Scout to Scouter transition

[acco40]

A troop recharters in January. A Scout is registered for the year. He turns 18 during that year. He files no additional paperwork. After turning 18 does he automatically become a Scouter (i.e. registered adult)? If so, at what position? If not, does he become a non-registered member in the eyes of the BSA?

 

 

[gcook1]

I'm not sure on official BS policy. But in our troop, once you're 18 you're considered non-registered and no longer in Boy Scouts as a Boy Scout. If a Scout wants to continue as a Scouter, he fills out an adult registration.

 

I like that approach simply because it gives us the opportunity to talk to him about expectations. He's an adult leader now, not a Boy Scout. We talk to him about what that means. How he'll be expected to make adult decisions. On outings, he's part of the 'Fraid Knot' patrol...our adult patrol. (get it? What they think our answer is too often...'fraid not) So, for instance, when a Scout pulls his cellphone out to call his girlfriend on an outing, the Scouter is expected to take it away and turn it in to the Scoutmaster.

[croushorn]

They need to do the adult application. There are numerous differences, including the SS# for the background check.

[acco40]

Gents - I know what they should or need or could do. My question is, if they do nothing, what is their status wrt the BSA?

 

 

[Lisabob]

non-member.

[FScouter]

I would guess the computer would reject renewed membership of an 18 year old as a youth member in a troop and his name would not appear on the new membership list.

[Eagledad]

Lisabob is right, offically it is "non-member". But I would like to see what the computer does.

 

Barry

[Eagle92]

I don't know about the new programs that BSA uses, but once upon a time they kept you listed as a youth. I filled out the paperwork to be a scouter and was listed on the charter as such. A friend of mine the same age, was accidentally left on the charter as a youth for 2 more years. Plus I can give you a few other examples of aged out youth's being left on charters.

[Twocubdad]

HIJACK NOTIFICATION

 

Please allow me to change the question a bit. So what do you do with this kid?

 

All the boys I've had age out -- and given the demographics of the troop, there have been many -- most are in the last few months of their senior year and only make an occasional guest appearance at troop meetings. Two of my best Eagles drop in occassionally and have even gone to a couple days of summer camp. They don't DO anything, other than hang out and set good examples, which is a terrific thing.

 

Now I have a new Eagle, just turned 18 but is just beginning his senior year. He'll be around for at least another year. The lad is very immature and commands very little respect from the other Scouts. He has some isssues, but I'll leave it to say he is fairly high maintenance, requiring a lot of adult involvement, although not necessarily adult supervision.

 

Last campout he was goofing off and was the last one holding up the troop's departure. We had the "you're an adult leader now" talk and I explained it's no longer my job to keep up with him.

 

He is involved in OA, but there are no nearby Venturing crew nearby.

 

Bottom line is that the kid is a net consumer of resources, not a contributor. Clearly, he's not ready to serve as a true ASM. I know the book answer is that we can decline his adult application and just tell him "no thanks". While that may be permissible, I don't feel like it's the right thing either.

 

His birthday was with the last month, so I've not had a chance for a real sit down talk. I plan to require he take training at the next possible opportunity -- maybe even requiring he complete the training before attending another campout. What else would you guys put on the agenda for that meeting? How would you manage his involvement in the troop? Options?

[Gunny2862]

First, to the original question: At our Council offices the former youth is recognized as being in an incompatible registration status on an exception report which generally gets noticed by the registrar who them forwards an appropriate notice letter to the Scoutmaster(although I think it should go to the CC) asking whether the former youth is going to apply as an adult or not.

 

Second, for twocubdad,

would you try to defer an adult who registered from coming on campouts? Do you have resources (non-program delivery oriented but camping parents) who could manage this distracting adult OR does the former Scout in question just do his own thing and not bother the Scouts? As long as he pays his way and doesn't get in the way of the program for the youth then it might be worthwhile having him along simply as an additional adult resource.

Now if he is still pretending to be a Scout and distracting from program delivery to the boys(or as you gave an example habitually delaying the Troops timelines) then it's time to let the CC have him because managing adults is supposed to be his area while you continue on working with the Scouts.

IMVHO(This message has been edited by Gunny2862)

[Eagle92]

it can be challenging for a new scouter, especially if the youth still view him as such. I had that problem with some of my challenging scouts. One thing i've seen done in other scouting associations is that once you age out, you need to join another unit to prevent that conflict.

 

As for the immature new scouter, he needs a wake up call and fast. I had to report a YPT issue to my boss because a young scouter, turned 18 the week before the incident,did something at summercamp like he was just one of the guys. While I do not know what happened to the young man, the possibility of criminal charges and permanent disbarment from BSA were brought up by the SE. Obviously once I brought it to the SE's attention, it became his problem and not mine, and I had no further dealings with the matter.

 

He definitely needs YPT and Fast Start ASAP. And if he is a slacker as described, I would even review it with him as well.I would also have a meeting with him and the CC. He needs to be given some guidelines, advice and expectations to his performance. He needs to know that just because he is an Eagle, doesn't automatically make him an ASM. Further because he is an Eagle MORE is expected from him. He needs to set the example because he IS the one the younger scouts will look to and emulate. He supposedly lives up to the Scout Oath and Law by earning Eagle, but now he is under a microscope because he is wearing that knot. He MUST live up to the high expectations.

 

Further I would discuss in this meeting that his performance to date as a leader has not met standards and he needs to improve, giving him until the next recharter. Otherwise you can remove him from the charter and ask that he joins another unit as a Scouter.

 

Good Luck

 

PS. make sure he filled out a Scouter application.(This message has been edited by Eagle92)(This message has been edited by Eagle92)

[John-in-KC]

There is always the option of placing him as a youth member in a Venturing Crew...

 

As far as youth member in Boy Scouting, when EagleSon turned 18, he removed his youth patches from his uniform, went to local tailor, and had knots properly sewn on. That summer he went to Scout Camp with a Troop, albeit as a Venturer, but took FS, YP, NLE, and SM Essentials in his week.

 

It actually helped him later that summer when he was staffing a Cub Scout camp.

[GKlose]

I think that sounds like a good plan...fill out the application, get him started on training, and then give him some responsibility.

 

I can see two possible difficulties:

1. he doesn't want the responsibility, or can't handle it, and stops showing up

2. he resists training, etc. However it seems you'd be working from a stronger position if all adults in your troop have been trained, have responsibilties, etc.

 

Then again, it may all be eye-opening for him too. This isn't just a bunch of parents and scouts that show up and stuff happens, right? It takes planning, resources, understanding the program, and all sorts of stuff.

[NeilLup]

To answer the original question, my understanding is that a Scout who turns 18 during the year remains a Scout until the Troop reregisters. He is no longer permitted to advance but does remain a member. (As noted often, advancement is one of the 8 methods, not the be all and end all of Scouting.) At age 18, he is permitted but not required to register as an asst. Scoutmaster. Upon reregistration, he either must be registered as an adult or his registration dropped. If he is mentally challenged, he can remain a Scout and advance as long as his mental age is under 18.

 

Please don't ask me what the sleeping arrangements need to be for a person over age 18 who is still registered as a Scout. I can speculate but it would indeed be only speculation.

 

With the consent of the local council, if there is no Venturing Crew available, he could, I imagine, register as a Lone Venturer and still be active with the Troop after age 18.

[emb021]

"To answer the original question, my understanding is that a Scout who turns 18 during the year remains a Scout until the Troop reregisters."

 

He main be on the troop roster, but once he turns 18 he is no longer a scout.

 

Something similiar happens with those registered with Venturing Crews when they turn 21. Again, they stop being a Venturers, which ends advancement, they can't hold office in the Crew (or at any level above the crew), etc, but they remain on the roster until the Crew recharters.

 

Some people argue these Venturers are somehow still venturers after 21, which is nonsense.

 

"Please don't ask me what the sleeping arrangements need to be for a person over age 18 who is still registered as a Scout. I can speculate but it would indeed be only speculation."

 

A person over 18 is not a scout. So sleeping arrangements need to be adjusted.

 

"With the consent of the local council, if there is no Venturing Crew available, he could, I imagine, register as a Lone Venturer and still be active with the Troop after age 18."

 

There is no such thing as a long Venturer. Lone Scouts are only for Cub Scouts or Boy Scouts, not Venturing.