If the BSA were to provide services to girls, whats the best way?

[Beavah]

Yah, da other thread about daughters and how GSUSA has generally abandoned the market of girls who are seeking real outdoor adventure is somethin' I've been seeing all over. Safe to say, there's a very large demand for real scouting for girls that isn't being met, eh? And a lot of those young ladies are the sisters and daughters of some very loyal BSA folks. Seems like it's almost our duty to help 'em out.

 

Now I know that we've had marketing studies for years that indicate if we went coed we'd wipe out GSUSA. Frankly, I'm not sure I care that much anymore. GSUSA has jumped da shark on a few issues.

 

So if we were to decide that doing our duty to young people involved meeting the needs of girls and young ladies, how would we best do it? Separate single-sex programs that merged into Venturing? Coed all the way? Local choice?

 

What are the possible traps to be aware of? How do we maintain our successes with mentoring and meeting the needs of (especially) middle school boys if we're also trying to serve girls well?

 

I put this here in da program section in the hope that it will be a program discussion on da real merits of different options for providing such a program. If folks want to discuss whether girls should be provided any services at all because they have cooties or such, please spin off an Issues and Politics thread.

 

Beavah

 

[John-in-KC]

Older teen: Venturing is doing a pretty good job, when Crews are properly developed.

 

Tween-Teen: My personal thought is gender-specific. We know that girls used "Scouting for Boys" in the early day. B-P tells us that. A FEW merit badges might have to be tweaked for gender specific needs, but most stand as is.

 

Child: Cubbing, again, gender-specific.

 

My thoughts only.

[desertrat77]

Beavah, I'd prefer coed all the way, but being aware of the strong beliefs of others, I'd opt for your second recommendation: have parallel programs, boy track and girl track, and then merge both at age 14.

[Basementdweller]

I like coed Cub scout

 

and then something Junior ventures or something before venturing.

 

We have many families that the girls already participate in cub scouting right along with their brothers.

 

Girl scouts is not that way........Every troop my daughter has been involved with we have been shoved right out the door.

[SSScout]

I dunno.... I could see coed Cubs... but maybe not in the tweens...

Girls do mature earlier than boys, in many ways, but not always... Getting the genders to respect each other , brother-sister wise would be a good thing. Working together as Dens, Patrols, what a concept. But we still have gender seperate atheletic competition. Is this about "feeling good" about yourself as a man or woman, gaining confidence in one's physical ability (camping, hiking, canoeing) as well as learning to respect the other gender as an equal?

Or about "opportunity" for all that, which maybe the GSUSA hasn't provided or can't figure out how to provide? Or can the BSA (soon to be the SA?) figure it out?

 

Beavah: New PM received? It went out seemingly OK .

[Eagle92]

I've seen it where Cubs and Venturing age youth are coed while the 11-14 year olds are divided into Scout and Guides, and i've seen it where each group has the option of all male, all female, and coed at all levels.

 

My thoughts are too the later.

[Basementdweller]

Eagle that would be easy.

 

when they move to Webelos.......you split boys and girls....

 

the girl program runs for 5 years and the boy program runs for 2 with crossing over into boy scouts.

 

That way Boy Scouts can remain boy scouts.

 

 

Beavah thx for spinning this thread

[UCEagle72]

I think I like the idea co-ed Cubs, then splitting into Scouts and Guides for the 11 -> 13/14 (completion of 8th grade), and then transition to Venturing.

 

[Hal_Crawford]

In for a penny in for a pound; coed from beginning to end. Ease into it with local option. They are fully coed in the UK and it seems to be working. I think that going from co-ed cubs to separate scouts would cause a lot of upset when friends don't want to be split up.

 

Beavah, I really like the way you address this as "doing our duty to young people".

 

Hal

[OldGreyEagle]

I understand trying to keep Boy Scouts for boys (kinda obvious, huh?)

 

But if you keep it unisexual and offer a program for 2 sexes, then you need to duplicate leadership, have adult leaders for the boys only group and then adult leaders for the girls group. Is this the time to need double the adults to run the same program?

 

I can tell you from my Venturing experience, it may seem like a good idea to have the same committee and adults run two programs, but it typically works out poorly.

 

If we are going to offer the same program to both boys and girls, then it just becomes a Co-Ed program at all levels and

 

"Fasten your seatbelts, it's going to be a bumpy night!"

[packsaddle]

You know me...as an ultra-right-wing liberal I think the market-based approach is best - local option. Personally, I'm ok with coed all the way. Let GSUSA compete if they can...the competition might give them incentive to improve their product.

[skeptic]

All the way, but with coed option on local levels. JMTCW

[DancesWithSpreadsheets]

OGE, I'm not sure that duplication of leadership would necessarily be that much of a problem.

 

If BSA were to require two completely seperate units, i.e. seperate charters for male and female units then yes, but what if they did something along the lines of the British model, have a Scout Group umbrella organization with single sex sub-units, all under one charter. One committee, one GSM, and leaders of the sub-units that can back each other up as needed.

 

 

[emb021]

I certainly think the BSA should open up to girls below 14, just sure what's best, whether co-ed units or single gender.

 

Is co-ed Cub Scouts a good idea?? Or even co-ed "Boy" Scouts?

 

I certainly think that there would need to be some tweeking of the program, to make the advancement work with both genders (I would prefer that both boys and girls being working the same awards).

 

Now, some charter orgs WILL want to have single-gender units, so I don't like the idea of FORCING units to be single-gender (we don't do this in Venturing, so why do it with the younger ages). So leave it up to each charter org as to what they want. Also, I like the idea of if a CO whats 2 single-gender units that this work under an umbrella committee (maybe even the same unit number).

 

 

 

[Basementdweller]

I don't see the need for changing requirements for advancement.......

 

 

Could you give me some examples and the whys????????

 

 

I don't see anything in cub scouting that would need changed. I would want to make sure we had two deep leadership for sure.

 

Webelos, if you had young ladies in the den would need coed leader ship and single sex tenting on camp outs.