Attendance at the Jambo - Entitlement OR Honor and Privilege?

[fotoscout]

We went to the Jambo with 5 contingent troops. A very good turnout for our council. But many of the scouts who came lacked the skills, maturity, and initiative to function in the patrol environment that is so much a part of the Jamboree experience.

 

We had kids with issues, kids that were simply too young, and kids that actively avoided doing any work in the campsite. As I'm sure you all know, this results in more work for the kids who have the ability to get the job done. The bottom line is that we had more than one boy have his Jambo experience ruined because his patrol was totally dysfunctional.

 

So the question is...... Is it right to screen jambo participants? Should we leave the boys with issues at home? Should we impose our own age restriction for attending the Jamboree?

 

Is attendance at the Jamboree an Entitlement (Mommy pays and sonny goes), or is it an Honor and Privilege (only selected youth get to go)

[Eagle92]

Having been placed in a dysfunctional patrol for a special weeklong event (the old Brownsea 22 training coutrse), I know it can "challenging." Don't wish that on anyone.

 

One thing I liked about my trip to Canada as that we met 2 or more times to for training and working together. our patrols were not assigned to us until just prior to the trip, and was based upon pairing up those who knew their stuff with those who needed help. We had no problems, as everyone worked together as we were literally in the middle of no where.

 

I can't answer your question, but I can suggest that more training as a patrol occur. In my council it appearwed thatthe jambo troops met once or twice, and seemed last minute.

[Buffalo Skipper]

Our troop sent two 13 year olds to the Jamboree; one First Class, one Life, each in a different Contingent troop. They were among the youngest in our 3 contingent troops (though I know of at least one who was 12). I am very intersted to hear how each preformed, from the contingent SM and ASMs, with whom I am acquainted.

 

I attended the '81 NJ and I appreciate the necessity for skills and patrol unity, as I was a PL. I am fairly confident in our Life, but have reservations about our FC. If his experience was not good, I would not be surprised if he droped out of the troop, which would be unfortunate.

 

They return Saturday.

[ParkMan]

Since they only happen every four years, that means most boys will only get one shot. I that case, I'd be inclined to not screen them. Sometimes going on a journey is more important than being completely prepared for it.

 

Instead, I'd focus on preparation for those who do attend. Perhaps even holding out the possibility that you'll scrub those who do not demonstrate they are up to it.

 

This discussion reminds me of an experience from my youth.

When I was a boy scout I took JLT as a very young age. I was an aggressive scout and my SM thought I was up for it. However, it rained all week and I had to pull my weight with a bunch of scouts I didn't know who were all a year (if not 2 or 3) older than I was. I clearly was not ready for it and had a miserable experience.

 

 

 

[RememberSchiff]

YES, it should be a privilege!

 

You may be surprised at how many experienced scouts decide not to attend Philmont, Jambo, even NYLT out of concern that their expensive, week+ trip would be "ruined" by those not ready or interested in the adventure. Councils seem more interested in filling slots than in screening applicants.

 

My $0.02,

 

[SR540Beaver]

I just got back from Jambo late yesterday afternoon. Our contingent had three troops. I was 1st ASM for one and my 17.5 year old son was SPL for another. The truth of the matter is that if you cough up the cash, you can go. That being said, we had one kid literally have a mental meltdown at a Jambo troop meeting back in 2005 and he was out. This year we had a kid who was over 300 lbs and was 5'6" who did not lose the weight he needed to over the 18 months from when he signed up and he got cut.

 

My experience is that Jambo troops are just like our troops back home. They are a microcosm of society. Every troop has the over achiever, the slacker, the kind, the bully, etc. My son made an observation to me last week during Jambo that I pretty much agree with. National should change the minimum age from 12 to 14.....and he went as a 12 year old in 2005. Speaking to our subcamp medical facility staff who came from our council, they told me that the majority of the minor cases they see are the 12 and 13 year olds. Many of them were just unprepared for something of the magnitude of Jambo and were looking for a mommy figure to tell them that things would be OK. One kid was coming in up to 5 times a day.

 

The best you can do is have mature senior leadership and experienced adult leadership and help guide the boys thru the experience in as organized of a fashion as possible. More than once we referred to our job as herding cats.

[qwazse]

"... ruined because his patrol was totally dysfunctional."

 

I had an 17 y.o. boy complain about his "dysfunctional" family once. I replied "Have you ever gone a day in your life without food in the fridge? Then your family functioned."*

 

Granted, you should screen patrols and shake them down as much as possible before the event. But, forming a patrol with other kids in your council is part of the experience. And the Jambo experience with a troop of young boys will be much different than one with old pro's. But, unless they completely missed the arena shows, I would not call it "ruined".

 

Keep the minimum age for Jambo as is. If you want a 14+ year-old experience, promote a High Adventure Base or Venturing Area gatherings. Although I've known some 16 y.o. slackers that could bring a troop/crew to a grinding halt, the difference in maturity does make things run more smoothly. But, the only problem with such events: younger scouts miss out.

 

*P.S. - I reserve "dysfunctional" for truly life threatening/demeaning situations.

[jhankins]

You pay for the privilege, do you not?

 

It depends on the boy and his maturity level. At twelve not every boy is going to be able to hack something so life changing and huge in scope. Should there be screening? Sure, for maturity issues and scout spirit.

[CubScoutJo]

Our council had boys fill out an application of sorts, and they originally said that they would do interviews and select based on having a good mix of ranks and experience. However, when my sons "applied" they were immediately accepted, so there was no screening.

 

Incidently, my younger son's patrol ended up being one of those "dysfunctional" ones. He said many of them didn't step up and take responsibilities even if they were on the duty roster. He said that meals sometimes took more than 2 hours from start to cleanup! They also seemed to have little experience with cooking, and even though my son said they had step by step directions, they did things like cut open the bag for the boil in the bag rice. The older son's patrol meshed better though.(This message has been edited by CubScoutJo)(This message has been edited by CubScoutJo)

[Horizon]

My son just got back, haven't heard complaints yet. Then again, he attended as a 15 year old Eagle and was just an Asst. Patrol Leader and an NYLT grad. His Patrol Leader was also Eagle, and an NYLT grad. They also had some younguns with them too.

 

His Troop had REQUIRED shakedown campout, REQUIRED shakedown activities, and monthly REQUIRED meetings. They put enough heat on everyone that I think that they did just fine.

 

With Council level contingent Troops, I think it is critical to have those contingent events to make it all work.

[Scoutfish]

I say if you join, go to meetings, and pay your dues..then yes, it is an entitlement. It is part of the program and should not be a "selective" ( read biased) program.

 

BUT...I see no issue with requireing a certain age that is on the higher end of the program or based on minimum rank requirements.

Know what I mean? Maybe you have to be at least 1st class or have 3 years in before attendance is allowed. Then it follows along with the general program of scouting which is divided up by years and rank.

 

 

I see nothing wrong with shakedown either. Again, certain entitlements require a degree of earing it instead of just getting it for the sake of just being a scout.

 

 

Now, I say this having absolutely NO scouting experience as a leader or as a scout myself.

 

but it isn't different in the real world:

 

You cannnot get a class A CDL as soon as you get your first drivers license you have top have a few years experience and be at leasta few years older than what is eligible for a regular drivcers license.

 

In our daily work lives, we have to earn advancement and promotions. In the military, you have to earn promotions too.

 

Yes, it should be an entitlement, and not selective based on what ultimately - in some troops - could just be popular choice based on who is liked or cool enough....but it's an entitlement that every scout has the EQUAL OPPERTUNITY to WORK for!

[nolesrule]

As someone who was a 12 year old kid when I attended in 1989 (and I wish I could have gone again in 1993, but I was out of the country), I don't think age needs to be a prerequisite. We had troop meetings and a shakedown weekend, and everything went smoothly.

 

I think setting the expectations, and having the required meetings and shakedown weekends (and enforcing the required part) should be enough for the patrols to come together and be able to function properly.

 

On the other hand, if you're having trouble filling a contingent, then these problems are going to creep in because you can't be picky and will take what you can get.

[Jeffrey H]

The requirement to attend the Jamboree should only be based on a Scout's ability to pay for the event and transportation to get there. It's an honor and privilege to attend Jambo, but all Scouts are entitled to attend if they pay the $$$, follow Jambo rules, and conduct themselves with Scout Spirit (the scout oath and law).

 

National needs people to come to the event to make it successful. They are not going to shoulder unrealistic prerequisities on Scouts that will end up lowering the attendance numbers. It only happens every 4 years and most Scouts and Adult Leaders will never attend during their lifetime. If you have an opportunity to go, then go.

 

 

[Lisabob]

I think the key is really in how well the jambo troop can prepare and learn to function together before leaving. In this, I was pleased with my son's jambo troop. They had at least 14 troop meetings (monthly in most cases), a couple of mandatory shakedown events, 6 fundraisers (including some as a group), and I lost track of the number of independent patrol meetings. As a result, the boys knew the others in their patrol reasonably well and had at least some sense of which adults had what sorts of personalities and what could be expected from them.

 

My 16 year old has talked some about his jambo experience and I'm pretty sure I'll be hearing a good bit more over the coming weeks. He had a great time despite some challenging personal and physical situations. He has indicated that most of the boys who had problems during jambo were young (12-13), but that doesn't mean all of the young guys had problems. Still, I'm glad my son is a bit older. We both agree (son and I) that some of the stuff he was able to take in stride and deal with at age 16, would have been overwhelming for him and might have "ruined" it at age 12.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[mpaull]

Being somewhat new to Scouting, I was curious as to why this event only occurs every four years? Someone mentioned that if you only get one shot at it, then you are going to go - ready or not. I assume the reason is fiscal, but would every three, or even two, years be totally out of the question?