Scouts using the F word!

[SMT224]

I'm not talking about the F word with uck, but another - "Fricking". On a recent Klondike I heard several Scouts use this word in situations where others might say "f**king". This one has sorta snuck up on me - does it merit a "Gentlemen Watch Your Language!" Or is it more in the category of alternative profanity like "cotton-picken" or "gosh-darned"?

 

Has anyone else heard this word? Taken any frickin' action on it?

 

[le Voyageur]

 

 

One of those words that has creeped into the lexicon whose meaning depends on the peer group using and popularizing it.

 

Once upon a time, I used to get somewhat upset for being called a dude. In my neck of the woods that insult would get the user a quick trip to the dentist as it implies gelding status. However, since the majority of todays young'em has not a clue as to what a gelding it, I let it pass with a dude back at ya

[Lisabob]

I've been trying to wean my teen from using that word. He thinks I'm hopelessly old fashioned. Conversation tends to go like this.

 

Me: You shouldn't use that word - it is no different than using the actual swear word.

Him: Yes it is different - it isn't the same at all. The real world means something vulgar. The replacement has no actual meaning.

Me: Yes but everyone knows that it is a substitute for the other word and so they think you have a foul mouth anyway.

Him: That's such a hopeless grown-up view! None of my friends think that. It isn't a swear word.

Me: Perception counts - it isn't what you think, but what people on the receiving end perceive. It might not seem offensive to you but it is guaranteed to offend a lot of others. It isn't courteous and by the way it makes you sound like you have a very limited vocabulary.

Him: (eyes rolling) Mom, get out of the 19th century already! Should I be saying "golly gee whiz" instead, or is that offensive too??

 

So. He knows my view on the word. He seldom uses it in front of me anymore. (probably to be spared hearing - again - my anachronistic view on the matter, rather than in deference to my actual opinion.) Either way, at least he knows there IS a standard, and when he interacts with other adults or in a more professional setting (like scholarship or job interviews or something), he is unlikely to trot out that word. For that reason, I think it merits a quiet reminder to the boys, even though they'll probably think you're a little silly for it. After all, teen boys don't seem to naturally think much about how they come across to other (non-teen) people, so it is our job to help them become more aware of that.

 

 

[scoutldr]

Time for an English lesson. Just tell them they are not allowed to use words if they don't know what they mean. A brief search online tells me that "fricking" is a derivative of "frigging" which is (or was) a sexual term...from the Latin "fricare"...to rub.

 

At my wife's elementary school, they use this tactic. A boy was once sent to the office for fighting because someone called him "faggot"...he was told to look it up. Bewildered, he said, "why would he call me a bundle of sticks???"

[Hal_Crawford]

The next time you hear someone referred to as a geek have them look it up. Or just ask if he/she bites the heads off of chickens and snakes.

 

[Beavah]

Yah, you all are hopelessly out of touch with da youth.

 

Da language needs words to express mild annoyance, exasperation, and things bein' just a bit screwed up, eh? (Oops, did I now offend somebody by usin' the term "screwed up" because it refers to a hardware fastener?). Fact is, we're inventin' words in that category all the time. Doh! Da 50's generation still uses "Geez" but I don't reckon we castigate our senior colleagues about takin' the Lord's name in vain.

 

The kids are right. I've never heard any young person use the word "friggin'" or "frickin'" or whatever in a way that corresponds to the vulgar meanin' of the traditional F-word. If we adults are too dimwitted to understand the meanin' of language is contextual then I don't reckon we've got a leg to stand on criticizing the youth for their use of language.

 

Be grateful, SMT224. Your kids are expressing themselves while also making a choice not to use vulgarity. That's a choice which should be commended. There's plenty of lads out there who make regular use of the more traditional F-word with nary a thought.

 

Beavah

 

[Beavah]

Yah, and for those who are into their dictionary etymology:

 

golly

slang for "God", used as kind of oath or asseveration among the "lowest people." (1775)

 

So I reckon "golly gee whiz" is probably a double-swear oath with an added vulgarity. "God and Jesus pee!" Or somesuch. Leave it to Beavah was quite da vulgar show, eh?

 

I don't think throwin' dictionary roots at the lads is a leg we can stand on either, eh?

 

Beavah

(This message has been edited by Beavah)

[packsaddle]

I agree, Especially when the Beav's name was Beaver Cleaver, used to be a bumper sticker with something about that I think. So while I agree with the spirit of Beavah's post, poor use of language is probably not going to make a strong positive impression at interview time. Best to avoid the habit if possible.

[John-in-KC]

Much as we talk about a friendly cup of coffee with our fellow adults, three ways to quietly address language challenges are:

 

- Make sure we model language usage that is not vulgar or "guttersnipe" (as Mom told me all those years ago) ourselves.

 

- Have a quiet comment in a Scoutmaster minute about being "good people" and not using common street language.

 

- Ditto in various SM conference opportunities.

 

Don't teach, don't preach, and certainly don't dwell on it. Otherwise, the youth connect the dot: This is Mr X's button, and they'll push it every chance they have.

[skeptic]

Gotta go with Lisa on this one. From my perspective, the word and its variants simply replace using the widely unacceptable in general conversation. If they thought they could get away with it, it would be the actual word, just as they hear and see used in movies (which we know they see somehow)or is used by far too many of the pop culture icons. They have learned, for the most part, to not do that in front of me, nor, for that matter, use other substitutes for generic swearing. Of course, I realize they continue to do it otherwise. Very unlikely to have much affect on the I am afraid.

 

But, one can hope.

[CalicoPenn]

I've heard and used fricking, farging and frigging, usually when I'm muttering to myself while trying to fit Tab A into Slot B and in my mind, I am replacing the more vulgar.

 

On the other hand, I have never - ever - heard someone say "frick you" or "farg you" or "frig you" which gets me thinking that the "ing" at the end of the more vulgar word can result in that word having a less vulgar, more agitated exasperation conotation to it.

 

Yet on the other, other hand - I try very hard (and usually succeed) not to use a vulgarity or a substitution. I think it is perfectly appropriate in Scouting not to accept substitutions as acceptable language during Scout functions and the best way to address it is, as has been suggested, Scoutmaster's Minutes (not a preachy don't do this approach but more a "have you thought of the impression you make on other people when you use these words" approach).

 

As for the English lesson - time for a history lesson - back in the middle ages, when the Church would regularly burn "witches" and "heretics" at the stake, they would often tie up homosexuals among the bundles of sticks used to fuel the fires to burn them to death at the same time. Thus the perjorative use of the word "faggot" meaning "bundle of sticks" to also refer to homosexual men - this isn't some kind of 20th century perjorative - it's been used in that context for centuries.

 

While it may seem like a clever idea to send the recipient of a hateful slur to the dictionary, would we send a black child to the dictionary to look up the entymological root of the "n" word which, without one "g", is Latin for black?

[Dizzy ona cliff]

Teacher: Tommy there are two words that I would like for you to stop using. One is swell and the other is lousy.

Tommy: Well, okay, what are the words?

[Hal_Crawford]

Calico:

Your post reminded me of an award ceremony I lit in Atlanta in the 1970's. The winner for the Best Experimental Theatre production was a play called The River Niger. The presenter was a local drama critic, a white woman in her 70's. She opened the envelope and mispronounced the winner in the worst way possible. The audience let out a collective gasp and then held its breath. The presenter apparently did not know what she had said. The recipient, an african american director, accepted the award rather cooly and gave his acceptance speech without acknowledging what had been said. When the next presenter, another african-american came onstage the audience had yet to exhale. The presenter stepped to the microphone and said, "I think that we should all be glad that the last winner was not a man named Fuchs". The audience exhaled, laughed and then clapped. The moment passed and the show continued.

 

Hal

 

 

[GernBlansten]

I'd share a great anecdote, but I'm feeling rather niggardly tonight.

[Hal_Crawford]

Yeah, Gern. I'll bet your mother encouraged you to masticate at the dinner table.

Hal