Horizon Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 Just got this from my Council: "All units chartering or rechartering for 2013 must be faith based, community service or commercial business based organizations." Oh boy. Our PTA dropped the charter long ago, so our Pack created a "Parents of" organization. My homeowner's community won't charter I am positive. This is going to get ugly for Packs I think. Troops probably are in a better position. More from the letter from the Council: Here in the Orange County Council, Parents of sponsored Scout units seemed to be a viable alternative in the wake of PTAs exodus as charter organizations. However, time and experience often test the validity of our decisions which happened in this case. As the boys aged and moved through the program, so did their parents, i.e. the original Parents of. Information regarding their duties, responsibilities and liabilities as the charter organization did not fully flow down to successive groups of parents. Concurrently, the Parents of model imposed personal liability as opposed to the corporate liability of a formal organization at a time when claims were increasing in frequency and expense. Hence, BSA National Council sought to eliminate Parents of as charter organizations and replace them with faith based and community service organizations. After 2 years of advocating the change, BSA set December 31, 2012 as the last day for Parents of charter partners. All units chartering or rechartering for 2013 must be faith based, community service or commercial business based organizations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle92 Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 not a lawyer, but couldn' the parent's group form a 503(b) non-profit and name themselves something else, i.e. Friends of Youth? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Engineer61 Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 Hmmm...I would think that part of the reasons that PTA/PTO's got out of being CO's is the share liability imposed by the BSA. A "Parent's of" organization would seem to be similarly exposed....since the BSA wants the CO to "share" in the liability, perhaps they realize that a "Parent's of" CO can't cover it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fred8033 Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 ... letter from the council... interesting. - "information regarding their duties, responsibilities and liabilities as the charter organization did not flow down to successive groups of parents" - As opposed to what? Most charter orgs don't know squat about their units except that they meet in the building. I think it's much less about knowledge and much more about the identity of the "parents of" group. If the "parents of" change as the membership changes, where is the separate sponsoring organization? - "personal liability" versus "corpoate liability" - IMHO, this is the big one. I remember the fear panic that IRS and courts would rule contract employees are really normal employees subject to back pay of benefits if they work for the company for a long time in the exact same manor as a normal employee. I could see BSA national fearing that judges / government would rule the units were fully owned by BSA national and BSA national had sole responsibility for those units. BSA wants other groups with deep pockets to have some skin in the game too. Sounds like a good decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basementdweller Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 this is easy Horizon....... I am sure that locally you have kiwanis, Lions, moose, Rotary, VFW, UAW, Pipefitters, steel workers, shriners, masons......How about local volunteer fire department??? or god forbid a church?????? While it is a change and your going to have to find a new CO it isn't the end of the world. The glass is still half full my friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OwntheNight Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 Very surprised to see that. just checked, our district has 12 of 31 Cub Scout units that are "Friends of" or "Parents of". Went through and counted the total for our former district, which was broken into two districts this year, 21 of 60 Cub Scout Units are "Friends/Parents of" I thought they wanted more units out there to saturate the market. Isn't that how DE's make their money? I know there are some successful "Friends" programs, and some that are very fly by night. Personally, I like having a CO I have to report to. It's good to be able to bounce ideas off my COR since he represents the church and is looking out for their interests. It also helps when I have an issue, he voluntarily plays the "bad guy" if he needs to. As our unit leader, this subject piques my interest. We were a larger unit with 60 boys about 2 yrs ago. We lost 3 dens because of an internal conflict between a DL and the former CC. Those dens went literally down the hall to a "Friends of" pack that our church lets use space, since they don't have a meeting place. Our pack has made peace with that and has made the effort to work with the other pack on scheduling space at the church. There are some other minor issues to work through, but what if they can't recharter, will they come to us and ask to merge packs, maybe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZScout5 Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 Horizon, I would like to be able to confirm this with my council. What is the title of the person whose name is on the letter from your council? The registrar, someone on the council board, the DE or ? This change would definitely impact a large number of units in our council, especially the packs as there is often one for each elementary school in a town. 8 months is not much time for the council staff to facilitate such a large number of new charter organizations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horizon Posted April 13, 2012 Author Share Posted April 13, 2012 No title, it came as part of our weekly "Scoutweek" email that I subscribe to. The full letter is here: http://www.ocbsa.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/PARENTS.pdf Our Council exposure: "At last count 136 units need to be converted from Parents of units by December 31, 2012 or approximately 5,840 youth will be without the Scouting program. " My pack, like many in my area, is multi-ethnic, multi-religious and is associated with the local school. If all of us go hunting for charter orgs, I think that some packs will collapse in size. We have city wide service organizations that MIGHT charter, but we have the challenge of the anti-gay and atheist issues that will limit a lot our choices in this area. I understand why this is happening, and I hope that it can be managed. I have less than 2 years left in Cub Scouts before I restart Boy Scouts for my kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basementdweller Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 Zscout your in a panic.....relax....... Remember National does trial things in various councils to see how they work..... Remember 3 years ago every adult scouter had to be fully trained for their position in my council....... didn't happen.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5yearscouter Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 It would be nice as IH of a Parents group chartering org, to be notified in person of this sort of policy change. Our pack has been chartered to the parents of for um about 7 of our 20 years when every other org in the area pulled out of their support. so there really isn't any other options in our area without going to local businesses, which has shown NO interest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZScout5 Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 ... Taking a deep breath. Just anticipating the number of people who will freak out if this happens. (And I would be on the front line to be asked about it so I don't like to be surprised) I also just became CC of a troop with a Friends of chartered org. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basementdweller Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 Well Z you now have the edge, You can act on it to benefit your Pack, troop or crew. Or you can see if it comes to pass in your council.... If the word comes from your council and everybody is looking, when the music stops a bunch of organizations are going to be left without a seat..... The Orange county Council page link says it is a national thing....... "Hence, BSA National Council sought to eliminate Parents of as charter organizations and replace them with faith based and community service organizations. After 2 years of advocating the change, BSA set December 31, 2012" So Z if you are a parent of org........I would start looking tonight.....Same for you horizon and 5 cubs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basementdweller Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 Just went thru our entire council by districts and we had zero chartered to Parents of....we had 4 chartered to Concern Citizens.....a bunch to PTO and PTA's...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5yearscouter Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 If no more parents of, then also no more concerned parents or parents group of, or friends of, etc.... unless an actual organization, then you can't be a chartered org. We just are in a waste land of not many choices without goin to businesses, and Fry's grocery store, Walgreens and circle K aren't likely, neither is the dentist or the tire store. churches are either LDS, and they have their own and they don't really want us, or church uninterested in chartering a pack, especially if we want to use their facilities. Guess I'll go ask the PTA, but they previously showed no interest at all. Who else to ask, eh? That would leave over 14 schools without a traditional/non-LDS pack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMHawkins Posted April 14, 2012 Share Posted April 14, 2012 I'd just write on the back of the letter that you won't be rechartering and will find another program to enroll the boys in. BSA needs you more than you need BSA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now