Drivers License and Eagle

[torribug]

In a moment (or two....or three) of frustration with my son's periodic apparent lack of motivation to do ANYTHING other than watch television or learn a new lick or two on his guitar, I have threatened to withhold the driver's license. It is a pointless threat. We live one mile from the church where he goes to youth group and scouts, and another 100 yards away from where he attends school. He may not be particularly motivated, but he loves to walk. No reason to drive.

 

He is finally getting his act together (been Life for like 3 years now) and getting his project done. Not because of his license - but because he knows how much Scouting has meant to him, and this is his way to show it.

 

We are doing parent-taught driver's ed. He has to do the schoolwork before he can get his license. He hasn't touched it. He's working on his Eagle project instead - because it matters more to him than a driver's license.

 

My point is, I guess, that if the scouting experience has been good for a boy, he will go all the way. If it hasn't been meaningful, he won't see the value in it. Why force it?

 

 

[Bob White]

I never suggested talking to each scout the same or treating each scout the same. I simply said that what the parent uses as a motivation does not alter the requirements or how and what we do as leaders. So what the parent wants to use is the parents buisness not ours.

 

Maybe if you could give me an example it would help?

How would you change scouting for the scout if you knew what the parents motivation was. What would do you change what you do if you didn't know what the parents use as motivation?

 

What if you ask the scout and he doesn't tell you. What if you ask the parents and they don't tell you.

 

How does any of this change what you do?

 

And if it doesn't alter what we would do, then why would it be any of our business?

 

Torribug, I think what you have chosen to do is fine, I also think that if you had chosen to base his license on his advancement that thats fine to. I think if you want to reward him with a car or money that would be fine as well. As the parent I see no reason for you to not be able to parent however you choose.

[Gunny2862]

BobWhite we've gone back and forth and said the same things over and over.

 

You either aren't getting what I'm saying or don't want to.

 

I'd say you win, but In my world you need to have gotten what I have repeatedly and in different forms tried to convey to you, and dismissed it for a reason, to have won.

 

 

I do get that you are saying that What the parents do does not affect what you expect from the Scout in the program and what your program responsibilities are. I don't disagree with these two very specific points.

 

I'd recap what I've been trying to get across again but feel you aren't interested and just want to argue.

 

 

I leave you the field.

 

YIS

[Bob White]

I really am trying to understand Gunny I just do not get your point.

[Major_Dad]

Gentlemen...Gentlemen...Gentlemen...I never intended my point to get far. I only wanted to point out that motivating a Scout to complete his Eagle...'for the RIGHT reasons'...is something we should all be attempting. The experience is truly something that changes some of them for life. As for me and mine, we very effectively use motivators to get our children to accomplish things that, as children, they may not see any value in doing. A young man often does not see the long term effects of getting good grades in school, or learning responsibilities, OR earning Eagle. It is usually not until they are married with children of their own that they realize the value of those thing they have or were made to endure as a young boy/young man. HOWEVER, if you are not having any success with holding incentives out to achieve a desired end state with your son, daughter, Scout, then you might be giving up too early. Remember, kids today have a network! They talk about what their parents do to them, require of them, etc. They console each other and motivate each other to hold out against their parents' desires for them...th world ios daily telling our children that their parents do NOT know what's best for them. We as parents need to tow the line and stick to our guns. My 16 year old Life Scout right now daily reminds me of my promise. I then remind him of the prommise I made to him. When we was a First Class Scout for over 3 years and he turned 15 and wanted his 'Learner's Permit,' I calmly informed him that if he would put forth the effort and complete his Star Scout requirements that I would, the very next day, take him to the DMV nd let him test for his Learner's...which I did. However, a word of caution, if the promises are hollow, our children very uickly see right through them. Sticking to your guns and your promises will not only maintain the respect of your children, but also instill in them similiar honorable and noble values...raisse up a child in the way they should go, and they will not soon part from it. Semper Fidelis.

 

YiS,

 

C.E. MARTIN

aka Major_Dad

[Venividi]

Let me offer an analogy by looking at this at a different level. Our aim is to develop character, citizenship, and fitness. One could offer an arguement that our youth should develop in these areas for the "right" reasons; say for example, because it is good for them, it is good for society, etc., - rather than for an external reward; i.e. Star, Life, Eagle. We as scouters use advancement as a method to develop character, citizenship and fitness, because it works. Even though the motivation for the youth may be to receive an award and recognition, the character traits embodied in the scout oath and law have become internallized.

[Gunny2862]

Major Dad and Venividi,

concur.

 

 

[Bob White]

I agree that as scout leaders should be conscientious in how "we" motivate scouts for ANY goal. My comments were directed at the topic of the thread, which asked our opinion about the way PARENTS motivate and about the personal motivations of the scouts for adveancement.

 

While we can influence, we cannot control other peoples motivations. Would you agree that for whatever motivation a scout or parent chooses, those personal motivations do not alter our role as leaders or the advancement process.

 

So why be concerned if a parent wants to use the DL as a motivator or not?

[evmori]

I think the concern comes because the feeling is the only reason the boy is even pursuing Eagle is because he will get his license if he "gets" Eagle. If it wasn't for the license motivation, the boy might not be in Scouts. Hence, how much effort will he actually put forth?

 

The upside is he is in Scouts & hopefully he will realize what he is into & step up to the plate & earn Eagle because he realizes license or not, this is a great thing.

 

Ed Mori

1 Peter 4:10

[Major_Dad]

To that I will only add that a boy usually joins Scouting looooong before he ever even considers a driver's license (approximately 11 years old...4 years prior to learaner's permitin most cases). Semper Fidelis.