Troublesome Unit Commisioner

[UCEagle72]

This really simple, speak to the UC, or speak to his ADC or District Commissioner.

 

(This message has been edited by UCEagle72)

[Thomas54]

Some of the posters asked if we are involved with the Pack. That answer is yes. Every year we schedule an a outing for the Webelos and then go the the pack meetings a couple of times to discuss it. But while this guy was Cubmaster he played games with us. We would send over a possible date in September for a February Webelos campout and he would not respond even after emails and calls. Finally in January he would tells us they have another event scheduled for that weekend. It would then be too late for us to change the date. He played dirty tricks as a CM and now plays the same way as a UC.

 

It's easy to attack our troop-pack relationship, "you don't... reach out the pack enough, have enough den chiefs, aren't approachable enough". Well we do what we can. We have den chiefs and hold pack/troop events. The thing is the bond was broken when this guy became CM and the momentum continues to flow to the other troop. Siblings, friends or neighbors go to the other troop which just fuels the fire for more scouts to go there. Add to this that the UC is at every pack meeting with scouts from the other unit.

 

A lot of good pack-troop relations are based on a shared community as described above. Scouters, both adult and youth forge bonds in one unit that continue and extend both ways between the units.

 

I thought once this guy exited as the CM we could really focus on restoring the bond. Then I find out that he got himself UC post to the unit and is in there every chance he can get.

 

 

I'll talk to the District Commissioner. Our CO doesn't really want to get into this.

 

(This message has been edited by Thomas54)

[moosetracker]

I originally got the impression this started when he interview your troop for his son, then choose another troop, then became the UC of the Pack and was just set on his troop as the best.

 

If this started when he was the cub master, he was playing games then.. It is not an innocent conflict of interest. It shows he angled for this position for the sole purpose of what he is using it to do..

 

This information should be included into the talks you have with the District Commissioner.. This is not conflict of interest. This is deliberate sabbatoge..

[Basementdweller]

Yep, sounds like a Adult scouter who does not have the boys best interest at heart.

 

I would work to have him removed as a unit commissioner.

 

The games he played as CM gives us a little more background as to the dynamic.

 

You are correct that community is forged with shared experiences. It may take several years after getting him removed as UC to help your situation out.

 

 

Ya know you could be at the Pack meeting with boy scouts as well, join the Pack committee or be a webelos den leader.

 

I guess my point is don't be the victim. He is successful because he forces it.(This message has been edited by Basementdweller)

[infoscouter]

This situation illustrates why the BSA suggest that Unit Commissioners not have this kind of relationship with the unit.

"Please dont assign unit commissioners to their own units or chartered organizations. A commissioner needs an objective view as an arm of the district and council. Avoid potential conflicts of interest."

http://www.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/34501.pdf p.9

 

 

It was a poor call on the DC's part. I understand why the District Commissioner went for this. He's not the unit leader any more, but is familiar w/ the unit, so it looks like a good fit. But he's not in a position to be impartial, and that is a problem.

 

UC's are often assigned to all the units in a Chartered Organization, and you could suggest that as an alternative.

 

While running your communications with the pack through the Cubmaster is respectful, nothing prevents you from directly approaching Webelos leaders. If the CM were playing games, I would just forge the relationship with others who may have more open attitudes.

[moosetracker]

I would suggest a DIFFERENT UC to be working for the full Charter Org, if you did suggest that.. Not THAT UC!.. All he need do is sign up for both ignore the boy scouts and continue on as he is doing now.

[UCEagle72]

Personally, I am ALWAYS suspect when either (1) a CM tells me he wants a specific person to be their UC, or (2) a new UC indicates he will only work with a specific unit.

 

These are volunteers I pass on ...

 

[Lisabob]

Thomas, the additional details do change how this looks. But please, don't take responses (at least not mine) as "attacks" on your troop. They're not. I think we're all just responding based on a) incomplete information and b) our own experiences.

 

Anyway, what about the current CM and CC for the pack - are these reasonable people? Can you bypass this UC entirely by inviting the actual pack leadership to sit down with you and chat? Maybe if you can (re)make that tie, you can lessen the exodus of boys from the pack to the UC's favorite troop.

 

In the meantime, I also think your troop needs to look to new places to recruit. You know you can't rely on your CO's pack to supply you, so what other outlets are there?

 

Are there other packs in your area? How about requesting from your district membership chair, a list of all of last year's Webelos in your area who didn't go on to join Boy Scouts?

 

Maybe reaching out to those boys & families now will net you some new scouts. I'm no longer my district' membership chair but when I was - I was amazed at how quickly boys who didn't cross over to a troop in February were forgotten about. Some of them just needed a break, or were busy with winter basketball season, or were not quite ready (mentally/emotionally) for boy scouts and needed a summer to mature. But most of the time, after failing to cross over in early Spring, they were never contacted by anybody in the BSA again.

 

 

 

[John-in-KC]

The best recruiting tools for Boy Scout Troops reaching back to Cub Scout Packs are:

 

1) An exciting, challenging program. That may mean a Scout meeting looks a bit like organized chaos, but if the youth are truly leading, and the adults are providing mentorship, growth, and development, kids will connect with the fun!

 

2) Reach-back to the Pack by way of Den Chiefs. Putting a caring, friendly, serving face from the Troop into a Cub Den, a Scout who is telling the tale of FUN he is having in Boy Scouting, makes a tremendous difference.

 

If the other Troop is deploying Den Chiefs and you are not, they are doing the essential marketing. I agree the UC should not be the adult doing the marketing on behalf of the Troop.

 

Look at your own program with a jaundiced eye. Are you using the Aims? The Methods? Is it FUN for the youth?!?(This message has been edited by John-in-KC)

[Scoutfish]

Well, I guess it is painfully obvious that I did not understand the role of a UC.

 

I'll be honest: I don't even know if we have one for our pack.

Why?

 

WE have always had a great relationship withour sister troop and with another troop down the road,

 

I am friends witrh the leadership of several packs as well as troops. I guess we are the ones who go to RT regularly and we are also the same people who work camps, camporees, and other district events on a regular basis. I am on dirict comittee and also camp promotor for my district.

 

We have cub scouts from other units join our sister troop. Some of our boys join other co's troops. I encourage my 2nd year Webelos to shop around.

 

I suppose I should try to ster them to my CO's troop, but that's notw aht I dio. I tell the boys to find a troop that is the best fit. I say the same to parents when they sign up for cub scouts: Find the paqck that is the best fit.

 

So again, I have no clue whatsoever who our UC is, but I am guessing that as of so far...it hasn't mattered.

 

Point being, I talk directly to our sister trop's SM and a couple of the ASM's as well as their committee and secretary.

 

My two Webelos leaders also talk directly to the tgrop as well. And lkets' be honest, why have a middle guy when direct contact is quicker and gets more stuff done in less time.

 

Is this the correct way? I don't know, but it works for us.

 

My point being -Thomas54 - is that you can talk directly to the CM and/or Webelos leaders/ and or comittee. You do not need to go through or rely on a UC .

 

Agaqin, that may not be proper or correct...but it works for both us, the troop and a few other packs and troops.

 

 

 

[moosetracker]

Scoutfish the UC's job is not to direct scouts to one troop or another.. He should stay out of that unless someone asks directly for various reason, most likely because they haven't found what they are looking for in their own narrow search..

 

They are more there as an intermediate between Council/District & the Unit.. Help if the unit is about to implode over some inner turmoil as an "outside" intermediery.. Help with advise about problems by bringing to the unit differing ideas because they have seen other options though their own unit experience (which should not be the same unit they are UC for) or by seeing good ideas in other units that they have been a UC for..

[Basementdweller]

Scoutfish your not a lone here. I understand the theory to what and who they are supposed to be.

 

They represent the District/council and make sure your program is working as it should.

 

More often than not you will find them in the lobby at round table, huddled around the coffee pot chatting. they are easily identified by the woodbadge beads, 4 rows of knots on their pockets, woodbadge neckerchief, All of the doctorate and bachelors of commissioner service Patches. Yes my beloved roundtable peacocks.

 

But don't you dare interrupt their conversation with a question.

 

 

I have had one encounter with our unit commissioner, came in and tried to run a uniform inspection, many of my scouts don't own uniforms, he didn't understand why the boys weren't in uniform and embarrassed more than one, tears were shed. I asked him to leave and never ever come back. he did take instruction well.

 

I don't need or want a unit commissioner.

 

Scoutfish your lucky enough not to have one either. Or probably you do on paper and he is faking his visits.

 

 

 

[ScoutNut]

Thomas, you said this man has been using his position as UC to be a recruiter for his Troop for TWO YEARS, but that you have never in all that time talked to his District Commissioner (or even your Troop's UC) about the problem. Why?

 

This man has not been Cubmaster for TWO YEARS. Have you been working with the current CM, and Webelos den leaders, to repair (or create) a connection between your Troop and this Pack?

 

You complained that your Troop's recruiting troubles are this man's fault because he played dirty tricks, has Den Chiefs in the Pack, and is always at the Pack meetings with these Boy Scouts.

 

Yet in your old posts you state that in over FOUR years, you have only had ONE group of Webelos, from ANY area Pack, cross into your Troop. You have stated that you rarely have Den Chiefs because you do not push for Scouts to take that POR. Your reasoning is that the boys are to busy with school classes, school extracurriculars, and the 2-4 Troop events each month that are IN ADDITION to the regular Troop meetings.

 

You have also stated that you have found the issue to be one of program, more than anything else. The area (not just from that one Pack) Webelos parents want a structured, advancement oriented, adult run, Troop for their sons, which is not what they see in your Troop.

 

You also have stated that your Troop sustains their membership through transfers from other Troops, and boys new to Scouting.

 

Are the actions of this man what a good UC should be doing? - No.

 

Should you discuss his actions with your District Commissioner? - Yes.

 

Is he solely responsible for your lack of recruiting Webelos? - No.

 

If you are getting transfers, then there are boys out there that are taking a second look at your Troop's program, and deciding they like it better than where they are currently at.

 

If you are getting boys that are new to Scouting, then these boys see something in your Troop's program they like.

 

If you want to get more Webelos, then you need a bigger presence in the Cub Scout Packs. More than JUST your CO's Pack, although there too. Talk to your Scouts to see if they would be willing to cut back on some of the monthly Troop events to allow them time to take on the important POR of Den Chief. Get to know the Webelos Den Leaders, along with the Cubmasters. Make a point to visit the Cub side of Roundtable to talk to them. Ask your Scouts to reach out to the friends of their younger brothers/cousins/etc. Make sure that the Webelos parents that DO visit your Troop understand the pluses of joining your Troop.

 

In other words, talk to your DC, and then stop complaining, and start doing.

 

[Thomas54]

 

 

I spoke to the District Commissioner. He is going to switch the UC and replace him with a scouter who will serve both units.

 

Thanks

[Basementdweller]

And????????

 

 

Great news, but what did the Pack say?????

 

This isn't just going to end with him simply being reassigned as unit commisioner. He can still attend meetings with boy scouts in tow with out the position.

 

Are there any other moves from the troop too keep the Webelos interested in the troop?????