Current economy and Scouting

[John-in-KC]

What are folks actually seeing on the ground as regards Scouting activities, especially beyond the Troop?

 

- I just saw the going rate from my Council for 2010 Jambo: 2100.

- NOAC is 650 a pop.

- Philmont costs over and above the trek itself?

- Sea Base?

- Northern Tier?

 

How much tap-in to Scoutreach $$ are you seeing for youth? How many new requests for camperships?

 

I guess the question I'm asking is what are your youth being told by their families, even if the Scout can do his own fundraising? Is that money needed for family and school, or are the youth being allowed some choice by families?

[GernBlansten]

We secured 4 crews for NTiers last summer for this coming summer. Over the winter, we've lost about 30% of the interested scouts from being able to go. So we had to turn back in one crew reservation. The remaining crews are reaching the minimum crew numbers and we may have to consolidate to two crews. Every one of the cancellations are due to the economy.

[gcnphkr]

We are looking to drive to NOAC, even though it will take 3 days each way. But with 8 scouts going that will save about $3000 over flying. We have far fewer going out to the out of state camp this summer. I understand the council camps are much fuller than usual and we recently received notice that Emerald Bay still has openings and would we like to come. Generally they book up the first day unless you are willing to go the shakedown week.

[Eamonn]

I ran into some scouter's from the area where I live over the weekend.

All were singing the blues.

Two guys had been laid off, another works for a company that is leaving the area and has said that over the next few months everyone will go.

They all said that Troop fund raising events were not meeting expectations. People are not spending the money on things like Pancake Breakfasts and candy bars.

The Council I serve doesn't offer any help for anything other than our own Council summer camp.

The full cost for sending a Scout to summer camp this year is now $285.00.

I'm not sure how this compares with other Council Summer Camps?

I have to admit to feeling a little bad about the cost. As some years back our camping committee seemed to have no idea of what it cost to run the camp and seemed focused on not having the fee go up by more than $5.00 a year. Needless to say we were losing a lot of money.

I pushed for the fee to be raised so that we broke even.

I wish I could remember when this was?

At the time camp cost $135.00.

I haven't been involved in or with the camping committee for a while!

The camping committee takes care of Camperships, the money comes from the camp budget and there is an unwritten rule that no one gets more than 50%.

Talking with our program director, it does seem that we have about the same number of campers this year as we had last year.

Ea.

[Lisabob]

I would describe most of the families of boys in our troop as middle/upper middle class and so there's a bit of a buffer for many of them. However, we also have a lot of boys whose parents work in or around the auto industry or for state gov't and neither of those lines of work are secure these days. The troop is going out of state to summer camp and while the camp looks wonderful (Camp Read in NY), it is a little more expensive than local camps. I think the base fee was $310 while most camps around our area are $250 or so. Add in the travel costs (driving, let's hope gas stays low) and it looks closer to $400 for summer camp this year. A number of parents have voiced concerns. We'll see how many boys attend.

 

So far boys in our troop have been allowed by parents to continue to fundraise and to use their own pocket money to defray costs. But FOS donations have fallen pretty flat.

 

 

[Eagle92]

My neck of the woods was suffering even before the recession, and it's getting worse. I know I will have cut back on my FOS pledge this year as #1 I got another mouth to feed and #2 oldest will be a TC next year and I am saving up for some of the new programs my council will be offering.

 

On the two occasions that I have heard our new SE talk, he's talked about how less than half our scouts are going to any summer camp, and the reason is finances. He wants the OA to raise more camperships so that more people can go to camp, and I think he wants to expand it to CS Resident camp as well, at least that is the impression I'm getting.

 

 

I'll be doing my part at the patch auctions trying to get some CS uniforms as they appear (yep they appear form time to time at OA auctions)!

[SR540Beaver]

I have four scouter buddies who all work for the same company. Today is the day the company is laying off thousands around the nation and they are waiting to hear their fate. Two of these guys are scouters in my home troop and they are sending their sons to Jambo. That could change depending on whether or not they still have a job. Another scouter in our troop is a programmer and he is looking for a job. My wife makes a little more than me, so she is the "major" bread winner in the house. Her national company has been having waves of lay offs, but she has dodged the bullet so far. I hope that continues as both my son and I are going to Jambo and he is also going to Philmont in 2010. Jambo and Philmont combined will set us back at least $8000. I would have loved to send him to NOAC, but it just isn't possible. I'm an ASM for one of our Jambo troops and we had a meeting last night. One of the topics of discussion was the number of kids who are behind on payments. The really frustrating thing is that we are going out of our way to come up with fundraising opportunities and there are a good number who are not availing themselves of the opportunities.

[SR540Beaver]

Just got word that one of the two scouters in our troop that works at the same place is keeping his job......for now. Still waiting to hear on the other one and the two fellow non-troop scouters who work with them.

[SR540Beaver]

The other scouter in our troop found out this morning that he too will be keeping his job.

[GKlose]

Had lunch with our DE yesterday, and told him that although we have a healthy FoS goal for this year (and only met about 60% of last year's goal), that the economy will be affecting things. He countered with the mantra of the SE -- "philanthropy has increased every year since blah, blah, blah". I'll bet they'll see the hit not only in FoS, but also in high-ticket things coming up -- camp attendance, WB signup, the council Philmont contingent, the centennial Jamboree contingent, etc.

 

I also told him that although I don't fret about it, because it is way beyond my control, I have no idea how long I will be employed. The "industry" is actively being shipped overseas. This is kind of foreign territory to him. While he might have to worry about district and council consolidation, at least he doesn't have to worry about outsourcing.

 

Guy

[mmhardy]

Our net effect is to pull back from some expensive and far flung camp outs. Gettysburg and some other out-of-state events may have to be thrifted back has our boy's families at staring down at layoffs in the auto sector here in SE Michigan. We are looking at 1/2 a tank or less events. (Of course being in the Great Lakes area we are all ready spoiled with some of the most beautiful on-shore summer camping in the mid west. )

 

F-O-S...forget about it. They are lucky with the status quo. United Way cut us off last year. Hard Times.

[moxieman]

Guy wrote: "he doesn't have to worry about outsourcing"

 

Shhhhhh...don't give your council ideas! Otherwise, you'll start dealing with a DE with a strong accent over the phone/internet-video protocol only.

 

More seriously, folks in my area are "use to" being poor. Our economy tanked nearly two decades ago and never fully recovered after the previous "recession" in the early '90's. But it's starting to show more now. At this time for the last National Jamboree, we had filled three troops, requested, received and filled a forth troop. This time around, I've heard we've filled 1.5...maybe 1.75 by now. Cost to attend from here is roughly $1800 with the before/after side trips. They will be taking tour buses down/back.

 

Summer of '07, my brother's troop did a car smash fundraiser at their town's Forth of July festivities, where more than 40,000 gather--it's one of the largest celebrations in Maine. They cleared over $500 on the event. In '08, they lost $6. How do you lose money at a fundraiser? They had less takers then the cost of the liability policy they needed to have in place for the event and they couldn't find a donor to provide the policy like the year before.

 

I've heard similar from other units and their fundraisers, but not in the extreme my brother experienced. Just that the units aren't making as much on fundraisers. I noticed the same thing at work with girl scout cookie sales. I saw two flyers posted and only half the number of orders that were placed last year. No one can spare as much money this year.

 

I'm not sure in other areas at this time. The units don't talk directly to me about what they're observing other than the comments I've heard about fundraisers. It's not "my business" in my current position as roundtable commissioner to ask either.

[ScoutOne]

This year will probably not be as bad as next year. Those already planning are more likely to still participate. This is more so true in middle to upper-middle class areas. There is a delay, as when the economy turns down people will hold off planning future trips.

 

Next year will be especially worse as national programs tend to run on a jamboree cycle. The slowest years are when there is a jamboree as councils do not bring contingents and units do not plan trips as a few of their scouts may go to the jamboree. This will be combined with a expected downturn in 2010 Sea Base and Northern Tier reservations, and there is still time to pull out of already made Philmont 2010 reservations.

 

If the anticipated new national high adventure base opens (sorry, I have not been following the details on this) many units may choose to go there instead of Sea Base, Northern Tier, or Philmont.