Not uncommon not to be active in HS

[Beavah]

Not uncommon for scouts to not be as active in HS

 

Yah, while I reckon this is true in some units, it certainly isn't true in all units.

 

My question for everybody is do yeh settle for this as "normal", do yeh make "fumes" excuses, or do yeh look at your program and say "This ain't right. What can we do better?"

 

Beavah

[eaglescout1996]

I really think it falls under the "normal" category...young men 15/16-18 want to 'hang out' with guys their own age.

 

I'm about 13 years removed from the Boy Scouting program, so Venturing didn't come about until right before my 21st birthday, so I didn't get the chance to experience that. But...I was 'active' while in HS, which meant that I attended about 90% of the weekly Troop meetings and about 50% of the weekend activities. I did play three sports in HS, along with being the President of the Key Club, but to tell you the truth, the only reason I stayed active was to finish my Eagle project.

 

After we moved from Europe when I was 15, I was the oldest boy in my new Troop, and during the last couple of years, I was the oldest by 3 or 4 years...do you really think that a 17 year old wants to go camping with kids in middle school?

 

Now a days we have the Venturing program, so those boys can migrate to something else, I just don't see the fix something you can do with the program...it's just a fact of life.

[Scoutfish]

Beavah, while I'm no spring chicken ( 38) I'm gonna guess I'm younger than you.

 

Anyway, here's my answer since I'm practically a teenager! LOL!

 

No two units are alike,and I agree anything said for one troop. may not be said of another. This can be due to district, Council, state or even geographic area of the US. I bet you can see differences between coastal NC and any troop in say...Montanna.

 

Now as for scouts not being so active: I would say that between 1 and 3 is normal. Too many things going on in teenage years, the most competative one to Scouting being GIRLS and DATING!

 

 

Between 4 and 6 not being active can still go either way: Girls, school, just the local way of doing things ( Old enough to work the farm instead of scouting or even religious duties) Might possibly be the program just doesn't grab everybody.

 

More than 7: I'd start looking at and planning on reworking something with my program wether it be activities, camping,or even the way the scouts are treated and approched!

 

Now excuse me , I gotta go hang chill my phat posse peeps! Peace-out-dog!

 

LMAO!

[OneHour]

Let's see, we have:

 

8 scouts who are in local high schools' bands (2 high schools), including 1 drum major.

6 scouts who are in the orchestras

4 high school football players

3 high school track team

1 high school golf team

2 high school tennis team

5 high school baseball players

2 high school swimmers

5 local/ high school soccer team players

2 in ROTC

about 70% of our high school scouts take at least 2 AP classes. This doesn't include their normal high school clubs and extra curricular activities such as YES, AFS, FFA, etc.

 

The 6-8th graders are all over the place ranging from all of the above!

 

Yup, they are truly active in HS! Yup, we are constantly battling the attendance issues. Yup, I have been asking the same question, "This ain't right. What else can we do?"

[Twocubdad]

I think you have to ajust your idea of "active" for the oldest Scouts. It's not going to be the same as with an enthusiastic 11-year-old who attends every meeting, campout and activity.

 

In the troop I serve, most boys are taking very rigorous high school classes. For the guys who are junior or senior, classes and college plans rightly take priority. For my own son, a HS junior, it taken several years for him to learn to look at his school work and make the call not to go to Scouts, or band practice, or the movies with his mates. He's missing very popular ski trip this weekend to put in some last-minute prep work for the SAT the following weekend. He gets a big attaboy from the old man for that.

 

The older guys tend to take somewhat of an "emertius" status. They'll cherry pick the activities they like and attend troop meetings to just hang out with their mates. I'm okay with that. Generally these guys have earned it. They are typically Eagle or close to it and have served mutiple terms in top leadership positions. A couple are planing to attend Jamboree this sumer and/or Philmont next year.

 

I'm glad to have them.

 

 

[Beavah]

Yah, but then I go visit a local troop, eh?

 

They have a lot of high schoolers, includin' juniors and seniors.

 

Those high schoolers are in band, and multiple sports, and are takin' a lot of advanced classes. A few are in communities where those band and AP and sports programs would knock your socks off.

 

And those high schoolers show up almost every week at meetings, show up almost every outing.

 

I can name a half dozen troops like that without strainin'.

 

So it sure seems like it's possible to have high schoolers be fully involved and even to be more active as they get older. Sure seems like they don't mind hangin' out with younger fellows and are even proud to be leadin' the younger fellows.

 

Now maybe they're just unique, eh? Have odd circumstances. Most are pretty long-term stable units with supportive COs.

 

But I gotta believe that it's possible other places, eh? Just that sometimes we're willin' to settle for, and make excuses for, mediocre.

 

Beavah

 

[GernBlansten]

What's the national average size of a unit? 30 registered? Maybe 20 active? So out of that 20, lets say 5 are over 15. Now those 5 are being pulled in all kinds of new directions. If those 5 are all best buddies and scouting is the glue that keeps them best friends, yes, I can see that unit having active older boys.

But how often to kids keep hanging with the same guys? Those 5 might have been their best buds at 13, but now they have new best buds, who aren't scouts. They may be friendly with the other 4, but are they really best buds? Just another thing to pull these guys to things away from scouting. It ain't the program, its the sociology.

[WAKWIB]

Beavah sez: "I can name a half dozen troops like that without strainin'."

 

What is the possible reason that it is working for them in spite of the many variables already discussed? Do you see common things in their program?

 

 

[Eagle92]

Well I'm the guy who made the comment, and I am basing it on my experiences growing up, and the units I've been associated with as an adult. And i say that Not uncommon for scouts to not be AS active in HS. What is left out is compared to middle school years.

 

As a youth I know bunch of folks who wouldn't miss a meeting or a camping trip, unless saving the summer camp fee money for a HA trip or jambo, until they would get into HS. Then the sports and/or extracurriculars, as well as jobs come into play. I had some great role models who wouldn;t make camping trips due to work, or miss an occasional meeting b/c of school.

 

Heck I am one example of that, I don't think I missed a single meeting or trip, save one when I was seriously sick, until I got into HS. Then with JROTC I might miss an occasional meeting or trip due to class. Then when I was able to work, there went my weekends. Yep I missed most of my troop's camping trips, but I was able to make 90% of the meetings.

 

 

[John-in-KC]

EagleSon is a university sophomore now.

 

He was active into the 11th grade, in addition to band, HS Republicans, church youth group, senior choir at church, and the local barbershop chorus. Was he every week active? Not necessarily. When that term paper is due Friday, he tended to be working on the paper. In the run-up to music festival, or during Festival week, he was at school.

 

What kept him? Good people who served as sounding boards for him.

 

Sometimes, while they don't want Mom/Dad, they still crave Adult Association and Recognition.

 

Gee... don't those sound like METHODS?

[Beavah]

What is the possible reason that it is working for them in spite of the many variables already discussed? Do you see common things in their program?

 

Yah, that's a good question. Hard to say. Different people, different styles, different kids.

 

I reckon one thing that's common is that they all work on it. They've got a vision and if what they're doin' isn't getting 'em there, or they have to adapt to different lads, they do. That's why it seems a bit odd to me that folks are willin' to accept that it's "normal" for HS lads to fade out. If that's your normal, then yeh should change what you're doin' so it isn't normal anymore!

 

Thinkin' about it some more, I'd say they all genuinely use youth leadership. Not token "write a duty roster" stuff. Older lads do the real deal. Have keys to the trailer, get to make purchases, are responsible for safety or teachin' younger fellows on their own. In some way or another they get treated like adults and allowed independence, but at the same time are expected to care/give service. They view the younger fellows as "theirs" - guys that they're really responsible for and who look up to 'em.

 

That, and da adult relationships are strong, as KC suggests.

 

"High Adventure" may contribute a bit, but it doesn't seem to be what drives it. In one unit that had a strong high adventure program which fell apart when the young ASM who pushed it left town, that loss didn't seem to affect HS youth participation in the troop at all.

 

Beavah

 

[Eagle92]

To change the topic sligtly, i think I can do that since my quote si the one that started this thread, WHAT CAN WE DO TO KEEP OLDER SCOUTS ACTIVE ( caps for emphasis).

 

I know that I was active in HS, just not as active compared to MS, because 1) it was fun, 2) I had a bunch of friends 3)felt some responsibility to teach the new scouts like older scouts did for me, 4)yes I wanted to get Eagle. But to be honest I was having to mucgh fun to work on it until about 3 months before the 18th bday. project was done while in 8th grade, and had most of the MBs completed (only needed 3 between 8th and Sr. year if memory serves: Personal Management, Commuications, and any other)

[SMT224]

Once they achieve Life, some of our older Scouts seem to miss more meetings and camping trips, but do not drop out entirely. Per the above descriptions, they can easily become engaged in plenty of other activities, but still maintain a solid link to the Troop. Eventually they get their project done and earn Eagle.

 

Where we seem to loose Scouts is in the first year after cross over. This is the time they discover they really do not like being away from home and mom, or they just don't like camping. Some will say they dropped out because they'd rather do sports, but these are the same ones that cried for mom every night at summer camp and were miserable on camping trips.

 

This also the time that another group of boys discover they really like camping. They can't wait for summer camp and wish it would go all summer! These boys love camping and all that goes with it - playing with fire, playing with knives, and actively learning basic first-aid. All without mom yelling at them to be careful!

 

If they stay the first year, they will usually hang in there through high school and make Eagle. About half the Scouts in our Troop are very active in sports and are able to balance the two activities. Sure they miss some of the outings and meetings, but if they are in the Troop for 6 or 7 years, they will go on plenty of camping trips and hikes and can still actively play sports.

[nolesrule]

Well, I can't explain others, but the reason I wasn't active much the last 2 years of high school was because:

 

1) International Baccalaureate program in high school, which generally had 3-4 hours of homework a night and more on weekends (forget 2-3 AP classes, all of them were at least AP-equivalent and some were more advanced than AP...English, History, Calculus, Physics, Chemistry, Spanish). It was hard to make it to meetings with all that homework.

1a) If I had a ride or drove, the school was 30 minutes away. If I had to take the school bus, it was 85 minutes away.

 

2) vice president in my synagogue's high school age youth group... events often conflicted with weekend trips

 

3) the one year my unit did high adventure, I was on a 6-week trip to Israel

 

4)There were a few other things that kept me busy as well.

 

Had nothing to do with the quality of the program. It had to do with the fact that I had multiple time-conflicting interests and the need for some occasional sleep. Advancement-wise I had everything for Eagle except the BOR done before my junior year of high school.

 

 

 

Now, the key to retaining older youth is:

 

1)You have to have older youth already or it becomes cyclical. Venturing can help in that retention because of the instructional aspects of the recognitions. But you have to take advantage of the crossover.

 

2)you need quality program to keep them interested. If all you're doing is going camping to the same 9-11 places and same summer camp every year, you'll never keep them around.(This message has been edited by nolesrule)

[Venividi]

WHAT CAN WE DO TO KEEP OLDER SCOUTS ACTIVE ( caps for emphasis).

 

Chats with the older scouts reminding them that they have an obligation to the troop. That the troop needs them to be successful. That boy led isn't just chairing a meeting on Monday night, but also that there are older youth prepared to teach skills to the troops newer members. That they are truely in charge, so that if it doesn't happen, that there isn't an adult that takes over for them.