Parents want a crossing over ceremony but not joining a Troop

[scottteng]

Our troop works the crossover for a very large pack. The pack gives them their AOL at the pack meeting inside and then they head out to the outside crossover. There are usually three or four troops to which various boys are crossing and they all have unique gifts and traditions that they do. The whole point is to crossover and be received by a troop if they are quitting they can take their AOL and go home. Most packs have some sort of gift they give to the AOL recipients as well. We "give" the boy crossing over a book, epaulets, and a warm welcome but before we do they or their parents have paid for these items with application and joining fee. No pay no goodies!

[fleetfootedfox]

We had 11 boys say they were crossing over but our SM did not believe all of them would. First troop meeting only six showed. Fortunately, he hadn't bought books for all of them. I think it would be a great idea to make them pay up before blue and gold.

[SSScout]

Well, hey,isn't that what we all are saying? Presenting the AoL is one thing.

Cub graduation is another...

Register with the Troop, pay the dues, and do the Bridging. Should be three seperate things, n'est pas ?

[Cubmaster Mike]

It's two things and I dealt with this a couple of years back.

 

Our Pack does a big Blue and Gold Arrow of Light ceremony with native american headresses, drums and bells. The boys receive their Arrow of Light and are recognized as graduating from the Pack. Then the boys go back for desert with theri dens and families while a bridge is set up for crossover. The two ceremonies are separate and distinct. Those boys who are crossing over are then called up along with the selected troops. Webelos who are not crossing over stay with their family.

 

One year I had a family decide not to move on. The boy still wanted to cross over, I told him that when he picks a troop we will be happy to have him come back to a Pack meeting to cross over or we will go to his selected troop and hold a cross over ceremony. Never got a call back.

 

Let's remember that one of the purposes of Cub Scouting is Preparation for Boy Scouts. It is right to recognize those that choose to stay in the program.

 

CMM

[Liz]

How would something like this work:

 

Hold an AOL ceremony for all 3 boys earning that reward.

 

At the end, *invite* those boys who want to join a Troop to "cross over." Make it part of the ceremony; something like, "Now that you have earned your Arrow of Light, you are ready to cross over the bridge and begin your Trail to Eagle. If you are ready for the next challenge, stand up and follow me."

 

Let the boys know ahead of time what's going on. Maybe only the one boy will do it, maybe the other boys will surprise you at the last minute and decide they want to do it. Any boys who DON'T do it should be reminded that they are eligible to cross over any time they are ready. Perhaps acknowledge their choice to pursue a different path other than the Trail to Eagle at this time, and wish them well on their other paths.

 

The crossover can be a fairly small segment of the AOL ceremony, and I don't think there's any reason to make the boys who aren't crossing over feel left out. And, frankly, if NONE of the boys were going on to a Troop, I wouldn't see any problem with a "crossing out" ceremony, really. But it does seem right to acknowledge the one boy who has decided to embark on the next segment of the Scouting journey, by letting him cross over.

 

Just a thought.

 

-Liz

[SSScout]

Liz: You are missing the point. AoL and Graduating From Cubs and Bridging Over to Boy Scouts are three entirely seperate things. B/CO is NOT part of the AoL. A Cub can earn AoL and not join a Scout Troop. If the Cub does not choose to join a Scout Troop, he should not participate in the Bridging. Give him the ceremony he deserves, but not one that is not appropriate.

The Cub can be recognized and celebrated for his accomplishment but should really not be part of a ceremony that is not his.

That is why AoL presentation should be held seperate from the Bridging ceremony and if the Cub does not join a Scout Troop, his Graduating from Cubs can be acknowledged seperately with appropiate seriousness.(This message has been edited by SSScout)

[Twocubdad]

Is that policy published somewhere?

 

I got a kick out of going to our pack's combination AoL/Blue & Gold/Webelos Crossover last week and they use the ceremony script that I wrote in 2002 or so. It combines all three functions and still allows opportunities for boys to slip in and out if they didn't earn AoL or aren't joining the troop. It's possible to do and there is nothing that says a pack "should" do it one way or the other. Whatever works locally.

 

I think the main point everyone should keep in mind is not to unnecessarily embarass or hold up a boy for ridicule for not earning AoL or choosing not to continue into Boy Scouts. The idea is to celebrate the accomplishments of the boys.

[Liz]

I understand what you're saying, SSS, but the parents here are asking for a "crossover" ceremony. I realize each thing is different, but many packs/troops combine the ceremonies. The parents have probably seen them done as combined thing for all the Webelos that have gone before, and they feel like something is left out if crossover is not part of their sons' AOL ceremony.

 

I was just trying to come up with a way the ceremony might feel more "complete" for people who feel the crossover and AOL are inseparable. I think it could be made meaningful to the one boy who is truly crossing over, as well as a last-ditch invitation for the other boys to include a "You, too, can cross over when you choose to" sentiment.

 

I've run into issues with the combined ceremony (which is how it was done when each of my boys earned his AOL), so I can see wisdom in keeping them separate. But if they've been combined traditionally in this pack, it may not be a good time (right now, at the last minute) to separate them out. It could work to make the AOL and crossover two different elements of the same ceremony, and each boy participates in the part(s) that pertain to him.

 

-Liz

[evmori]

If a Webelos isn't going on to Boy Scouts, what is he crossing over to?

[SMT224]

Troop tradition should always take precedence over parental demands.

 

If the Pack and Troop believe everyone should crossover, regardless of joining a Troop or not, then it should be discussed in the PLC, and Committee meetings. This is not a change that should be done simply to satisfy a few demanding parents.

 

The parents refered to in the original post by CNYScouter, need to be told that crossover is only for those boys going into a Troop. If the boy in not moving on to a Troop, then he cannot participate in the crossover, and that's that. If they have a problem with it, so what? They're leaving Scouting anyway.

 

When I have pandered to the special needs a few parents it has weakened the overall Program and they end up leaving anyway! It is important to the Scouts that the crossover is only for those going to a Troop. Making a change to satisfy a few confused parents will do nothing but make the ceremony less special to the boys who are actually going to a Troop.

[CubsRgr8]

+100! I, too, pandered and regretted it. That said, however, I offer this comment. It seems to me that far too many packs set up AOL as the culmination of Cub Scouting. It becomes the final award that all boys earn and receive at the same time - their last pack meeting. So I understand why parents have trouble getting the idea that cross-over isn't just part of the AOL award ceremenony.

 

[SSScout]

Twocubdad: You won't find any "published" policy about this issue. The awards are declared and issued by BSA, but the means of presentation are left to the unit. My Scout Troop has a notebook of almost a hundred different Court of Honor ceremonies. It is the same for a Cub Pack. Ceremonies are generally traditional and left to the creativity of the unit. "We've always done it that way". But there will be similar themes.

Nothing wrong with that, I've seen some ceremonies that left alot to be desired, and alot that were very memorable.

But it still should be remembered, even if you can successfully combine the three ceremonial functions (AoL, Cub graduation, Crossover ), they are still three seperate things. A Cub can earn the AoL and not 'Bridge' (or Crossover, or join) to a Scout Troop. In any event, the Cub will be graduating from his Pack. The three should not necesarily be the same.

 

Evori: Succinctly said.

 

SMT224: Exactly so. How important will it be to the Cubs actually JOINING a Troop, making that commitment, if some other Cub, without the same commitment, is allowed the same ceremony?

 

CNYScouter knows what should be done.

 

 

[jr56]

Ed hit the nail right on the head. If a boy isn't joining boy scouting, what is the point of a bridging ceremony. What does he do when he cross the bridge? As "Ask Andy" so rightly put it, "the bridge to nowhere".

[eagle90]

I agree, Ed hit it on the head. I think this is a carry over from the ongoing sentiment - Everyone gets a trophy; there are no winners and losers; we don't keep score; Not a good lesson in reality.

[Basementdweller]

Beyond the parents selfish wants for their boys, what are they crossing over too?????

 

 

It was expressed earlier, they should not get a cross over if they are not going to be a boy scout.

 

It is not proper to ask the troop to give the boys a book and neckerchief if they have no intention of crossing over.

 

They made the choice and must live with it. I would have the parents fill out the scout transfer application with fee before they are allowed to cross over. That would prevent them from just saying they are gonna do it and then back out.