Opinions, Please (long)

[Novice_Cubmaster]

Hi Anonymous,

 

A word of warning - make sure you know how your CO feels about scouting before dragging them into the fracas. If the CO isn't committed to scouting, they may decide that chartering your unit isn't worth the effort of settling your problems.

 

NC

[Eagle Foot]

Hi,

 

When I read about things like this I can't help but wounder why there is so much of the same type of problems. We seem to have more problems from the adults than we do from the Scouts.

 

The Troop may not be dying, but is it growing? Hang in there give it some time, but during the time you must do you homework. Get trained if you haven't, get everything you can sink your teeth on. Experience all of the oppertunities that are offered for adult leadership training.

 

Now you say why should I do all of this if the Troop is going down? Well eventually the boys will decide who they they will work with and who they won't work with. Who knows the SM may see you doing all of this and take a turn, maybe...manbe not. But that does't really matter, what's important is you learn all you can, do you best and always...always...always keep the boys in mind and follow the Scout Oath and Law. If it doesent fit into the Scout Oath and Law then it isen't something you need to do.

 

Now after all of that...I had the same experience a number of years ago, in fact our Troop now has what we call a runagade adult, that just compleated Woodbadge, we are all wrong and she is right. Yes I said (she), but just because she is a she isen't important, I've got a he that's a runagade...so gender is not the problem. It's experience and maturity that seem to be the problem (or lack of). Kind of like being out in the ocean, your gonna run into some rough weather. Now being said what kind of boat are you in?

 

I found that I had to find a bigger, stonger, faster, safer boat. I just coulden't keep getting into that little boat and face those large storms, I needed something that could power us through them.

 

So...after much thought and concideration, because if you are to be a SM you're gonna have to spend at least 1 hour per week byond the Troop meeting...or do I mean 1 hour per every 6 hr....Being a good SM will take some effert, because it is for the boys, then you got the adults...you will need a good Committee Chairman (ChairMan)is the point here, no discrimination intended.

 

Sometimes you need to change ships, like you said it's like bailing water with a can on the Titanic! You need to study you're ship...da we thought the Titanic was pretty strong too.

 

My point is this...if you are unhappy, if your son is unhappy, if the other boys are unhappy, then we don't have a happy family! The beauty of all of this is we are volunteers, we don't need suprises, no suprises in Scouting this causes problems. Then we can take our feet elsewhere, even though this Troop may have been around for fourty years doesen't mean it will be around another, maybe so, maybe not.

 

The things you are talking about are warning signs to me. If I find another charter organization, if I take 5 (what is required) boys and if I have a good person that understands what a Committee ChairMAN responsibilites are, and is trainable, will I, but mostly will your son and the other boys be more happy? Even knowing you will have to start over...equipment wise...will they be better?

Will you be giving them the better oppertunity to operate as a boy run Troop?

As a SM I handed the program to the boys, they take it an run, sometimes they walk...but I kept giving it to them.

 

You need to read some information that Eagledad wrote:

 

http://www.scoutingideas.com/

 

This is a good site and the information that Barry has put out I refer to it often. It answered a lot of my questions!!!

 

Edited by Eagle Foot

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[OzarksOsage]

I was once at a training event where the question was asked: "Why did you become a leader for the BSA?" Answer: Because I believe in the ideals of the organization. Follow-up question: "Why do you CONTINUE to volunteer as a leader?" Answer: Because it's fun!

 

If you're not having fun, the boys probably will not be having fun. If the boys aren't having fun, they probably won't stick around too long. Being a leader _shouldn't_ be a chore (I know, sometimes it is) and meetings should be something to look forward to.

 

Yes, we do what we do "for the boys," but don't be a martyr. If the boys would be better served by joining another unit, then they should join another unit. Does the SM have something to prove? Kinda sounds like it.

 

It sounds like you've done your best to improve the situation. If it is clear that the powers that be will not listen to the will of the scouts, then you might as well move on. You've done your best, and that's all that can be expected of you.

 

Good luck to you.

 

OzarksOsage

[Anonymous]

It has been an interesting last few days, and many thing have become much clearer.

 

This weekend our District is having our Spring Camporee. (pioneering skills) The Patrols were preparing as per standard procedure.

 

Yesterday my son got an email stating that there would be no camping or cooking by Patrol at this event. He was one of the Scouts in charge of buying the food for his Patrol. The message explained that adults would cook for the entire Troop.

 

After dinner I made some phone calls and got a couple of answers. Certain mothers are tired of their boys coming home from weekends hungry. Our cooking has always been done by the boys, and most of the older Scouts are pretty good cooks. We try to duty roster one younger Scout with one older Scout for most duties. All of the menu planning, purchasing, preparation and clean up is done by the Scouts. The mothers are further suspicious of the cleanliness of the boys, the utensils, etc.

 

While talking to the SM, I came to realize what has been happening right in front of my nose.

 

We are about to become a mommy Troop. The mothers are going to be ubiquitous as a buffer between their boys and the program. I explained to her that this isn't the BSA method, it is exactly the opposite. She stated that it's going to be the program here from now on because it's what the parents want, and they pay the bills.

 

While I was talking to the adults, my son was talking to the boys. I guess this was the tipping point, as quite a few have decided to leave the Troop. Later last night, I got a call from an ASM from the other (Eagle Mill) Troop. I know him pretty well, and he graciously invited any Scout from our Troop who didn't want the new program to transfer to their (now) more traditional Troop. He said that they had been getting calls all evening. He stated further that his SM wanted me to serve as an ASM in the new Troop. I thanked him and their Troop, and told him that I would get back to them soon.

 

So I guess I'm going to lead a diaspora.

 

I suppose that, in hindsight, I should have payed more attention to the political goings on in the Troop.

 

The older Scouts, to a man, aren't going to the Camporee. I wonder what District will think when they see our campsite........

 

And I wonder what they'll think when they're flooded with Transfer Forms.........

 

It's going to be an interesting Thursday.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[John-in-KC]

Anonymous,

 

Thank you for the update. I still recommend a quiet, mature, exit visit with the IH of the Chartered Partner. IMO, they deserve to know why their Troop is about to have a membership drain.

 

As for the new Troop, let your son do the shopping. I'd actually recommend against signing on as an ASM anywhere you go initially. There'll be enough attempts to backstab you as is.

[evmori]

Good luck finding a new unit that actually wants to do Scouting!

[Anonymous]

I still recommend a quiet, mature, exit visit with the IH of the Chartered Partner. IMO, they deserve to know why their Troop is about to have a membership drain.

 

They know (or should) - the COR has a boy in the Troop. He is one of the younger Scouts, and she is part of the problem - or so I'm told.

 

Good luck finding a new unit that actually wants to do Scouting!

 

There are two Troops in our area, so there really isn't much of a choice unless we want to commute 20 miles or more. The boys from both Troops know each other.

 

I got a text from my son earlier that this is still going on at school. The Scouts from the other Troop are welcoming our boys to the Troop. Much excitement on that front.

 

 

 

[ScoutNut]

You claim the Troop is becoming a "mommy Troop". And yet, unless your Troop is made up of 100 % single moms, each Scout should have a male in their family somewhere. Where are they? You stated your SM said it's what the PARENTS want, and they pay the bills. This, to me implies BOTH mom and dad. You also claim that the families are transferring in droves. Unless the families that are leaving are 100 % single dads, then there are a good number of moms who do not like the new program either. Have the older Scouts families (dads AND moms) complained to the SM and the CC about the changes? After all, they "pay the bills" too.

 

This sounds to me more like the families (both moms AND dads) of the newer Scouts prefer a more Webelos 3 type of program.

 

I would also guess the other Troop's "more traditional" program means no women. Which I think you would prefer.

 

 

[Eagledad]

>>I would also guess the other Troop's "more traditional" program means no women. Which I think you would prefer.

[Karen_216]

IMO Anynomous and the boys are more upset that the boys are not able to run a program than that Mom's are involved. If they were allowed to do all the things that the BSA is designed to do - is not a goal to make responsible adults and good citizens??- they would all come around to the adjustment of having a female SM.

What this new SM is doing is failing to cut the apron strings. It's called "hovering" and won't end here. When johnny goes to college mom will set up his room and make sure he's Ok prob even call the teachers to check up on him. Maybe even go to some of his classes. Never realzing she's creating a dependant that will move back in with her and sit on her couch for years. It's not just a scout problem. Unfortunately these "hoverers" are now in control of a previos well running troop.

Reminds me of the discussion once I had w/ a bunch of other Mom's who wouldn't allow their kids to go potty at kindergarten because thye were afraid they wouldn't wipe their bottoms right.... Advance 10years....johnny is still not allowed to wipe himself.

If the kids go hungry- that is their choice-- i'm sure they can stand 1 missed meal

If they dont' wash and come home dirty-- who does it hurt??

Sounds like this new troop is being very welcoming. I'd say bye to the old and embrace the new. Get the SCOUT RUN prgram the boys want.

Soon those Mom's will be out there cooking for themselves and their own son's will probably soon revolt too. (or get tired of being teased by the other boys- don't think it won't happen!!)