I have much to learn

[bigbovine]

I decided to bring this to a new thread because I am afraid things may get mixed up with what was being discussed there.

 

Once again thanks for everyones input. I would like to remind that I am fairly new to the Scouting scene. One thing that has been mentioned I really like/ find very informative, is the WEBELOS program. The pack my boys were in does 2 campouts a year, one Cave camping, and summer camp. That means car camping with the adults doing the work. The just stepping in CM, who was ACM last year, did much in trying to involve the older boys in more scout like activities during the outings. However there was no seperate WEBELOS campouts. My boys ended up doing several campouts with the Troop they are now in to get their requirements. I am going to try to get the new WEB 2 group to do some actual camping outside the Pack Campouts this next year.

 

As I also said, the current SM wants to step down in a year, wanting me to be his replacement. This is weighing heavily on my mind, and I am trying to get all the training I can under my belt so I can make a better decision(Although I beleive the decision will be made for me, there is nobody else even remotely interested in doing more for the Troop). I am hoping that maybe by next year there will be newer blood coming in and someone better qualified. Who knows, maybe someone in the CO might be interested to take the position for a year or two. That was the main reason for me starting this discussion.

 

I have all online training done, am registered for IOLS and Woodbadge this Fall, and I have BALLOO (I know it isn't required for BS). Is there anything else I need, not just for required training but also just info in general that would help. I love to read and have read several Scout related books and Trainig guides for Troops, Packs, and Committees. Any suggestions on books would also be appreciated.

 

The Troop we are in does one campout a month minimum, this includes Camporee. They only do a backpack trip when someone needs it for Rank. We do a semi-car camping, they seem to like it. However, another adult in the troop would like to see at least a minimum of one backpacking trip a year. Since the boys make up the calander, I realize that they will have to want this on the calander to make it a possibility. However, If I do take the SM position, I will make it a point to encourage more backpacking, and less car camping.

 

Another point of interest to me is Order Of The Arrow. The Troop neither incourages nor discourages participation in OA. After doing research on OA I now understand what it is and what they are doing. There are two reason the Troop doesn't really participate in OA:

1: Small Group of 8 boys

2: Even if offered now, the current older boys wouldn't care for it anyways

The adult mentioned earlier on backpacking was in OA as a Boy Scout and the ACM now CM mentioned earlier was in OA also. Both are very intersted in their child participating in OA and I am hoping that the CM will come my way in 2 years. I feel I need to help increase the numbers of the troop to be able to sustain the OA participation. I am already trying to get other boys in the Troop(right now my boys are looking for friends to join).

 

I know this is a lot to digest, and I am sorry if it seems scattered, but I really am trying to get all the information I can as soon as I can. If there is anything else I left out, please fill in. Please criticize where needed, I need all input no matter how useless or insignificant it may seem to you or others.

 

[moosetracker]

Don't worry, the SM position will grow on you. The only training for SM I see missing is the SM/ASM Specifics training which is not offered on-line yet..

 

Even if no one steps up for SM, I hope some people will come in that would like to help you run the troop, good ASM's are worth their weight in gold.. You need at least one other for campouts, and sometimes it would be nice if you can not attend due to other commitment, that you can depend on your ASM's to take the boys without you to the event.

[Basementdweller]

I would register this year as an ASM in the troop and get active with them this year. Make sure you camp with them and attend their meetings, I am talking all of them. You need to earn some credibility with the scouts and learn how the troop operates.

 

 

forget woodbadge...plenty of time for that later. you need to find your feet in the troop before you waste time woodbadge.

[bigbovine]

As far as ASM, That was my intentions for the current SM. I had just joined and could tell it was needed. I just had't been there long enough to know how bad it was. No ASM for 4 or 5 years. I was probably 2 years too late. From what I can see that would be rough. I have been talking to the other adults about joining as ASM's with me, but not getting any response. That is why I am trying to increase numbers.

 

As far as active with Troop and getting along with the boys, that is already happening. I attend all meetings, campouts, and committee meetings. I told my wife last year in Cub Scouts that if our boys ever decide to quit I would stay, because I love working with kids and I love camping. I have already built what relationships I can with the parents, 3 of them in all. The boys also seem to enjoy me being at the campouts and meetings. We shall see when the new wears off.

 

Which has brought me to anoher critical decision. I would love to, and have almost promised to the CM of the Pack we were in, that I would at least stay on Pack Committee and do the campouts so they would have a Trained Leader(BALLOO and Hazardous Weather).

I also have a younger son that will be Tiger age in 1 year. If you read previous thread, I am not too keen on a lot of organized activities for youngsters. However, he has seen the other three in Scouts and is dying to be one too (This guy really pulls on the Heartstrings, I am usually pretty stern).

I really feel like if I take on SM there is no way for him to join till up around WEBELOS, which suits me fine, thats how the other three have done it. Unless anyone sees a way around this situation?

[Basementdweller]

Why is there no way for him to join?????? Is the wife unavailable to be his tiger partner?

 

Do you meet at the same location and time?

 

Being on the Pack committee isn't that big a deal or a huge time commitment....far as camping goes you can schedule that around each other. I am involved with a Troop, Pack and Crew. My scheduling priority is Troop, Crew, Pack, part of the reason is how far out they schedule. The crew and troops calendars for 2011-2012 are finished. The Pack is just working on ours now.

 

 

 

 

 

[Tampa Turtle]

I would weigh your commitments to the Pack carefully. I was a Webelos leader and an ASM-newbie the same year and it was very difficult. It seemed I was camping every other weekend. However I know ASM's that are on Pack Committees but those being very active seem to burn out fast.

 

Congrats on the SM-in training. Get all the training you can. It would build up your confidence and that helps in leadership. I totally concur on needing to be seen at every campout and as many events as possible. You need to BE THERE. Boys appreciate that you take the time, regardless of your ability level, to make things possible. You get credibility. In my case it took a year but most of the older boys seem to start to accept me. I think it is that I am a regular and that some of the older Dads are dropping out (aging out, health, family, economic stress more than the program)

 

Keep up the good work!

[BrentAllen]

bigbovine,

The two books I can recommend for you are:

 

Working The Patrol Method, A Scout Leader's Guide to Youth Leadership Training

by Four Eagle Scouts

http://www.scoutleadership.com/

 

3rd Edition Scoutmaster Handbook, Vol I & Vol II

This is the 1930's - 1940's version of the SM HB. You have to search around to find copies, but it is worth it.

 

Go to Roundtable. I hope you are attending Summer Camp with the Troop this year. Figuring out all the in's and out's of Summer Camp can be a little tough, on your own. Lots of details can be missed. It is much easier to learn if someone is teaching you the ropes.

Good luck!

[Kudu]

BrentAllen writes:

 

3rd Edition Scoutmaster Handbook, Vol I & Vol II

This is the 1930's - 1940's version of the SM HB. You have to search around to find copies, but it is worth it.

 

Perhaps the most important thing you will learn from this forum is to take Brent Allen's advice on the 1,000+ page 3rd edition!

 

They are available for about $20 per volume at the following URL. To make sure you have the right edition, look for the word "Volume" in the description.

 

http://tinyurl.com/3vc7cen

 

After you get the Troop working along the lines of the third edition, you can easily build your Troop up from eight Scouts (if you can get access to the local public school) by using my recruiting presentation:

 

http://inquiry.net/adult/recruiting.htm

 

Yours at 300 feet,

 

Kudu

http://kudu.net

 

[JMHawkins]

I really feel like if I take on SM there is no way for him to join till up around WEBELOS, which suits me fine, thats how the other three have done it. Unless anyone sees a way around this situation?

 

If the Pack has good Den Leaders, there's no reason he couldn't do Wolves/Bears without a huge time investment from you. But, if it turns out that you do have to choose between investing your time in the Troop or the Pack, put the effort into the Troop.

 

Cub Scouts is great and boys have a lot of fun in the program, but ultimately it is not irreplacable. The things a well run Boy Scout Troop offers to boys though are really critical to their development and hard to find elsewhere.

[Old_OX_Eagle83]

Bovine, as I read your post Im convinced your troop is making a darn good choice! You care, you see whats right, and want to make it happen.

 

Webelo scouts camping as a den is a very good idea. Not only are there requirements to cover, they need to start getting ready for Boy Scouts. Be very mindful of the rules that apply, these young men arent Boy Scouts get. Visiting with troops, and camping with them should be encouraged. If possible, do this as a den, and go to several troops. Encourage the boys to go with a parent, outside the den. This is the best medicine for you as well, camp with the troop youre going to, with, and without, your den. Find out what troops have solid, high quality programs, and ask to visit them in the field, as well as meetings. Do your outdoor skills training, and Wood Badge, if youre comfortable (Wood Badge can wait). Read Scouting for Boys and Green Bar Bills 3rd ed Scout Masters Handbook, as well as the current one in the order.

 

OA involvement is a personal thing, although you can go as a unit, its not a unit activity. Dont worry about the OA for now, you have enough irons in the fire, just know its a quality program that is there to help.

 

/scout salute

 

Good luck, your feet are on the correct path.

 

[bigbovine]

Thank you for the input so far. As far as son in Tiger I have a few things to say.

1: I refuse to put myself into a situation I "knowingly" cannot commit properly to.

2: The wife and daughter have their time together while we do scouts, this is my 4 boys "guy time" so to say.(Except the youngest one, he still has mom time while we are gone)

3: I work a family buisiness as well as family farm, I can take off when I need to within reason (Rain and Hay don't play favorites).

4: Locations are seperate but times are same for meetings(They are 10 miles apart).

 

I just absolutely refuse to put myself in the situation I see so many people getting into. Run, Run, Run, just to keep the children involved. They run themselves to death. My wife and I have given up a lot of extra activities since the children came into our lives. We regret none of it. The time spent on scouts is not that great compared to what others spend on year round sports. And from what I have seen so far, the time and money is much better spent.

 

As far as Summer Camp is concerned, I cannot be there this year.

And I know I should know this, but what exactly is Roundtable, who is involved, and what is it's purpose? Is it similar to "Cracker Barrel" at Camporee?

 

As a side note, what is your opinion on a trip to Philmont? When I learned of the place, I thought it would be a great experience. I still do, but the cost seems steep. Is it really worth the cost and effort? Or can a Troop do something similar in the Eastern States that would be more cost effective but still challenging, such as the AT?

Once again, Thank you!

[BadenP]

 

I really enjoy the irony in this thread where an Old Ox is advising a big bovine on what scouting positions to pursue. All I can add big is to remember to Always Mooo Your Best! You and Old Ox can always chew the cud over any problems you might have.

Sorry I just couldn't resist.