Transportation: Caravan?

[bilgerat]

Your insight, please...

 

Since joining the Troop I've heard on many occasions that BSA policy prohibits "caravaning" vehicles to/from campouts, etc.

 

If such a policy exists, could someone please steer me to it (document, please)?

 

As a matter of practice, a number of drivers "wink" at each other, say they are just "following at a distance", and caravan anyway.

 

Is this "policy" Troop folklore or is there really something to it?

 

Thanks!

 

 

[emb021]

You need to check the Guide to Safe Scouting (its available on-line).

 

It states that caravaning is NOT allowed.

 

http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/HealthandSafety/GSS/gss12.aspx

 

Under Automobiles,

 

#10: Do not travel in convoy (see "Leadership Requirements for Trips and Outings," No. 2).

 

Leadership Requirements for Trips & Outing is here: http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/HealthandSafety/GSS/gss01.aspx

 

What is expected, per this page is:

 

* Meet for departure at a designated area.

* Prearrange a schedule for periodic checkpoint stops as a group.

* Plan a daily destination point.

 

Hence, no caravaning.

 

[John-in-KC]

To answer your question, this one is not local lore.

 

http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/HealthandSafety/GSS/gss12.aspx

 

In boldface, thus BSA program guidance:

 

Do not travel in convoy (see "Leadership Requirements for Trips and Outings," No. 2).

 

Makes further reference to:

 

Leadership Requirements for Trips and Outings

 

1) Two-deep leadership:

Two registered adult leaders, or one registered leader and a parent of a participating Scout or other adult, one of whom must be at least 21 years of age or older, are required for all trips or outings. There are a few instances, such as patrol activities, when no adult leadership is required. Coed overnight activities, even those including parent and child, require male and female adult leaders, both of whom must be 21 years of age or older, and one of whom must be a registered member of the BSA.

 

2) During transportation to and from planned Scout outings,

 

3) Meet for departure at a designated area.

 

4) Prearrange a schedule for periodic checkpoint stops as a group.

 

5) Plan a daily destination point.

A common departure site and a daily destination point are a must. If you cannot provide two adults for each vehicle, the minimum required is one adult and two or more youth membersnever one on one.

 

 

 

[Lone-Scout]

What is wrong with traveling in convoy?

[OldGreyEagle]

Good Question LS

 

From what I understand, the idea is that when people drive in Caravan, or Convoy, there is a thought that they must stay in line and will do "dangerous" things to stay in line, such as run stop lights and such. Telling a driver, don't worry about directions, we will be in a caravan may result in a driver who isnt sure of the destination who then does crazy stuff to stay behind the car in front of him.

 

Leastwise thats what I was told when I asked

[Lisabob]

"Telling a driver, don't worry about directions, we will be in a caravan may result in a driver who isnt sure of the destination who then does crazy stuff to stay behind the car in front of him. "

 

Amen to that. This is one reason I really don't like driving with my son's troop. They have been known to do this. Problem is, most of them grew up around here so if they take a wrong turn out in the boonies, at least they have some idea where they are. I didn't, I don't. It makes me a little paranoid.

 

Also, I don't like to speed, especially with other people's kids in my car. Some of my fellow scouters have different thoughts about that. I don't want to be forced to drive like a race car driver, just to avoid getting lost.

 

In my book, caravaning just encourages all sorts of bad driving behavior.

 

 

 

 

[Nike]

Caravaning also increases the odds that one troop driver will rear-end another. On highways at hig speeds, caravaning mini-vans or SUVs piling up with one another also increases the odds that many troop members will be involved in a fatal accident.

[scoutldr]

There should be enough GPS's in the group that caravaning should be unnecessary.

[shortridge]

Maps, too. They're cheaper.

[Eagle92]

Not everyone has GPS. For my OA chapter I'm one of the principle drivers and I don't have it. Maybe someday, but still too expensive for me.

 

As for maps, Yep they are cheap, and more reliable than MAPQUEST. Although that is a great tool to use in conjunction with a map.

[Oak Tree]

One other annoying feature of caravans can be when they pull over half-on and half-off the road, to wait for the second half of the group to catch up.

 

Our troop used to caravan until a few years ago - it was just presumed that was the best way to keep people from getting lost. Switching to a non-caravan style was actually quite freeing, though. It made things so much easier. Most of the cars do have GPS's in our troop. We have had an occasional person get lost, but with maps and cell phones, they've always found their way.

[Troop185]

Several years ago, we caravan with a big group 300 miles, from Michigan to Hocking Hills in Ohio. Three of the drivers were women. Every stop (for rest room, gas, etc.) was at least 1/2 hours. We got to the youth camping area two hours after the time I would have arrived if we did not caravan.

 

Now I give all the drivers a map, my cell number, and tell them I will meet them there.

[SMT224]

Caravaning is a really bad idea!

 

Many moons ago, when I took the Webelos on a Troop camping trip, the Troop leaders told me just to follow them, even though I had no idea where I was going. There I was, with a van full of Weebs, trying to keep up with guys who had been to this place so many times they knew the route with their eyes closed. It was a 3 hour drive, and they drove very fast. I was doing 70-80 just trying to keep them in sight. It was terrifying! At one point I lost them at a light, refusing to go though a yellow/red, and watched them disappear into the night. Not fun!

 

Now that I'm Scoutmaster, I give everyone a paper map & directions. Some use their GPS, which fine too. We head off with each others cell phone numbers and meet up at our destination. Works much better as everyone can drive at their own pace, and can stop if necessary.

 

[SSScout]

Amen to all the above.

A teaching moment: Give the map and directions to a Scout and let him navigate. I believe the Surveying MB requires a map be made to a camp ground from the Troop meeting place (or something eqivalent).

 

Anyone remember Motor Rallies? Timed Map and compass driving competitions?

[Beavah]

Yah, all things in moderation, eh?

 

Traveling together can be a much safer way to go up here on remote roads in the winter time (or for you folks in hot desert areas in da summer). One vehicle that gets lost or stuck can be in a world of hurt in da winter backcountry in lots of places, with no cell phone coverage.

 

That's da problem with these "policy" proclamations in the guide. They can't take circumstances into account. And sometimes if yeh take 'em too far they throw out really good safety rules like the buddy system.

 

The other thing that's at issue is if a car does get in an accident, or a lad does get sick enough to need to stop for treatment, who's got the medical forms? Odds are it's just one or two scouters in individual vehicles, unless you're in the habit of passin' people's medical history around willy-nilly. Seen lots of cases, too, where drivers have started having medical problems. Yeh sure prefer not to have a small group of first-year scouts on the side of a highway with a driver havin' a heart attack.

 

There are real merits to drivin' together or at least keepin' in contact for mutual support and safety.

 

Buddy system vs. stupid convoying. Balance and prudence, eh? Balance and prudence are what make for safety, not policy.

 

Beavah