Sanctioned Events

[Scoutfish]

kay, if you look in the G2SS you have a nice fancy chart showing what is considered council or distric events only. Or rather, stuff that can't be held at the pack/ troop level.

 

But how about having the council or distric sanction the event?

 

Now, this is just a hypothetical situation, so the exact details are more for you to just assume have all been worked out.

 

Lets say my pack wanted to teach canoeing in a big ole pond on a private property that my pack just happened to be having a pack family campout on.

 

Or maybe archery or BB guns, sling shots, flat water rowing.

 

NOw I am not, nor do I want to go through a NRA rifle instructor couse or do all that is necessary to be compatable..but supposing I did- could my council or distric consider that event at my campout to be an allowable event?

 

Better yet, if I met all safety requiremnts and could show BSA, my council or district that all the proper things were in place..could they consider it a sanctionable event?

 

NO, I do not have plans to do this. Just my mind wondering.

 

Basically, define sanctioned.

 

If council is okay with you doing something at a troop or pack event...would that not make it sanctioned?

 

Again, I do not have any covert plans or ideas to do something I shouldn't...I'm just asking for curiousity's sake. That and maybe even as more justification to not do something we shouldn't do..in the future..IF it comes up that is!

 

 

 

But since I brought it up, and I have NO IDEA of what is involved.....how hard would it be to be certified to be able to teach BB gun shooting? I'm only asking because I am under the impression that there is quite a bit to do to be able to do it.

[John-in-KC]

Someone in your Council Camping or Activities Committee is the "go-to" guy for shooting sports. He's an expert marksman, hunter with high-power, .22, black powder, longbow and crossbow. He's got all manner of NRA schooling, and he's generally pretty generous with his time. Ask your Council Camp Director for his contact info.

 

Ditto your canoeing guy. I took American Red Cross basic canoeing 40 years ago, as our Explorer Post prepared for a trip on the lower Colorado River (Needles, CA put in, Lake Havasu (CA side), come out. That course was about 40 hours of water and land time over 5 Saturdays. That was to get us to baseline user proficiency. An expert, let alone an instructor, has hundreds of hours/miles of training and experience. Beavah as I recall is a right fair canoeist. He can discuss the hierarchy of training.

 

Point is this: District and Council level events do not happen randomly anymore, and certainly do not happen at random places. There's a lot of evaluation before a site is OK'd for a major event. Why? (Yes, B, I'm going to say it): Liability. Our insurance program protects volunteers, but professionals and events require the Council to do its homework. The G2SS is for units operating in the program. When District and Council start doing things, there's a different set of standards, and the bar is just a tad higher ... like an order of magnitude.

 

Each year at District day camp I walk the property. I'm looking for only one thing: Things that would entice a kid to wander away from the program area and go exploring ... at some small risk to himself. I believe the lingo term is "attractive nuisances." Some we fence, some we tape, some we lock up.

 

You can go to your Council properties and rent them for the weekend, to include staff support. That's one way to do shooting sports and canoeing in the off-season. You'll be opening the Pack checkbook, but I promise you you'll pay less than you did if you went to a commercial range.(This message has been edited by John-in-KC)

[Sebastian a lady]

We have a youth sports office locally that holds quarterly archery clinics under a qualified instructor. Our district has sanctioned the recognition of participation in these clinics as meeting the requirements for archery for the CS belt loop and pin.

 

A couple notes. This question was formally asked and answered by the council executive, in writing. Not just word of mouth. We found that a previous waiver given verbally had been modified in the retelling until it was quite a ways distant from the original exception that had been granted.

 

The exemption was only to allow us to use official class participation for the belt loops and pins. It does not authorize dens to have archery parties or for parents to learn to shoot enough to meet the minimums to rent archery equipment and then "teach" their dens.

 

I think this might be the sort of sanctioned event that is envisioned in the guide.

[Crew21_Adv]

Scoutfish,

 

Greetings!

 

 

John in KC pretty much summed it up. No district or council event occurs without planning. However, I would expect each year, request to conduct new events are applied for.

 

Straddling the fence.... You will never know if an event can be sanctioned, until you ask your local council camping committee.

 

Some events may never be sanctioned to occur at the unit level. Other unit level events may receive authorization and be sanctioned. New programs and new outdoor experiences are introduced to Scouting each year. Bu those concepts have to go thru a vetting process of safety, liability, skill level, finance, specific insurance cost, etc. Some ideas may just be too hazardous for any youth, and some new outdoor experiences may be brought to within safety limitations enough for a 10 y/o or maybe 14 y/o and older.

 

My own thoughts

Is it worth proposing an event to your local council? Certainly. But be willing to accept either an approval or a rejection.

 

Scouting Forever and Venture On!

Crew21 Adv

[Eagle92]

As mentioned Liability is the major factor in certain restrictions. beleive it or not, if undertand what NCS taught me,any type of district or council CS level daytime activity falls under CSDC national standards, and any type district or council CS overnite activity falls under CS Resident camp national standards. And those standards are designed for liability protection.

 

Also as I have discovered differnt parts of the country do things differently. In my neck of the woods, it's not uncommon for CS age kids to have .22s and go hunting with mom and dad. Some kids even have archery and rifle ranges on their properties where the entire family practices their skills. But in other areas of the country, that would be anathema.

[Oak Tree]

Scoutfish - yes, our council did exactly that for our pack. They gave us the training and the use of the camp and gave us the BB guns - so it was a council-sanctioned activity. It seems like a gray area in the rules as written, but I was happy to go with the council's judgement, and it was just as safe as any other time Cubs get to shoot.

[Scoutfish]

THanks Everybody!

 

Reading the answers, I'm thinking I was a bit to vaugue or I didn't quite explain myself too well. I'm shocked that happened! LOL!

 

Oak Tree, you actually answered my question..at least gave the TYPE of answer I was looking for even thought I wasn't expecting a specific answer.

 

I do not want to take the training that would enable me to teach this stuff while at the same time being sanctioned by BSA on a coucil or distric level.. Maybe one day I will after having had 7 or 8 years experinece under my belt.But right now, I do not want to INTENTIONALLY dance in any gray areas!

 

 

I was wondering if and how it could be possible though.

 

Actually, everybody gave great answers that I will save for future reference though.

 

John, Thabks! If I decide it would be great for my den to do a particular activity...even though I can't do it, I see what path to take THROUGH council to still have that activity without having to specifically go to a camp.

[Eagle92]

'fish,

there are several types of BSA certifications or equivalents, if memory serves. the Biggie is National Camping School, which also dual certifies you through NRA I believe ( never taken the course).it's a week-8 day long ( depending whether you take the pistol cert or not (optional though recommended if working with Venturers) and NCS cert covers CS and BS shooting sport activities (bbguns, archery, rifles, and shotgun).

 

NRA certification, military cert, and I've been told LE certs will allow you work those ranges on the BS level under a NCS person.

 

Now for CS, I've been told the certs above could run BB gun ranges, need to double check that though. BUT there is a CS shooting sports cert that covers BB guns and archery that an NCS cert person can teach. it's only a day long, and is the minimum required for CSDC and res Camp. So that might be the route you want to go.

 

BTW want to staff CSDC with me? I'm looking for a second BB gun person and 2 archery folks.

[nolesrule]

Hehe. Eagle92, my WB patrol did our presentation on Shooting Sports in our council. I got stuck with the section on "Adult Opportunities" aka what training is required/personnel needed to open a range or run an event. Your description is essentially correct.