Scouting and Eagle on Applications

[sailingpj]

The NROTC application does have a place where you mark if you were part of the BSA. They also have a place where you mark if you were an SPL, or an Eagle. However they do not have any spots for you to mark if you are part of Venturing or Sea Scouts, and there is no place for Quartermaster or Boatswain.

[VigilEagle04]

BadenP,

 

I don't know about that, and with many things, I think it is up to interpretation. I work for an international, public corporation, and it not being allowed to be taken into consideration is not something that has been said here, and I know several hiring managers who do. Our General Counsel knows about it, and has been asked specifically about it (it came up during a meeting about the hiring process) and he found no issues with it. The way he and the HR Director stated it, it was how it was taken into consideration. If you have someone going into a leadership role, or a project supervisor,or something of that nature, the Eagle Scout and Gold Award can be viewed as valid experience when it comes to those things.

 

General Comments:

 

I have the Eagle Scout on my resume, but I put it down in the "Professional Memberships" section. Right above the Virginia Society of Certified Public Accountants sits National Eagle Scout Association. Yeah, it's a stretch to call it a professional membership, but everyone who has seen it has had no problems with it being there.

[Eagle92]

Sail,

Then the app has changed. I remember when it did b/c I had just joined a Ship the summer before going to college. Grant you I only got Apprentice, apparently I never had a board of review to get Ordinary, but I was joining for fun and a challenge.

[NealOnWheels]

BadenP writes:

 

"If there are two applicants with almost the exact same qualifications, but one lists being an Eagle Scout that can not be used as a deciding factor in choosing who gets the job, ethically, professionally, or legally."

 

What would be unethical in considering an Eagle?

What would be unprofessional about considering an Eagle?

What would be illegal about considering an Eagle?

[BadenP]

Neal

Being an Eagle is not unethical, etc, but using that fact as the deciding factor in choosing one person over another is according to business ethics and hiring policies used by most companies.

[gcnphkr]

HR departments are bound by EEOC regulations. So hiring based on race, color, religion, sex, national origin (1964), age (1967), disability (1973, 1990) and genetic information (2008) is prohibited.

 

Now being an Eagle could be interpreted as implying that the scout is religious or male. The later is likely known anyway. The employer can use the knowledge of the first 11 laws as factors in the hiring decision, but is prohibited from using the 12th either for or against the candidate.

[sailingpj]

I marked the BSA and SPL boxes then explained in the noes section that the Sea Scouts are one of the programs run by the BSA. I also explained that a Boatswain is equivalent to an SPL. I even included a short description of the responsibilities of a Boatswain.

 

I was surprised not to see Quartermaster there, but I won't earn it in time for me to put it on that application anyway. Probably.

 

Board of Review for Ordinary? That is new to me, I saw that it is in the SSM, but none of the three ships I have been a part of actually do that. Nor do they do a Skipper's conference.

[silasm]

When I am hiring, having Eagle Scout on your resume will get a marginal candidate an interview. I won't ask about it in the interview, and the person hired for the position will be the most qualified; he will have to convince me that he is the best candidate for the job based on relevant skills. But when I have a stack of 10 resumes and I have to pick 3-5 to interview, there are always one or two that are on the bubble. Eagle Scout will help get you in front of my desk to present your merits.

 

Edit: "Merits". No pun intended.

 

So far, that has only led to one hire who probably would not have been interviewed otherwise. This was before I was (re-)involved in Scouting myself. That has worked out well for him, me, the company and the customer.(This message has been edited by silasm)

[VigilEagle04]

"Now being an Eagle could be interpreted as implying that the scout is religious or male."

 

True on the religious part, though since any religion is accepted by the BSA so long as their is a belief in a higher power, that could be tough. For the male thing, if the GSUSA Gold Award is held to the same esteem, there really is no argument there. This could be said for the religion aspect as well, as I am sure there are more secular groups that have something similar to the Eagle or Gold.

 

It all goes back to what I said earlier. If it is treated as experience in leadership and project management, then you're good to go. I mean, if you have two equally qualified and experienced candidates, but one is an Eagle and the other is not, the Eagle Scout has a little more experience.

[acco40]

I mean, if you have two equally qualified and experienced candidates, but one is an Eagle and the other is not, the Eagle Scout has a little more experience.

 

Um, not quite VigilEagle04. If they were equally qualified and experienced they would have the same experience.

 

If they were "about the same" and one were/is an Eagle that may imply they had more leadership experience. But possibly, one may have been the captain of his football, basketball, baseball team and an atheist (and thus not a Scout) and the other an Eagle Scout (but never a Patrol Leader or SPL - lots of Librarian, Scribe and Historian PORs). Who would you hire for a position that required leadership?

 

Bottom line, I think it would be an extremely rare case that by listing that one earned the Eagle rank would hurt one in a job application. It just may help. I encouraged both of my sons to list it on any employment application they fill out.(This message has been edited by acco40)

[VigilEagle04]

"Um, not quite VigilEagle04. If they were equally qualified and experienced they would have the same experience."

 

That was my mistake for not wording it better, as it should have said "equally qualified and experienced in all other areas" which would show that everything was on par until the Eagle. Even with the Eagle, it shows project leadership, as that must be displayed for the project itself, whether they were a Librarian/Historian/what have you. Now if the other candidate presented something else that showed leadership experience to even the playing field with the Eagle, then we're back at a tie.

 

The key is to ask about the responsibilities in those positions as well. If I know someone was in Scouting (Girl or Boy Scouts), captain of a sports team, officer in an organization like FFA, FBLA, things of that nature; it would be key to ask what was their scope of responsibility. A person being Eagle just allows me to know they were in Scouting, and to know about what they did specifically to accomplish that goal. I'm an Eagle, and I have it on my resume, but I don't have Vigil Honor for the OA, or Founders Award, or my experience as Lodge Secretary, VC, or Chief and all that I did in those roles. Nothing about me being CP/UE chairman and coordinating with all of the chapter chiefs to insure all troops in the Council were visited by our teams, elections or not. There is nothing about me being a Conclave Vice-Chief and running a program area for a statewide event. Nothing about my time as ASPL or SPL, or planning a district camporee as a Scout when it was my unit on the rotation for hosting.

 

Like many things on a resume, the Eagle Scout being mentioned is mainly just a jumping off point for more questions, at least from what I've seen in interviews, whether the interviewer, candidate, or just an observer.

[The Blancmange]

I don't understand the assertion by some on this thread that membership in, leadership with, or awards from an organization that may or may not have some religious affiliation are somehow criteria that cannot legally be considered in the hiring process. As others alluded to, Eagle is a rank which indicates that the person has demonstrated certain leadership skills, among other criteria. Leadership is certainly a criteria that employers may consider. I doubt there are many who would hire an Eagle Scout because of the underlying religious message of the organization that awarded it.

 

If the assertion that consideration of Eagle Scout status is, on its face, illegal is true, then a degree from Notre Dame, Duke, or BYU should be worthless in the job market (please, no sarcastic comments from non-Irish fans). The granting of a degree from an instution operated by a religious order certainly carries with it more of a religious connotation than an award from an organization that has a non-sectarian religious policy.

 

I submit that this assertion is simply wrong.

 

[harley97]

Listing Eagle Scout has helped in both my careers. I was hired as a city Police Officer because of it and I am currently in the Coast Guard. Eagles join the USCG as an E3.

[RememberSchiff]

'Eagle scouts join (pick a service) as E-3'.

 

Maybe. My understanding is an Eagle scout is eligible for E-2 or E-3 upon successful completion of boot camp and recommendation. No guarantee. It would be interesting to see if this is writing in an enlistment contract.

 

Also, why in 2010 is there still no mention of Venturing awards? I would think the Ranger Award and Silver Award would have value as well to the military. Maybe our Irving boys can contact the Secretary of Defense, an Eagle Scout himself.

 

My $0.02

[sailingpj]

Quartermaster is supposed to also get E-2 or E-3.