinking of the services that are needed to accommodate over 40,000 is enough to scare the shorts off me. Shower houses that have to be built and then taken down. The garbage bill? The rental of the portable toilets and their upkeep. Building the Action areas and the cost of providing the equipment that they use. The list goes on.

While the expense might seem high. Our council started recruiting early enough that the cost worked out at saving a $1.00 a day. There was funding available from National and from the council. We offer the opportunity to fund raise for those who want too. Last time we have a good number of Scouts who raised over the entire cost.

Lads over 16 can apply to go on the youth staff. My son has and the cost is only $250.00. He does have to make his own travel arrangements.

I'm sorry Proud Eagle,but I don't understand what you mean by "If the Jamboree was open to as many people as could pay." There are a lot of people in this area that could pay to go to Heinz Field to watch the Steelers. But can't get a ticket. Should they be allowed to pay their money and just pile in? Of course not.

The 50 mile rule wouldn't be needed if everyone played by the rules? So maybe it is "Moronic" That an organization that is made up of members who have taken the Scout Oath and live by the Scout Law can't be trusted to do so. If they did then the staff wouldn't have to do a better job of keeping visitors out of the participant areas.

Eamonn

[Fat Old Guy]

Isn't this 50 mile rule one of Bob White's famous "artificial rules"? Shame on BSA for making artificial rules!

 

 

[acco40]

Wake up people! How many National Jamborees has the BSA held post 9-11? Answer, none! Where is the Jamboree being held? At a military base! What will be the security situation in the summer of 2005? Yellow? Orange? Red? It is anyones guess. Now days, not too many military bases allow "visitors."

 

My council will not approve tour permits within 250 miles of the Jamboree during that week. I'm paying for two boys plus myself so I'll be set back a cool $3000 plus not including new uniforms, gear, etc. But heck, I've got close to 18 months or more to prepare for it. If I can't budget about $6 a day ($2 per person) I don't qualify as "thrifty."

 

If one would like to go to the Jamboree, volunteer as staff or sign up! I admit, I'm not to keen on visitors.(This message has been edited by acco40)

[Scoutmaster253]

F.O.G. re artifical rules: You can believe what you want, but I believe that if a unit would attempt to submit a tour permit (which we all do, right?) to camp within 50 or 60 miles of AP Hill during the jamboree, it would be denied, and the unit would have to find somewhere else to camp.

I am sorry if that inconviniences a unit from Manassass or DC. The intent of the rule is to allow the 40,000 scouts from around the country, and the world, who sold a ton of popcorn to make their way to the Jamboree to have the best experience possible. Waiting in a que behind two dozen scouts who are "just visiting" is not what the contingent scouts signed up for. The lines are long enough with just the participants.

As a contingent Scoutmaster in 2001, and again in 2005, I am glad that National is making the tough decisions for the good of the jamboree experience.

 

 

[Herms]

Man, I'm looking at these prices, it's $2500 from New Mexico! In answer to the original question, I say yes, if the only way you can attend is as a guest do it!! I went as a participant in 81' (Wow, that long ago) and it was one of the best expierences of my life. I have one boy that just crossed into Boy Scouts and two that started Tigers (twins), and I am going to try to get all of them to the Jamboree in 2010! But I kind of agree with the other posts that the guests need to be "honorable" and leave the activities and the pride of the patch to the participants.

[Fat Old Guy]

SM 253, you need to read up on Bob White's philosophy about rules. He believes that all situations are covered by the Scout Law and any rules are "artificial rules." Not that I agree with him, I just find it amusing that the organization which can do no wrong in his eyes finds it necessary to make "artificial rules."

 

"I am sorry if that inconviniences a unit from Manassass or DC.. . . Waiting in a que behind two dozen scouts who are "just visiting" is not what the contingent scouts signed up for. "

 

So the local Scouts are supposed to have their summer disrupted so you and your can come into their backyard and frolic. Not very Scoutlike, if you ask me.

 

 

[Proud Eagle]

The fact that it is on a military base has little to do with the 50 mile rule. If they can't have visitors, then they can't have visitors, it doesn't matter how far from the base they are camped.

 

As to visitors being in activity areas, I agree, they need to stay out of those that are for participants only. That being said, they don't really do a very good job of indicating what activities and areas are participant only and which ones are open to anyone.

 

I still think visiting Jambo should be encouraged, not discouraged (provided that Jambo is open to visitors in the first place). Heck visitors even help recruit participants and staff for future. If I hadn't gone as a visitor in 1997 I wouldn't have decided to go as a participant in 2001.

 

However, the 50 mile rule is not a major problem. It just requires a very early start and a somewhat late night in order to make up for the extra travel time. (Also, I really wonder how well the councils actually check the distances.) I seem to remember something like a 4:00a.m. wake up the day we visited in 97 so that we could drive in and be some of the first visitors through the gate. We stayed for the show that night so I don't think we got back to our campsite until something like midnight, though I could be wrong. Also, touring is no problem during that week. Since all the participants are at AP Hill, there aren't any big crouds in DC. On the other hand, the days just before and after the Jamborree (mostly before) are totally nuts in and around DC.

[SR540Beaver]

FOG,

 

You misrepresent Bob White once again. Few if any rules need to be made within a unit if the scouts abide by the scout oath and law. BSA does make safety rules and other rules that apply to events such as no tour permits allowed within 50 miles of the Jamboree. That isn't an artificial rule, it is just a rule.

 

As far as scouts having their summer disrupted due to this rule.....most troops I know don't camp in their backyard. Our last three campouts have been anywhere between 100 to 150 miles from home and we have tons of places to camp within 20 miles. The Jamboree isn't until July of 2005. I doubt seriously that they have scheduled their campouts that far in advance. Having been to that part of the country a few times, I'm sure they have plenty of places to go that do not fall in that 50 mile radius. If they want to camp inside that radius, they can except for about 10 days in July 2005. I realize it takes away something for you to be negative and complain about, but I'm sure they can handle it with no problem.

[Eamonn]

While it is OK to disagree with someone in a respectful and proper way. How the heck can you disagree with someone who hasn't even posted in this thread?

Come om FOG,give it a rest - Please.

Eamonn

[Fat Old Guy]

Sorry Beaver Guy, I'm not buying it. If a unit doesn't need any rules to control behavior then BSA shouldn't make any rules. At least using Bob White's logic. There is no difference between a PLC saying, "you must sell popcorn" and National saying, "you can't camp here during this week."

 

Eamonn, would you like some cheese?

[dan]

 

would you like some cheese?

You must have a boat load of cheese, to go with all of the whine you have!

[SR540Beaver]

FOG,

 

You must be a valuable asset to your unit the way you continually put people's committment to the Oath and Law to the test.

[Scoutmaster253]

Visitors are welcome at the Jamboree, except for the first and last days. The vast majority of things happening at the Jamboree are open to everybody. Only the "Outback Centers" and "Activity Areas" are restricted to participant scouts. Each Region has one of each Outback and Activity areas.

BTW: Neither the contingent Scoutmasters or Jambo staffers took part in any of these activities, to avoid increasing a scout's waiting time.

All participants are issued a color coded ID Badge which serves as the entrance pass for a scout wanting to do an activity. Anyone without a card, or presenting a card from another region, would be denied entrance to an Outback or Activity area.

It might be that the 50 mile rule is no longer needed, if the ID badge worked as it was supposed to. WIthout the badges, there is nothing to stop a 'home' troop form driving to VIrginia, camping across the road from the AP hill gate, and coming into the jamboree each day to particpate as was common at past jamborees!

Luckily, mother nature helps us here. After a couple days in the heat and dust of central Virginia it became very easy to tell a visitor from a participant... the visitors were wearing their class A's in the middle of the day, and they are clean!

[Bob White]

I am hopeful that the visitor's program will be as it has been in previous years, however this is the first Jamboree since the attacks of 9-11 and the event is held on a military base. Do not assume that it will be business as usual. The jamboree is still a year away, and whether or not visitors will be allowed in is not a decision for the BSA to make. It will be determined by the security needs and concerns of the US military and no one else.

 

[Scoutmaster253]

Bob, The BSA Jamboree Newsletter #1 states that "Every day from July 27 thru Aug 1 the Jamboree will be open for visitors". The BSA says we'll have visitors, and I am sure they asked the military if it was OK.

Yes, I recognize that the military runs the joint and that the world is a lot less predictable than it was in July 2001, but let's try to not be so pessimistic, shall we?

Besides, if someone wanted to 'invade' the camp, they'd sneak in by hiding inside one of the contingent Troop's equipment trailers, not a visitor's minivan.