shortridge Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 evmori, I read "in the presence of the boys" in the original post to mean "in the presence of the boys." The dining fly generally isn't a location away from program participants, but usually a gathering place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vcrew66 Posted February 4, 2009 Author Share Posted February 4, 2009 To clarify: According to the witnesses, the smoking happened in the dining fly, right after dinner, with scouts coming and going with their dishes, etc. during evening duties time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evmori Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 Yeah smoking is bad for ya. Do people smoke? Yep. Should it be done away from the Scouts? Yep! When I was a smoker, the porch (yes I had a porch) in front of my tent at summer camp was off limits to the Scouts. That is where the leaders hung out. Did we smoke? Yep. Could the boys see us? Yep. Did they know we smoked? Yep. Were we away from them? Yep on the other side of the campsite. Did we drink coffee? Yep. And we even ate chips! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hal_Crawford Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 Ed: A couple of months ago you were pretty rigid about enforcing BSA rules when it came to an unmarried adult couple sharing a tent. You said it set a bad example. Now when it is about smoking, your attitude is, yeah we did it scouts saw it so what? How are these two situations different? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eisely Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 Of all the available vices, smoking tobacco is fairly low in my personal ranking. I too enjoy an occasional cigar, but have never had one anywhere close to a scout event of any kind. A private word without a public humiliation or argument is the best way to proceed. I thinking drinking on an outing is a much more serious issue for a variety of reasons. Drinking impairs judgment and the last thing I want to have to deal with in any emergency is an impaired person. Smoking may be nasty and unhealthy but to my knowledge it does not impair performance and judgment the way alcohol or even some medications do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortridge Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 evmori, Did you by any chance graduate from the Donald Rumsfeld Academy of Q&As? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evmori Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 Smoking isn't a youth protection issue, is it? I agree it's a bad habit & one I kicked about 10 years ago. As long as the adults are in their own area & not intermingling with the youth and not violating any laws while they are using tobacco products, I have no problem with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWOMORROWS Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 We have several adult leaders who are overweight. We are thinking about asking them to step down and not attend any more meetings or campouts. How should we approach them? I think that is it a bad example and if the scouts see that they are overweight then they will think it is Ok and will begin to overeat so that they can emulate their leaders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CalicoPenn Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 Seems there is a much simpler solution than all the hand-wringing going on about the G2SS, the rules, were they in sight, should people smoke out of sight, etc. etc. etc. - and it's a friendly and courteous way of handling it too. Ask the Scoutmaster for a moment of his time - privately. Without any anger or judgement (very important), simply explain that some of the Scouts had approached you as a neutral party (also important - you need to remain neutral - you're just being the messenger here) about the adult leaders on the trip passing out and lighting up cigars during evening chore time (don't be accusatory, you're just repeating what they said) and that they were uncomfortable with this and would prefer it if the adults would do so in private next time, and they asked you to be their messenger because they felt uncomfortable speaking up about it because they want to remain respectful. Calico Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 Like Shortridge, my asthma is triggered by even minute bits of cigarette smoke. If there's not a stiff breeze blowing it consistently away from me, I can have an attack triggered by someone smoking 50 yards away, outdoors (or further, if the wind's actually blowing it my way). Most of my asthma attacks are triggered by smokers who are far enough away that I can't see or smell them until it's too late and my lungs are already swelling shut. I used to have a neighbor across the street who was a smoker, and in the summer I kept having attacks every time they opened a window. I had to keep all my windows shut all summer long, and eventually had to move away because of it. I know this is extreme, but I'm really not the only person who is severely allergic to tobacco smoke. I do not feel that smoking is appropriate in the presence of boys. The example it sets is only a small part of it. It's bad enough as an adult to have to approach someone and say "You're affecting my health" (and I don't dare approach until the cigarette is out anyway). It is unhealthy for the kids to be exposed to the toxins in cigarette smoke. What's wrong with taking a LONG walk, to the parking lot or wherever, and taking your smoke there if it's absolutely necessary? And hasn't anybody ever heard of the nicotine patch? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packsaddle Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 Liz, I am completely sympathetic. Any adult ought to be able to go without tobacco for the duration of a scouting event. BSA should have a total prohibition of it. You know, if the Mormon Church wanted to exert a positive influence on this topic...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagledad Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 >>You know, if the Mormon Church wanted to exert a positive influence on this topic...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
namu35950 Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 I understand completely about not using tobacco infront of young adults, and share you thoughts about it. I certain hope the post about overweight leaders was a joke. Being overweight myself it hits a little home. But I still give my time to help with the scouts. Maybe we should also say the people with red hair should not help, so the boys will not want to dye there hair red, or tell boys who are overweight not to attend because we dont want the other boys to start eating to much. I could go on forever..... the truth of the matter is giving the boys the right tools to make decisions that will benefit them the most in life. If that comes from a red headed overweight smoker who cares about the boys future should we judge them for helping? I totally agree with following the rules to the letter. But lets not descrimate those who follow the rules and give there time to help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SctDad Posted February 5, 2009 Share Posted February 5, 2009 So I am understanding this with what has been said so far. Overweight leaders need to step down. smokers need to give up the habit for the week or weekend. I think that you will lose a lot of leaders this way. Here is how we have handled this topic with our pack. If you smoke during the day, you need to make a quality attempt to seperate yoruself from the rest of the boys. Go around the chow tent or go down by the river if no boys are fishing. After all boys are in bed and have been there for a little while, usually 30 minutes, then adults amy sit around the campfire and smoke, with the understanding that if a boy wakes up and comes out of the tent then the cigarettes need to disappear quickly, right into the fire. Our pack has determined that as adults and leaders we need to make attempts to keep smoking away from the boys. If we outlaw it then we will probably lose parents and leaders. And being that we are in such a shortage, we can make accomidations. As long as they try, then we are happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vicki Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 I have been known to enjoy the occasional cigar with a few like-minded adult leaders around a campfire after the scouts are tucked in. Not even close to every campout and not at all with my current troop. But I wouldn't even think of doing that under the dining fly with scouts coming and going. I do believe that has to stop. Hopefully a quiet conversation along with the appropriate language from the G2SS will do it. I wouldn't try to have that conversation while I was livid, however. Vicki(This message has been edited by Vicki) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now