Expectations of Adult Leaders

[Beavah]

I also expect volunteer leaders to do what they said they would do when they signed up as a leader. Which is to put in the time required in the position in which they serve. And if they choose not to, just can't, or just won't, then I expect them to get out of the way and let someone who will.

 

I don't know what position Gary_Miller holds in his unit, but I found this refreshing and striking, eh? So many units I know pretty much do the "warm body" thing rather than be selective. I always laugh when I read the BSA selecting a unit leader stuff, because I think I can still count the number of times there's actually been more than one candidate in any unit I'm familiar with .

 

So I'm curious. What expectations does your unit set for adult volunteers in terms of participation, commitment, behavior, training, etc.? And how do you enforce it?

 

Beavah

 

[SeattlePioneer]

When I go looking for a leader, I look for the best person to do the job and work to persuade them to do it. If they refuse me, I go to the next best person.

 

That's the recommended BSA procedure, and often it works.

 

I try to avoid asking people to volunteer to do stuff, because the wrong person can volunteer ---- someone who can't or wont do the job.

 

So that's usually my last option. Still, that can work and it's certainly a pleasent surprise when it does. Last August I was out of candidates to lead the popcorn sale. I brought it up at our last pack committee meeting and was ready to abandon the sale when a parent unexpectedly volunteered.

 

I had my doubts that person would be able to do that fairly complexs job, but she did a fine job.

 

 

The BSA also has the ScoutParent Coordinator position, which is designed to have one committee member whose primary task is to ask each family to do at least one task for the unit each year.

 

We registered a ScoutParent Coordinator this year, and I want to see if I can get that person to do the job. She will be 1) greeting new families as they join the Cub Pack and helping them get oriented to Cub Scouts and 2) discussing with them the range of activities we need help with and signing them up to help with an activity they would either LIKE to do or are GOOD at doing.

 

Too often when things need to be done, the tendency is to look around at committee meetings and ask someone who has already done a lot to do more.

 

FAR better to get new people into the habit of volunteering to help right away! The ScoutParent Coordinator is the person who should have their finger on the names of people who haven't helped and be talking to them about the things that need to be done with which they can help.

 

All this is straight out of BSA recommended procedures. It may take a little time to get our ScoutParent Coordinator operating the way I'd like, but we are giving it a try.

[BrentAllen]

Last year I put down on paper what I expected of our ASMs. I will also point out that I don't expect anything of them that I don't do myself. Here it is:

 

Being an Assistant Scoutmaster carries a lot of responsibility at Troop 494. The Scouts see you as a leader, just like the Scoutmaster, and expect you to know your stuff. To deliver the high quality program at Troop 494, we need trained, dedicated leaders of high moral standing. These are the expectations we have for our Assistant Scoutmasters:

Follow the Scout Oath and Law at all times

Complete the following training:

Youth Protection, Hazardous Weather, Safe Swim Defense, Safety Afloat

Boy Scout Leader Fast Start, New Leader Essentials, Leader Specific Training

Introduction to Outdoor Leader Skills

Serve on the Troop Committee for one year, while supporting Troop meetings and campouts

Become proficient in the Tenderfoot thru First Class skills

Take a real interest in each Scout, get to know them personally

Treat all Scouts the same, including your own son

Maintain CPR/AED Certification

Attend at least of the Troop meetings, campouts, PLC meetings and service projects

Be active in your religious institution

Attend Merit Badge Counselor Training

Attend supplemental training courses, when possible (Wilderness First Aid, Wood Badge, etc)

 

Assistant Scoutmaster commitments are 1 year in length, from January 1 to December 31. They are renewed annually, upon approval of the Troop Committee and the Scoutmaster.

 

[evmori]

Gary makes an excellent point. The only thing I would add is if they can't or won't do what they signed up for and won't get out of the way they will be removed.

[Stosh]

I guess, like bylaws, I haven't run into a whole lot of problems with my staff and committee. The committee doesn't vote on anything, by operate by consensus, same for my program staff. We chat, work together, do what it takes to make it happen for the boys.

 

I might get bitten some day with such a cavalier approach to things, but if teamwork isn't working, someone's got a beef and there's no one there watching my back, then I'm pretty much wasting my time by sticking around.

 

Scouting is not something I have to do. My life would be a lot less hectic without it for sure. But, I have skills and desires to provide for the boys and those around me recognize this and work with me in providing for the boys. If they don't think I'm doing the job or they think someone else is going to do a better job, I'd be happy to step aside and give them a chance. So far no one has come forward with any such proposal, so I'll stay focused on the boys.

 

Your mileage may vary,

 

Stosh

[Oak Tree]

I also expect volunteer leaders to do what they said they would do when they signed up as a leader.

 

My district commissioner talks like this. The thing is, what he means is, I expect volunteers to do the job I think they need to do.

 

Many people don't think they signed up to make it a high priority to email back to the district a list of troop training records, or a quality unit form, or whatever. They signed up to lead the kids. So when our DC starts going on like that, people just roll their eyes.

 

Sure, you want volunteers to actually do their job. You especially want them to do the primary part of their job. But most volunteers, when they volunteer, are not thinking I just gave you the right to demand particular work items of me.

[Gary_Miller]

Oak Tree, the paper work is part of the job, its covered in the BSA specifics training material. And thats why there is a committee to see that these things get done.

 

Filling out and providing council information like training records, Quality Unit, adult recognition, and much more is just as important as registering for summer camp, filling advancement reports and maintaining merit badge counselor lists. Its all part of leading the youth.

[OldGreyEagle]

I expect the same level of respect and courtesy be shown to me as I show to the youth and adults

 

Yeah, I don't always have my expectations met

[Basementdweller]

Got a great fortune out of a cookie the other Day " He who expects no gratitude shall never be disappointed."

 

 

If a person volunteers, I expect them to do the job, get the training. AS OGE pointed out I expect them to treat each other and the scouts with dignity, courtesy and respect.

 

 

Don't expect me to be your sons baby sitter, shrink, disciplinarian. No it is not ok to text me at 2am, or call or stop by my home unannounced.

[SeattlePioneer]

If you look at the official BSA list of responsibilities for pretty much any position, there is usually a LOT more listed than any reasonable person is going to be able to do.

 

You might also notice that Scouting tends to load people up on a wide variety of activities people can do in addition to those duties.

 

So how to deal with that?

 

 

In my view, one element of leadership is making choices. So I look through the lengthy list of things suggested and make choices about the things I am good at doing or that I'm interested in doing. Of course I also weight the needs of the groups that I serve --- that's a part of making choices too.

 

But District Executive don't dictate to unit leaders about trivial things like Quality Unit Awards. That's an optional program and if you don't want to do it, fine.

 

And Frankly Brent Allen, your list of expectations seems unreasonably broad to me. Perhaps you can make that stick in your unit, and if so, you can ask for whatever you want. But I wonder how many good people you screen out with an extensive list of formal training like that? Perhaps you can flog people into complying with that, but personally I'm not impressed.

[Scoutfish]

"Oak Tree, the paper work is part of the job, its covered in the BSA specifics training material"

 

That may be true, but the problem is, most people sign up, THEN take training.

 

Most people do not or can not see the training until AFTER they are signed up.

 

And then, you are assuming that they were told of this to start with. And that depends on what the existing leadership explains, tels, or says to recruit new volunteer.

 

In our pack, we had people volunteer for a position, then dissapear. Of course, the didn't mind running around the community bragging on their chair position.

Have a lady take over as advancement registrar. Got her all signed up, got the web sites and passwords loaded into her computer. Didn't see her but 3 times the whole year..one of those days was 2 weeks before the end of the season and she turns in 26 items of belt loops, pins and acheivements/electives that her son "accomplished" ...even though he showd up no more than her.

Of course, she plugged them all in on packmaster becausethat was her position. Meanwhile, the advancement chair had to go and fill in everything for the rest of the boys.

 

 

Me personally, I want somebody who ia around and willing to help out. They don't have to have a 5 page list of training or years of experience to actually be able to help.

 

Of course, you all know how it is..the same handfull are the one who always show up,always work, and can be counted on.

 

20% working for the other 80%.

[BrentAllen]

Flog? That's pretty funny!

 

The truth is, I haven't ever had to twist any arms to get the ASMs to training. I send the dates of upcoming training classes out to the entire Troop, and the dads would step forward to take the classes. We have 5 fully trained ASMs, and another dad who is still an assistant Cubmaster but has taken most of training. I didn't even know 2 of these adults were taking the training until I saw them at the class.

 

As I said earlier, this is something I drew up last year - based on what our current ASMs had already completed. I had some new dads ask what was involved in becoming an ASM, so I put this together as an outline. Yep, we run a challenging program, and I expect a lot out of our Scouts and adults. As I tell our prospective parents, you want the best trained doctors for your kids, and you want the best trained teachers, so why should you settle for anything less with your Scout leaders? As a parent, you will be sending your son out into the woods under the guidance of these leaders, some times for up to a week. Do you want those adults to have the bare minimum YP training, or the full compliment? It's your choice.

 

You set the bar high, you will be surprised how many will rise to meet it. Set the bar low so anyone can meet it, and you'll never separate the cream from the milk. I said it the day we started the Troop and I continue to live by it - we are interested in quality, not quantity. It works for us.

[dkurtenbach]

I expect leaders to . . .

 

- Sign up only if they really want to help out.

- Sign up only if they are willing to have fun with Scouting. The last thing I want is a leader who treats it like work.

- Do only as much as they can reasonably do without taking time away from other important matters in their lives.

- Not feel guilty when they can't help out with a campout or activity.

- Get along and cooperate with the other leaders, despite difficult personalities.

- Conform to my rather easy-going philosophy as long as I am Scoutmaster, or volunteer to take over the job. I have a standing letter of resignation on the Committee Chair's desk, which she can accept at any time, no questions asked.

 

Dan K.

[Gary_Miller]

Beavah, "I don't know what position Gary_Miller holds in his unit, but I found this refreshing and striking, eh?"

 

I was a non Called volunteer (LDS Unit) serving on the committee in the outdoors/activities position. I say was because I was release from the committee last year even though I wanted to stay involved. My release was due to me being vocal in the other leaders getting the proper training and running the program as it was intended by BSA. There was also two other experienced scouter's (all of us have 20 or more years as scout leader) released at the same time due to the same reason. The inexperienced COR could not see the problems or agreed with the actions of the leaders, so the experienced scouter were the ones to go.

 

The new committee now is comprised of non-scouter's mostly women who have never had any experience in scouting at all, and would not have been involved if it was not for the church leaders calling them to the positions. Suffice it to say the scout units are floundering, the program is stagnate, and the scouts are suffering.

 

We are all working at district level positions now. One is the District Chairman, myself is the District Advancement chairman, and the other guy works with the district training and advancement committees.

 

This all happened because we expected leaders to ether do their the job they committed to do. And voice our feelings when things were not happening correctly.

 

The only leaders in the three Units (Troop, Team, and Crew) that attend round tables or district meetings are, the SM, TC and CC. The TC is also the other guy that helps with district training and advancement committees, he just got inducted into the Council Hall of Fame. Its a very sad situation.(This message has been edited by Gary_Miller)

[resqman]

I think Allen's list is a good goal for troop leadership. Certainly obtainable. I would say that easily half our ASMs meet all the list. The rest meet 75% of the list. I am not sure why an SM would not want his ASMs to meet this list.

 

Follow the Scout Oath and Law at all times

- That should be a given for all scouts and scouters

 

Complete the following training:

Youth Protection, Hazardous Weather, Safe Swim Defense, Safety Afloat

Boy Scout Leader Fast Start, New Leader Essentials, Leader Specific Training, Introduction to Outdoor Leader Skills

- That is the minimum to earn the SM/ASM trained patch with about 2 hours of additional online training. Should be complete in 1st year.

 

Serve on the Troop Committee for one year, while supporting Troop meetings and campouts

- Can be useful to help change the mindset from Cub Scouts to Boy Scouts or from civilian to scout. Also ensures the adult learns how the troop operates.

- Our troop bylaws have the same requirement but the SM tends to hustle outdoorsman into the ASM program and encourges less outdoor inclined towards the many necessary committee positions. Most of our ASMs do not complete their 1 yr committee time.

 

Become proficient in the Tenderfoot thru First Class skills

- IOLS starts the trail, proficiency comes with practice. If the boys see the adults practicing, it tends to draw them in to practice as well. All second yr ASM should be proficient.

 

Take a real interest in each Scout, get to know them personally

- Attending the events and it is easy to get to know the lads

- We assign 2 ASMs to advise and oversee each patrol. They sit in on patrol meetings. Easy to learn the boys interest.

 

Treat all Scouts the same, including your own son

- Our rule is you can discipline any scout but your own. Get another adult to intervene

 

Maintain CPR/AED Certification

- The mostly likely candidates to need CPR are the adults. The boys probably need to know how to perform CPR more so than the adults.

- Have the troop sponsor a CPR class once a year. Many of our adults get certified through work or during summer camp

 

Attend at least of the Troop meetings, campouts, PLC meetings and service projects

- Our SM attends PLC meetings. ASMs get there information from the weekly SPL troop announcements otherwise not an issue.

- Just at some of the scouts take a break during sports season, adults occasionally take a break due to work committments.

 

Be active in your religious institution

- A scout is reverent. Nuff said

 

Attend Merit Badge Counselor Training.

- ASMs are probably going to be counseling most of the outdoor badges. Get trained for your position

 

Attend supplemental training courses, when possible (Wilderness First Aid, Wood Badge, etc)

- Our troop pays 100% of the cost of all adult training. We have several who have taught district and council classes including Wood Badge. Troop culture promotes training so adults tend to make the time.

- If your troop is participating in High Adventure activities, at least one leader has to be WFA trained. In our troop, each year at least two adults go on a National High Adventure trip so at least one of those is going to take WFA. Over time, most of the ASMs will be WFA trained. Last year we had 3 adults complete WFA. 1 of those is planning on taking it again this year for refresher.

 

Our troop has not formalized the requirements to the extent Allen has but has developed a culture that promotes training and participation. Just as boys who attend more activties tend to advance more quickly, adults who attend more activities tend to make the time to become better trained and prepared to fullfill their roles as troop leaders.