Advice for handling Troop split

[Tampa Turtle]

Very good and practical advice indeed.

 

Thanks, folks.

[Eagle92]

Pretty much. Besides units folding and folks moving,I know of only two cases where the youth wanted to transfer.

[GKlose]

So the troop that my oldest decided to join, some 4 years ago, had a similar issue. When we were visiting troops, I didn't know what was up, but then I pieced it together later on.

 

An entire Webelos den from a pack joins a troop. They are formed as a new scout patrol, going into summer camp, and then when fall rolls around, the troop reorganizes, and the den/patrol is split up into other patrols. The now split-up patrol members (and/or the dads) aren't too happy about it, and aren't happy they don't have any input into the annual calendar (that had been previously set up). They go off on their own monthly outing, a retreat more or less, and decide that weekend to form their own troop.

 

That's where we entered. We visit every troop in town, including this new one. We get some funny statements, like "we want our guys to stay together as a patrol all the way through" and "we're going to work on one rank per year". They showed us pictures of an outing where they had rented a ski condo and a dad was shown cooking in the kitchen. Hmmmm, Webelos III anyone? At camporee that spring, during a cooking competition, I was walking around observing. Saw this particular troop -- it surprised me that two Scouts were actually cooking, but it didn't surprise me that a dad was standing 3 feet away, watching every move.

 

My son chose the troop that this group had split off from, so I heard the story from the other side too. I will say that I don't think either side was at fault, and the SM from the old troop did say that there had been mismatched expectations and that he didn't want to get in the way of anyone wanting what they wanted. So he's been fine with the split.

 

Guy

[Tampa Turtle]

Guy,

 

That is a good explanation. We mixed up the patrols and they used to be all in one. The parents were upset. Funny thing is the boys in this patrol had fallen out with each other and become increasingly dysfunctional. They are welcome to go and hope they will be happy. My only down side is some of these boys REALLY need the freedom to show some independence.

 

Our SM had to address the PL's at the PLC this week (all of them appear to be staying) with "Some folks may leave for another Troop. Some boys want to continue in a boy-led Patrol-based Boy Scouting; others prefer a den-based approach where the adults make all the decision for the Troop. It is their decision to go off in that direction but we will continue on ours."

 

A lot of it boils down to the differing culture of the feeder packs. (We have 3 and may lose 2).

[qwazse]

This is one reason why I'm no fan of NSP's. They can easily become NSC (New Scout Cliques).

 

But, even with crossovers fed directly into existing patrols, you can experience these kinds of splits.

 

I am much more in favor of splinter groups starting their own troops rather than giving some other SM a new set of headaches. It gives the adults a chance to learn and grow and discover "no matter where you go, there you are."

[eagle90]

We endured the same problem a number of years ago. The new helicopter parents didn't like the way the troop was run. They were there a month and didn't feel they had enough input. They eventually left with about 6 families, started their own troop, and were defunct within 2 years.

 

I agree with Quazse. We do NOT use NSP's for this reason among others.

 

Sounds like your troop is doing it the right way. Wave good bye and don't let the door hit them in the a** on the way out

[Tampa Turtle]

A few old DL's takin it hard. Raised him from Tigers and are pretty disappointed on how the parents handled it. (their boys knew for weeks which explain their attitude). Frustrating when you work with the boys.

 

I do not think many parents appreciate how much time (and heart)goes into working with the boys and how attached you can get. All they see is meeting times and COH.

[Eagle92]

Yes CS leaders are the hardest to convert to Patrol Method and Boy Run. I hope I remember that in a few years.

[Tampa Turtle]

I was that way too. Takes a while. I try to patient with the DL/ASM conversions. I see why some folks say to take a break. SM training has helped a number of ASM's see the light.

[Eagledad]

>>SM training has helped a number of ASM's see the light.

[Tampa Turtle]

It is now a quasi-requirement. It elevates the discussion to if we are implementing the methods the right way from Webelos III.

[GKlose]

Since the splinter from our troop, we haven't really had many problems (in that regard). I would admit that when my son joined, I saw a load of problems too. I've tried to work within the system, and help change the troop culture. It's taken a lot of hard work, and some cooperation by like-minded adults. I've documented many of these trials and tribulations on this forum through a series of questions and comments (sometimes with a preface that said we are/have been an "adult-led, advancement-oriented troop method troop").

 

The guys that left could have done the same thing, and helped develop a troop culture that was closer aligned with their expectations.. However, I like our present vision which is closer to Patrol Method than their (still) adult-led Webelos III method.

 

As part of our recruiting and "assimilation" efforts (for lack of a better term), I now do a new parent's meeting a couple of months after crossover. Almost universally, I find that parents need to recalibrate their thinking after having spent 4+ years in the Cub program. Many are relieved that they aren't expected to participate as much (included with the statement that they can participate, if they want to, and that the steps to do that will include applications, CORI forms, youth protection training and position training).

 

We haven't yet, though, recruited an entire den, which is what happened just prior to this splinter.

 

BTW -- last year, we had a major shift in the troop -- we had a crop of new kids, and a crop of older kids (separated by the "age range" that was made up of the "splinter group"). The older kids were resistant to accepting true patrol method changes (and still are). So a new crop was coming in, they made up a new patrol, all others (minus inactives) were lumped into another patrol -- they didn't seem to care. Now, a year later, a promising leader from the newer patrol stepped forward and he is leading a patrol of new crossovers. So we're kind of running with the new Scout patrol concept. However, we're not intending to push for an automatic dispersal at a given time. I hope we're going to wait until one Scout steps forward and says "I'd like to lead a patrol" and then suggest that he try recruiting one.

 

Guy

[Tampa Turtle]

Thanks GK I too think it will all workout. I was a little sad last night having to tell boys that some friends would be leaving including a popular ASM. But in life people can come and go...

[Eagle92]

I'm spinning off. more on the challenge in the spin off thread.

[Eagledad]

This has been a good discussion. I cringe for you folks that struggle with these problems because Ive been there and done that and its not fun. It is a character developing experience that I feel almost develops too much character.

 

I think this group has it figured out. The best way to prevent large groups from struggling with different philosophies of program is to bring in like minded families. Its interesting to learn that in study of successful Fortune 500 companies, the number one common application for success of the most successful companies was a model of only hiring employees that agreed with the companys vision. In other words they didnt hire just anyone, they only hired those who believed in the same vision.

 

That is what we eventually came to doing by giving all visiting scout families long verbal explanations from the adults and SPL of the program, and a parents guide that explain in detail our troop vision, how we go about implementing that vision and details of the troop program. The parents guide basically includes much of what John-in-KCs list included. Of course there is the risk of not getting as big of New Scout group, but you dont end up with unit splitting from disagreeing philosophies.

 

I love this scouting stuff.

 

Barry