Friends of Scouting and out of touch District...

[83Eagle]

Here's one that's been bugging me and after discussing with other Pack leaders they felt the same way so I thought I'd share it here.

 

The district has been asking our Pack for a FOS coordinator for some time but, well, people in the Pack aren't really clamoring to go to an offsit training session to learn how to ask the Pack for money to send in to FOS. (Shock!) So after hearing "no one is interested" from me for the Nth time the district offered to send out someone. Ok, fine. And that person was our district director.

 

Now, I've been through these several times and I know the drill. The emphasis has always been on the services Scouting provides that the Pack benefits from that aren't covered by the $15 registration fee, camp upkeep, etc etc etc. Now, you can look skeptically on that if you want but at least the emphasis was on the total organization.

 

This year, the presentation was ALL about the poor families who can't afford to be in Scouting. I mean, it was 100% guilt trip..."close your eyes and think about all the things you want your son to get from Scouting...now realize there are families out there who can't afford to do that."

 

Say what?

 

Well, let's see...

 

-If the Scout can't afford to pay the $15 annual dues, the pack covers that, no questions asked

-If the Scout can't afford a uniform, we go to the Pack's cub closet (or my own pocket)

-If the Scout can't afford activity fees, etc., we find a way to make it happen.

 

NONE of that comes from the district.

 

So that leaves us with one financial thing from the district--camperships. Which, thus far, no one in our Pack has applied for because we've just really started to take advantage of district camps.

 

Now, to top it off, the school we recruit from is the poorest in the school district. Half the boys are on free or reduced lunch.

 

So the other leaders had the same question to me that I had...Are these families now going to start coming to the district (or us) and asking where the aid is for their kids???!

 

I don't know what you all think about this, but the message didn't resonate well.

[GKlose]

Does sound rather ham-handed, I think. I can't recall where it was our DE or our SE that sent out the letter, but recently there was a letter sent out to families that specifically mentioned a $ amount (such as "it costs the council about $200 per scout to run Scouting in this council") and directly asked for that amount from every family that received the letter. The letter, I've heard, was not sent to families that had already donated.

 

In the last two years, our DE has asked us to host FoS presentations, and both years I've scheduled "parent meetings" for the presentation (rather than having the presentation during a CoH, as the DE asked). Both times, rookie presenters have been sent out. The first year, the presentation was very brief, about 5 minutes, and I told everyone else there (about 1/3 of troop families were represented) that the annual registration fee doesn't go to the local council so they must fundraise for everything the council provides (offices, scout shop, camps, etc). The meeting was over quickly.

 

This year, the rookie had been "trained" -- the council went through a training session to make sure FoS presenters all had the same message. The presentation was almost a half hour! I could see parents getting visibly antsy as the presentation went on and on. I don't think it made any difference in terms of total donations.

 

Guy

[Eamonn]

When it comes to FOS, I somehow manage to find myself in a real mess. (Because of this I no longer am willing to do FOS presentations at the unit level, but will do them at the community level.)

I like to think that I'm an honest fellow, yet when it came to these presentations it seemed that there was a big elephant in the room that just wasn't going to be mentioned. That "Elephant" was of course the payroll of the Council.

I just found that I could no longer ask families to hand over their hard earned cash to pay the salary of someone who was going to earn two or three times what they were earning. It just didn't seem right.

I didn't have this problem when it came to asking local businesses, my thinking being that they were in a better position to help pay the salaries.

All this talk about supporting camps? Just doesn't sit well with me. While of course camps do at times need updates and large amounts of cash but for the day to day running of a camp? That should come from the camp fees that of course come from the campers.

 

I'm willing to give my financial support to the Council.

I'm not silly enough to think that Councils don't need money and I'm lucky enough to be able to afford it.

There have been times when I have seen or thought I've seen mismanagement by the SE when it came to finances. When this has happened I donated items that I thought would be used for the good of the Council and not cash.

 

I'm not a great lover of the Family FOS. While I can and do see that Councils need money. I believe that SE'S and the professional staff need to be out seeking more grant money and support from the business community, not bugging families who might be having a hard time making ends meet or Scouters who are supporting the Council at the unit level. (When there are no adult leaders there are no units and when there are no units we don't have a need for Districts and Councils.)

 

If it turns out that there is a real need for finances to keep Councils afloat? I would prefer that a membership fee on top of what is paid to National be imposed and that Councils be forced to live within these means.

Maybe it's a good job that I'm not in charge of things?

Ea.

[BS-87]

If a council has a lot of "Friends", they can afford to provide more and better programming.

 

When the perception arises that the professional staff is going out and doing presentations to beg for their salary, FoS is an abomination instead of the goodwill it should be.

 

Think of it this way. Do you work for free? Does your boss work for free? The fact of the matter is you are a customer of a strong, historical national program for your son, and that program is not free to run. Unlike when you buy gas or get your carpet cleaned, you get to decide how much this program for your boy (which is far more valuable than the other two) is worth to you. Where do your heart and your wallet meet? How much would you feel comfortable paying for a program that's going to make your son a respectable man? Donate that much.

[83Eagle]

BS-87 - Then I would suggest that FOS focus on how the dues that boys pay, plus the popcorn they sell that BSA gets proceeds from, plus the camp fees they pay to go to camp, are inadquate to fund a quality program at the district level. Because as it stands, 100% of the message we got last night was "donate to help poor kids who can't afford scouting," which was not only a turnoff but, in my opinion, disingenuous because it is the Pack who provides direct financial assistance to boys in need to join our program.

[BS-87]

Your DD and possibly the professional staff in your council as a whole may be "trained" but they probably just don't know how to convey that they're people too who require a salary that's modest, but not insulting to their talent.

 

The council's outreach programs is something many parents and leaders don't understand. Council's actually hire people part-time to serve hard-to-serve groups and schools. Your community is blessed to have you as a leader and a Pack that can sustain itself, but that's because there's a history of it. In some communities, it's hard to establish that precedent, and so more drastic measures are needed to ensure every boy at least has the opportunity to be a scout.

 

The presenters should be focusing on exactly what you say. The council receives limited to no United Way support. Camping programs are often run at a loss (I know ours is at over $100,000 loss each year) even accounting for camping fees. The only reason Camping program can be offered at the price it is instead of twice as much is because our boys sell a lot of popcorn, and we have fantastic supporters, or Friends of Scouting. Without those friends who are willing to support our program, the program would become very expensive, and not every boy would be able to have the opportunity to be a scout.

[SeattlePioneer]

Hello 83Eagle,

 

 

So, how did the fundraising go with the new "message"?

 

 

If you have your own FOS coordinator next year you can control the message that is presented.

 

Personally, I'd e-mail your DD either with your post hear or with your objections to the methods used. You are doing the DD a favor by telling him how the presentation was received.

 

My reaction --- a half hour presentation is 'way too long. No harm in a little light guilt tripping, but I wouldn't make that the main theme.

 

And the Cub Scout mottor is "Do Your Best." That should be the basic FOS theme in my opinion.

[shortridge]

I've always thought the moniker "Friends of Scouting" was kind of silly.

 

There should be two primary fundraising pitches in a DE's repertoire, and they should be based on the audience.

 

The first would be a true "Friends of Scouting" presentation, to a community group, fraternal organization, corporation, past donors, well-heeled church ladies, etc. Talk about the broad benefits of Scouting, the outreach it does in low-income and disadvantaged communities, the sheer numbers of Scouts and families it serves. Hit them with that can't-we-do-more-for-these-kids communal-good-feeling softball.

 

The second would be to "Parents of Scouting," customized for B&G banquets, unit parent meetings, COHs, etc. That should emphasize how much Scouting really costs per boy, the true cost of camp, the behind-the-scenes organizational work that goes on that few people see and isn't covered by dues or popcorn.

 

Both presentations, but especially the parental one, should be as transparent as possible. The presenter should have extra copies of the council's detailed financials available upon request. They should also be able to answer questions such as "How much did we spend on the new summer camp motorboat?" and "Why do we keep forking over money to hire and train new DEs who don't last more than a year or two?" And they should talk with unit leaders beforehand to get a good idea of what the unit actually pays for, to be more sensitive to those local conditions.

 

Just my two bits. All goes back to knowing your audience.

[AKdenldr]

Here's my question.

 

Direct Marketing, in my BS council there is very little direct marketing for development. (i.e. mailing / emails for charity drives.) Is this common everywhere?

 

I can tell you that other programs my kids have been involved in use their mailing lists heavily. We also receive phone calls asking us to sponsor a kid for their camp etc.

 

I've heard somewhere that you have to ask for money 7 times on average before folks give.

 

I think hijacking an evening program out with the family (i.e. pack meeting, COH) will be received poorly regardless of content. Hijacking by strangers -- probably even more difficult.

 

-- my thoughts/questions

[AvidSM]

My council MUST get 28% of their annual budget from FOS. This money helps pay for:

 

1) The salaries of the professionals and staff - some of which work for Scoutreach and Learning for Life - programs which benefit the poor inner-city youth (there is no way that these people make three times the average wage). The percentage of these people that actually support the program at the unit level has been debated many times in this forum. For what other reason do they exist?

 

2) Council Service Center rent electricity, phone, internet, office equipment, supplies, etc.

 

It does not pay for:

 

3) Council programs - most of that money comes from the fees charged for those programs. For example, Summer Camp is listed as a program expense in the budget, but is self funded by the fees collected to attend. Wood Badge training is the same way, it's self funded.

 

4) The district's programs, camporees, Klondikes, etc, are also included in Council budget under programs, but they are also all self-funded. In fact they are even expected to make a "profit".

 

The district itself does not have an operating budget because it is run by all volunteers. All money paid to the district, for whatever reason, goes to council. Then the checks to pay for the district's expenses (event patches, Klondike ribbons, camporee activity supplies, etc) are written by council.

 

The bottom line is that FOS pays for 1) and 2) above, no matter what your presenter says. Yes, there are "out of touch", untrained, ignorant or downright dishonest presenters out there - both council professionals and volunteers. One of the problems is you can't get enough good presenters in the timeframe that council wants them done, which is all in the beginning of the year.

 

It's up to the FOS presenter to convince the parents that their sons are indirectly benefiting from the services of the professional and staff (and that they have to have an office to work in). Families must know that at least one professional, the DE, WORKS FOR THEM as a member of the district Key 3. And that the office staff SERVES THEM by processes their unit's advancement forms, activity registration forms, yearly charter, etc.

 

These families are not required to contribute to FOS because some cannot. Those that can afford it and choose not to, for whatever reason, are ultimately not paying the services that their son's are actually receiving.

 

In the end, the people who do pay (usually $165 or more) cover for those who do not. These people know that they are paying more than their fair share and without their generosity and understanding, FOS would not work.

 

 

[83Eagle]

Well, regarding our Pack providing its own FOS presenter--district communications come through me (the CM). We have a hands-off (i.e., "I don't want to be involved in anything, ever, period") CC/COR, which I've detailed elsewhere. I have zero interest in being the FOS coordinator (and it's supposed to be a committee responsibility anyway), so I turned it over to the pack "committee," who said, not interested.

 

I'm certainly not going to toss the request out to the families at large when, like any Pack, we are challenged enough with getting volunteers for our own Pack activities.

 

Seattle, we raised about $500, about 1/3 of our goal, but I already have one parent looking to reneg on her pledge after going back home and reading more about FOS. (Oh, it was only a 10 minute presentation, though she promised 5 minutes--NEVER EVER go over the time you tell people!)

 

I do believe FOS has a place, and is probably necessary as any organization needs a certain amount of "organization" to run itself. My compliant, as others', is with the messaging as presented to our particiular Pack situation.

[SeattlePioneer]

I like your pitch, AvidSM!

[Oak Tree]

I've never been a big fan of FOS either.

 

I was especially not a fan as a Cub Scout leader, where we seemed to take advantage of virtually none of the services offered by the council. Subsidize camp? Why on earth would we want to do that? I really didn't see much need for anything beyond a National registration system, and we were already paying dues that should cover that.

 

As a Boy Scout leader we use more things. We go to summer camp. We sign up for more events. We have contact with the Eagle registrar. I see there is a need for some professionals to back up the volunteers. But it does seem like a relatively large part of the professionals' time is spent raising money, and if they didn't have to do this, they wouldn't need as many professionals or as much money. That, coupled with some startling inefficiencies in the system (why aren't all tour permits done on line? The council has the only fax machine I ever make use of...aren't most of those in museums by now?) just makes me wonder about what my money is really paying for.

 

By and large, I'm a fan of people paying their own way. If it costs money to run council, why don't we charge for it? That's what the YMCA does. And then they offer half-price memberships to people below a certain income.

[JMHawkins]

Shortridge is right, Friends of Scouting ought to be targetted at community members who are not already involved in Scouting. Families who are already paying registration fees, camp fees, etc. are the wrong target. In addition to the dues we require from them, we're already asking those families to volunteer their time - we want even more of their money too? Nah, too easy for that message to go south on us. And when you're talking to the families with kids in Scouting, talking about the "real cost" can easily come off like a typical government services extortion ploy, where the Parks and Rec department, or Police and Fire service - the things taxpayers are actually willing to pay for - are first on the chopping block if budget requests aren't met. The implied message of "it really costs $200 per kid to run our summer camp and you're only paying $120" is that summer camp will go away if you don't pony up another $80, or maybe $160 to cover for your cheapskate neighbors.

 

Whether or not it's intentional, whether or not it's the result of poor training or whatever, FoS tends to come across as a very un-scoutlike activity. It really needs to be rethought.

 

[Twocubdad]

My pet peeve were the FOS presenters who would come to the pack with the pitch that contributions helped pay for summer camp for the boys. At the time I was the district day camp director and was responsible for the day camp budget. It is an absolute fact that the council didn't pay one dime toward the day camp. (Don't tell me the council paid the power bill or the salaries of the folks in the office handling registration. No they didn't. We were 100% self supporting). Fact was, the camp was a profit center for the council.

 

I made it clear with our DE that unless he wanted me to correct the error publicly, he better make sure the presenter did't try to sell FOS as supporting summer camp for the cubs.

 

AvidSM is on the right track. The bottom line is FOS goes directly to the general fund. And in most councils the general fund is mostly salaries and support for the paid staff. Program tends to be supported largely with program fees. Absolutely, there are exceptions, like maintain camps, paying rangers and professional program directors, the portion of their time DE spend on program, and folks like the council registrar who directly support the membership.

 

You can make a case that councils raise most of their money to pay people to raise money. Fire the fundraisers and you eliminate much of the need for fundraising. That's just the way it is for most non-profits. Our DE (a really great guy) spends 60% of his time raising money to pay his own salary so he can spend another 30% of his time recruiting new units and members and the other 10% on program. That's just the Faustian deal we have.

 

If you don't like it, get involved at the council level and try to make changes, or just don't contribute.