CA_Scouter Posted January 6, 2009 Author Share Posted January 6, 2009 j/kc... sorry I mean 'grandmothering'.. ;-) So for 15 years they don't need the SSN and now they require it. Why not just let it be after all this time? OK, I'll go along with requiring it for new members for a background check, but for 15+ year members? Pack... so I'll just tell her 'thanks for your 15 years of going to bat for us with the org, thanks for providing a meeting place, storage, providing us with leads for fundraisers and community service, thanks for bringing in the firefighters during their time off to do first aid demos for us... and by the way, don't let the door hit you on the butt on your way out.' B-E-A-utiful! sheesh A scout is trustworthy... LOYAL .... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packsaddle Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 My personal opinion is that they should not be 'requiring' the SSN. But my opinion means nothing for this issue. Your statement is, in fact, the message from BSA to any of us who do not meet the membership requirements regardless of length or quality of service. It's not all about US. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle92 Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 CA Since the COR is a member of the district committee, do they have a working relationship with the DE? I'ld have her talk to the DE about the situation. I'ld also stress how by losing her, the unit may fail to recharter b/c the CO no longer wants a unit. That will get the DEs attention. Maybe a compromise can be worked out. Packsaddle did bring up a topic that is near and dear to my heart. maybe that is an added benefit of this new policy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CA_Scouter Posted January 7, 2009 Author Share Posted January 7, 2009 Pack.. Yea, I know, I'm just frustrated. Seems like we are throwing the baby out with the bathwater. ( I should stop with the cliches' eh? ) E92 - yup, I've made this known to the DE, waiting to hear back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hal_Crawford Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 With regard to the scout who will age out in two weeks. The COR is not being allowed to reregister but her current registration probably won't expire in the next two weeks. She is still a member, she can sign. She might not be a member at the end of February but Eagle candidate won't be a youth member either. Check with the DE but I don't see a need to transfer. Good luck to you all, the COR, the unit and the Eagle candidate. Hal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evmori Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 molscouter, Without a SSN, an accurate credit report can not be obtained. And if it isn't accurate, it could result in a person being denied membership for something that isn't theirs. A credit report isn't the same as an insurance claim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eagle732 Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 I know we have some lawyers out there who can answer this question. When is an individual required by law to submit their SS#? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Skipper Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 A few years ago, a local Girl Scout leader was taking her scouts' SSN from their applications. She used them in an elaborate tax fraud scheme, netting herself some $87,000. She is now in a federal minimum security facility. I think BSA was recording youth SSNs at that time. The next year I noticed it was dropped from the youth app. I always suspected that it was because of this incident, but that is purely speculation on my part. GSA has also dropped the youth SSNs from their apps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoutldr Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 I'm not a lawyer, but I think the answer is "whenever you file for SS benefits." (and maybe a tax return). The SSN is issued by the federal govt and it says right on the card "not to be used for identification purposes". Even in the federal govt, whenever I am "asked" for my SSN, it is accompanied by a Privacy Act notice which says "disclosure is voluntary", however that is followed by a list of consequences if I don't volunteer the information (like loss of employment). As private citizens, we cannot be forced by the "law" to disclose private information to a private corporation. However there can be consequences for not doing so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packsaddle Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 I agree with Scoutldr. However, in this case I think that CA_Scouter is trying to make the point that the consequences to BSA and to the boys are the negative consequences, and not to the excluded adults. I think that's correct but BSA has probably decided that most of us will just roll over on this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evmori Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 I think, scoutldr, what that means is your SSN card is not a valid form of ID like your drivers license. I don't think it means it can't be required for membership & other things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CA_Scouter Posted January 7, 2009 Author Share Posted January 7, 2009 UPDATE AFter all this hullabaloo, I found out last night that Council already had her SSN. She must have given it to them sometime in the past and had forgotten about it, so all the uproar was really over nothing. However, Pack's got it right. I'm still of the opinion that SSN should not be a condition of membership for scouters who were registered prior to 2003. Thanks for your input everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
molscouter Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 Ed, Reread what I wrote. I said I understand why BSA is asking for it, because they are conducting credit and background checks. My point was there numerous entities that ask for it as a matter of practice for no good reason and those are the one's who I object to giving it to. The doctor's office I mentioned is one example. One of my local grocery stores asks for it to obtain their discount card (the grapes are $3.00/lb, but if you have this card they're $2.00/lb). They can't tell me why, just that they need it. Is my money any better if they've checked my credit. They will accept my cash/check/credit/debit card either way; it's not affecting my ability to shop there.(This message has been edited by molscouter) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoutingagain Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 Pack has already pointed out that as a private organization, the BSA has a right to establish it's own membership standards and requirements. They may include avowed sexual orientation, religious elements, height/weight requirements, requirement to provide SSN or anything else they wish to add. Those that don't agree are free start their own youth organization. I suspect the loss of grandfathering has to do with some well publicized adverse publicity several years back regarding one long time scout executive that was found to have inappropriate material on his work computer and possibly misdeeds by other long time volunteers that have never had a background check. All the long time serving pros and volunteers may not be appropriate personnel for their positions in a youth organization and this is an effort to correct historical errors that leave the BSA open to liability and youth open potential harm. Yes, while one may not be legally required to provide a social security no., the BSA has no legal obligation to maintain membership for anyone who doesn't. SA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evmori Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 s my money any better if they've checked my credit. If your credit is really horrible, maybe you would get no discount! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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