Recruiting active members from other troops

[Stosh]

Looking for feedback.

 

What recourse does a SM have when he witnesses boys leaving their troop then recruiting their buddies to follow with them to the other one?

 

Stosh

[Lisabob]

None.

[OldGreyEagle]

In such a situation, the Scoutmaster would have to figure why the first boy left and what about the second troop is atracting the other boys. Is it loyalty/friendship to the scout? Is it a boy perceived better program? Why are the boys leaving and what is the reason needs to be determined. Once the reason is detrmined, then the quesiton is, does the scoutmaster want to change?

 

I say that because I could see a boy run troop having a hard time competing with an Advancement machine where adults do most of the work and all the boys do is lay back and enjoy the ride. The boys look at the Advancement machine and figure, why am I knocking myself out when Troop XXX does all the work for their boys. If thats the situation, I am not sure I have an answer but praise the boys remaining

[shortridge]

Without knowing why they left, it's hard to develop a response.

 

The new and different always attracts people of a certain type. It may be nothing more than that - being tired of the same-old, same-old, even if the same-old is really exciting.

[Beavah]

Yah, hmmm.... not sure what you're really tryin' to get at, eh?

 

Da real answer to your question is Lisabob's. None.

 

The deeper answer is that retention is "ongoing recruitment". What can you and the leadership boys in your troop do to continually "recruit" your current members, includin' these boys?

 

The still deeper answer is to conduct exit interviews and figure out what da reasons are for kids leavin', and decide if they're worth addressing.

 

B

 

[xlpanel]

Copy what the other troop is doing, they must be doing something right that you are not.

[Hal_Crawford]

"Copy what the other troop is doing, they must be doing something right that you are not."

 

I disagree. What is right for that troop might not be right for the rest of your troop. Stosh does not indicate the size of his troop. If there were thirty scouts in the troop and 5 left the question is are the other twenty five happy with the way things are? Those guys might not want to see there troop become a clone of the troop down the block.

 

I would start with your PLC. Ask them what they think is going on. They probably know a lot more about the scouts reasons for leaving than you do. Ask them what, if anything they think should be done to retain scouts in the troop.

 

Good luck,

Hal

[scoutingagain]

As Lisabob said. None.

 

This is not big time college sports. The door to and from the unit should be open both ways. Different units fit the needs of different people. If some find a better fit elsewhere we should wish them well and let them know the door is always open if they want to return.

 

SA

[John-in-KC]

What OGE, Beavah, and Hal said.

 

Lisa's has merit too, especially regarding the following on boys: In our laboratory of adulthood, do you want to show yourself as a censor, or as someone who looks for the root cause and resolves it?

 

If you interfere by simply being a communications block, the perception of you, Stosh, will be as a censor.

[Lisabob]

I think a lot of times, people take it very personally when a boy leaves "their" unit. Either they view it as a form of personal disloyalty (how could he do that after all I've done for him) or they view it as "raiding" by another unit (this is my turf, how dare they).

 

In either case, while the gut level emotion is understandable, it is also misplaced. The unit is not, or should not be, a reflection or extension of any one adult or group of adults. It is not "my" unit. If it is viewed as such, that's a warning sign in and of itself that things may be veering away from true north, maybe with more adult involvement that boy ownership of the program. Also, people vote with their feet. If just a couple of boys are leaving, that's one thing. Maybe they found that they don't quite fit into the culture of the unit and would be happier else where. If a large number/percentage of boys are leaving, that might cause one to examine the reasons why? Perhaps there's something about the program that is repelling them (and/or their parents)?

 

Recourse, to me, suggests that you're looking for a way to make the boys STOP talking to their friends about their new unit. If that's what you meant in your initial post Stosh, well, sorry. Ain't gonna happen and you can't make it happen.

 

What's the back story?

 

(Edited for typos)(This message has been edited by lisabob)

[frank10]

When we have a scout that wants out of our unit I offer to introduce him to the other 3 troops in town.

 

I came from one of the other troops myself.

 

Best you can do is offer a killer program that will fit some scouts and let some one else take care of the rest.

[Stosh]

I guess I wasn't very clear.

 

I have a troop of about 15 boys, the other troop is +40. They are extremely adult led, about as many adults as boys. I am boy led and up until recently had 2 adults working with the boys. Me, the SM and one ASM as my two-deep leadership.

 

The first two boys that left went because they had brothers in the other troop and it was difficult to run two troops for the parent/leaders. So the parents decided to pull their boys from the boy led program to the adult led program because things ran smoother with the adults doing all the work.

 

One of the two boys broke ranks originally because all his buddies went with my troop. Now that he's gone, he's recruiting the rest of the boys to follow with him.

 

Of the two feeder cub packs, 17 went with the adult led program and 5 came to the boy led program.

 

It's really difficult to compete with boys vs. adults. They have the numbers and adult interested parents that keep them in a program where the two can "bond".

 

I left the adult led program a couple of years ago and took on the boy led program with only 5 boys. I was very careful not to take any boys with me and discouraged them from changing just because I was changing. I was hoping to make sure there wasn't any problems for the two troops in the future, but this gesture was not recipricated and now the promises made by adults seem to draw the boys into a program where they simply sit back and enjoy vs. having to roll up their sleeves and do some leadership/work. Both 3rd ASM's for our council's contingent to National Jambo come from units I have led. I was also selected over the SM of the other troop but because of the reputation of the troop and experiences with him leading a prior Jambo, he was passed over. I know the program works, but it's really difficult to convince boys of the long term benefits vs. the short term excitement.

 

Stosh

[eagle77]

I am dealing with something very similar to your dilemma, Our troop competes with one other troop for the cubs from 3 neighboring packs, non of them associated with either troop. This past spring one pack only had 1 W2 scout and he was not going into Boy Scouts. Another had 12 boys graduating, had them stop by for a visit and talked with them, I happened to notice that the leader was wearing an eagle knot and right away thought we should have no problem at least getting some of the boys along with the leader. Our troop is boy led the other is adult led, they also have about 65 boys registered to the unit, while we have 28 boys. Well when it came time to find out how many would be coming to our troop my face almost dropped to the floor, NONE including the leader, in fact because of the leader. I just couldn't figure that out. While we were at our district camporee I was walking with a couple of my ASM around the area and stopped in on this troop to talk with the scoutmaster. While talking with him the W2 leader came walking up and I just came right out and asked why none of the boys from his den came to our troop. Now I quote him here in what he said " Boy led is some fantasy that certain gung ho leaders came up with", "scouting is meant to be fun not hard or challenging", "expecting boys to lead themsleves is stupid and unproductive". Now this is an Eagle scout saying this. I just stood and looked at him and said "suddenly the rank of Eagle does not mean that much to me when you put it that way". He told me that "I was one of those kooky guys who gets a kick out of bossing young boys around". I said good bye to the troop's scoutmaster and just walked away. One of my ASM's said to me it's kind of like the Pro baseball thing, whether they used steroids or not they hit the homeruns and nobody will care when they look at the record books, same goes with eagle some boys were fortunate to have gotten the boy led and those like this guy that just got the patch.It is an easier way and if you boy comes out with the same thing as the boy led boy who cares or knows the difference each of them will still wear the same patch. Sad very sad.

 

[Kudu]

jblake47 writes:

 

Of the two feeder cub packs, 17 went with the adult led program and 5 came to the boy led program.

 

Cub Scouts is a Patrol Method filter.

 

Scouting in a form that either Baden-Powell or Green Bar Bill would recognize is far more successful when you recruit the kind of boys who dropped out of Cub Scouts, rather than the ones who stuck with it long enough to cross over.

 

Boys of the "right sort" are easy to find if you have access to the public schools in your area, and offer adventure. See:

 

http://inquiry.net/adult/recruiting.htm

 

jblake47 writes:

 

now the promises made by adults seem to draw the boys into a program where they simply sit back and enjoy vs. having to roll up their sleeves and do some leadership/work.

 

One point on which we differ is that all the Scouts need to roll up their sleeves and do some leadership work.

 

I think you buy into leadership way too much. There is nothing wrong with lazy boys, in fact they are often the most fun on a campout and the reason that most of the other boys want to go.

 

In a boy-led Patrol Method Troop you only need one good leader per Patrol, and in a boy-led Troop Method Troop you only need one exceptionally talented natural leader to motivate the entire Troop (although the Patrols will have to camp closer together). Good leaders get help as they need it.

 

Kudu

 

[BrentAllen]

Stosh,

I suggest your Troop wear your program as a badge of honor, and praise them for it constantly. Don't run down the other Troop while doing this, just recognize the differences between your Troop's program and that of "other Troops."

 

At Summer Camp, ours was the only Troop cooking in camp that week. This is a decision made entirely by the boys, and they love it. We had leaders from other Troops visiting our site to see how we did it, telling us that is where they wanted their Troop to be. They asked if their SPL and PLs could come visit with our youth leaders and get a tour of camp and equipment, see menus, duty rosters, etc. I passed this on to the entire Troop and let them know what a great job they were doing. We wear that Summer Camp camping tradition as a huge badge of honor.

 

When recruiting, we let the prospects and their parents know we have a very challenging program, that we expect a lot from the Scouts in terms of attendance and participation. I do my best to scare away the part-timers who have only a passing interest in Scouting. We judge our program solely on quality, not quantity.

 

We let the boys and parents know that because we run such a challenging program, they will get to participate in more exciting trips sooner than they would in other Troops. That is the pay-off for the challenging program.

 

How many older boys are in the other Troop you mention? If they are truly as adult-led as you say, they most likely don't have many older boys active in the program. The older boys tend to leave if they don't have any role in running the program. If that is the case, point that out to the parents. And that would be my final suggestion, make sure you have good communication with your parents. They need to fully understand and buy into your program. If they see the value of your approach over the other Troop, they will keep their sons from leaving. If they don't see the value, they won't see any difference and won't see a reason for their son to stay.