Peer Pressure

[CNYScouter]

I though I would spin this off from what ASM59 wrote:

 

Peer pressure seems to be one of the primary reasons for boys not wanting to continue in Scouts; IMHO

 

I had a conversation about this the other day with my son.

Hes a 10th grader and plays football .

Some of the players were giving him a hard time about being in Scouts.

He likes being in Sea Scouts and has no problem telling kids about what the Ship is doing.

 

One of the players giving him a hard time is also in Scouts.

When my son said something to him, the other kid said that he had quit his Troop.

He told the team the only reason he staffed at our councils camp this summer was it was the only place that he could find a paying job (hes only 15).

 

Two days later while out selling popcorn my son stopped at this Scouts house.

He figured since he wasnt in Scouts anymore, he wouldnt be selling popcorn this year, and he would be able to make a sale.

 

Dad answered the door.

My son asked since your son quit Scouts would he be willing to buy popcorn from him this year.

The father replied that his son hadnt quit Scouts.

Dad called his son to the door and this kid admitted that he had only said that he had quit because being in Scouts isnt cool.

Dad ended up buying popcorn from my son anyway.

 

I have talked with a lot of parents who think that the Sea Scouts sounds like fun but thier kids won't even come check us out because it's not "cool".

 

My daughter turned 14 this spring and joined the ship in June.

I asked her to give it a try and she reluctantly agreed when one of her friends also agreed to tag along.

When her friend decided it wasn't "cool" enough for her, my daughter didn't want to come anymore.

After a couple of weeks my daughter had nothing to do on a meeting night so decided to attend another ship meeting.

 

We went sailing and she had a blast and hasn't missed since.

 

Her other friends won't even come out and see what it's like because Scouts isn't the "in" thing.

 

They would rather hang out at the mall.

 

My daughter used to go with them but now finds it boring and can't wait until Thursday night Ship meetings.

 

(This message has been edited by CNYScouter)

[Lisabob]

Boy I've gotten an earful about this too. Seems like it was worse in 6th grade than 7th - all that transitioning to middle school and not being a "little kid" anymore that comes with 6th grade around here seems to play into the problem too. Then too, when my son was being teased at school one day it helped enormously that a) he could respond with a litany of super-cool activities the troop had recently done that other boys would probably never get to do, and b) one of the well-liked, "manly-man" male teachers piped up one time and said something like "hey, I was a scout and scouts are definitely NOT gay." Which reminds me, I gotta remember to get that guy signed up as a MBC!

 

The supreme irony for me was that one of the boys who has teased him most about scouts was in the same cub scout den as my son for 5 years! Funny that CNY's son had a similar interaction with a boy who was actually still in the program. Sigh. Why boys are so worried about being perceived as "gay"...and why scouts seems to be an easy target for this off-base critique anyway...I don't buy that it's all that male bonding stuff or we'd be hearing about how the football team is "gay" too.

 

At a different level - we (district membership) are running a community wide open house in a couple of weeks where all the local troops will be participating, trying to get a few boys to check it out. I don't have too many illusions about recruiting middle school aged boys for exactly this reason, but we'll see what happens.

 

 

[Gunny2862]

I feel certain I will see the negative side but it does work both ways.

 

My Wrestling, Football playing, Cellist, decent grade getting, Tenderfoot son wears his Scouting t-shirt to school and only gets positive comments about Scouting. (Could be because he's a full head taller than anyone else in his grade though)

He also speaks to some of the "closeted" Scouts from other units who are afraid they will get the negative comments and won't admit that they are Scouts to the school peer group.

 

 

[Venividi]

In my opinion, standing up to peer pressure is character building. Middle school years are a time of jockeying for position in the heirarchy by whatever means; typically by putting down others for any possible reason. While I don't condone such putdowns, I dont believe the main problem is a (mis)perception that scouting isn't cool, but rather that some wither under any sort of teasing. I would suspect that a lad that would deny his scout membership (or drop from scouting, even if he enjoys it) would also wither under razzing about the type of cell phone he has, the clothes that he wears, the bicycle he rides, etc. Look at the difference in reactions between the example CNYscouter describes, and Lisabob's son's reaction, even before the support of a great teacher.

 

I recall a conversation between two scouts riding in my vehicle on the way back from a ski trip. They were discussing plans to drop from the troop. Both had been on many outings and had fun. It provided an opening for a conversation between the scouts and me about perceptions and reality. Both still dropped and went on to other activities. Both were from good families that supported them in those other activities, and both are now in college, and as far as I know, turned out fine.

 

Venividi

[ASM59]

In my experience, most of the negative peer pressure toward scouting occurs in middle school years; usually 7th - 8th grade and even into 9th grade. The past two years, however I have seen several 6th graders affected by negative peer pressure as well (not something I've seen before the past two years).

 

By the time boys get to High School (especially 10th - 12th grade), much of the negative peer pressure seems to stop; or at least it doesn't seem to bother them so much. But there are other things that are in conflict with their time for Scouting as they get to their later H.S. years; jobs, cars, girlfriends, sports, band... But that's another subject.

 

ASM59

[Beavah]

Nah, our Eagle candidates all tell us that the teasin' continues right through high school, even among "good" honor-roll kids. It is true the upper HS scouts no longer care about it. Much.

 

We could easily double the size of the organization if we could overcome the poor market perception of kids about Scouting.

 

Funny thing is that even traditionally nerdy stuff - computer/science clubs, Dungeons and Dragons gaming, etc. don't have the same peer pressure negative as scouting. Least it seems dat way.

 

Beavah

[acco40]

Jocks are dumb. Cheerleaders are shallow. Scouts are geeks. Chess club is for nerds. It goes on and on. Role models, mentors, family and friends all can help to combat these stereotypes. It is also a way for a young teen to test others.

 

What many forget is that Scouts use peer pressure - it is called the patrol method! Use it to your advantage.

[ASM59]

acco40,

 

Excellent point. I have seen positive peer pressure work with several of the Scouts that I have served in the past; by sticking together and encouraging each other when receiving negative peer pressure at school. I remember one of my Scouts, Timmy, telling a fellow Scout, "Their just jealous that we get to do all this fun stuff in Scouts" and then turning to the negative offender and inviting him to come to a Scout meeting. This group of boys (4 boys in the same patrol) are very good friends and really looked out for each other all the time. I think it was the support that they gave to each other that kept these 4 boys in Scouts through their High School days.

 

Now, I know that there is other Patrol peer pressure at work too. This peer pressure is great when it is working correctly. It helps to keep things in balance within the patrol.

 

ASM59

[troutmaster]

Over the years in our area I have seen many top level athletes in county schools that are also scouts, often becoming Eagle sometime either early in HS, or just before they finish and turn 18. Yet many, when asked at BOR, just do not talk about it. One from my troop a few years back was captain of the water polo team, student body president, and graduated near the very top, receiving a full academic pass to NAU where he graduated with honors. In our own troop we have also had top distance runners, wrestlers, and many top academics who stayed in through HS, albeit, sometimes with sporadic attendance at times. This past year, I had one who had gone to another troop come to me for a reference for Eagle. This little timid boy who briefly joined us, moved to his brother's troop, then finally to a venture crew, was a starting lineman, all league football player.

 

We all know that at times pro athletes are found to have been scouts, a few even Eagle. But, the perception of "goody-goody", the fairly regular photos that focus on cubs or first year scouts who are still small and still child-like in media, and of course the PC "garbage" that always makes the news are also a factor.

 

One other note; I think the "gay" terminology used in most cases today has simply an "uncool" meaning, rather than the PC one, though the confusing overlap of definitions is not helpful.

 

One way then to help might be to get locally recoginized teen scouts to be more prominent (with their cooperation of course). It would not surprise me if many would welcome helping to improve the image, as they probably recognize how hard it is for many. National could help by bringing back the ads with successful sports and entertainment celebrities that would still be looked to by youth and newer generation parents.

 

Not sure how this would fit in the above, but it was interesting to see a photo of Jim Morrison's cub uniform in the WESTWAYS magazine this month. He was apparently in through Lion and pre-dated the Webloes program. The shirt has the old yellow backed numbers. Do not know if he went on to regular scouts. Not necessarily the image we would want in this discussion though.

 

 

[acco40]

We (adults) could start by always making sure we wear our uniform completely, correctly and always in all of our Scouting opportunities - in public or not.

[OldGreyEagle]

Peer Pressure or the mistaken notion that scouts are "gay" has been around for a very long time. Even the best scoutmaster ever, Lem Siddons had a recalcitrant youth in his town. Whitey, when first asked to join the troop, replied he didnt want to associate with a bunch of "daisy pickin' momma's boys", so it was always there.

 

In the late 60's in the Chicago suburbs we went 18 month without wearing the field uniform except to Scout Sunday as it wasnt considered safe for us to do so. And while a Cub, I had worn my uniform to school on Den Meeting days without any issues. Truly the best defense a scout has about being a scout is to explain what he just did last week, month, year, and be proud of it.

[scoutmaster52]

Peer pressure works on adults too. How many adults have you seen cover up or take off their Scout shirts before going into a store. Why? Is it a stima being a scout leader?

[Secret DE]

It is all in the approach. I know that I make it a point to be out in public in uniform on days when I have roundtables or other events or meetings that require one. If I need to go to the store, the mall, or just out in the community I am proud to represent a great organization. Keep in mind that I took a fe beatings in elementary school for wearing my uniform.

 

Now do I get some strange looks? Sure. Do I get some great questions and positive support? Yes. The bottom line is youth or adult their reactions to my being in uniform are about them, not me. This is a difficult thing for most kids to understand and many adults have problems with it too.

 

I am proud to be an example to my adult volunteers and youth. I am proud to represent them and wearing a uniform is just one of the ways that I am able to do that.

 

Tony

[Lisabob]

Well as a matter of fact the only times I have ever seen adult scouters change shirts before going into an establishment is when it is one that sells adult beverages to people sitting on stools arranged along a countertop (ie, a bar). But my son will often zip up his jacket or remove his neckerchief before entering a store with me. His explanation is that the shirts are dorky and the neckerchiefs are just asking for teasing. He doesn't mind the pants (esp. the newer ones) and socks and will wear a scout T shirt in public with no problem. While I can and will continue to try to instill in him the notion of feeling pride rather than embarrassment in his uniform and what it stands for, I must say, it would sure help if national would roll out an updated shirt to match the newer style pants sometime soon. You have to choose your battles. I wouldn't miss this one, myself.

 

 

[BrentAllen]

I'm trying to be pro-active on the peer pressure issue. I find as many positive Scout role models as I can, and introduce them to the boys. Our local paper featured an article about one of the local Scouts earning his Eagle. I'll read the article to the boys and talk about all his accomplishments, both in and out of Scouting. Who wouldn't want their son's resume' to look similar to this one? Well, one point that he needs some help on - he is considering attending the University of Georgia, and not Georgia Tech. I guess nobody is perfect! :-)

 

http://www.thecrier.net/articles/2008/01/08/news/harrisoneagle.txt

 

"Boy Scout Troop 266, sponsored by Dunwoody United Methodist Church, recently awarded Bradley Harrison the rank of Eagle Scout, Scoutings highest honor, at a Court of Honor on November 18. To earn the Eagle Scout rank, the Scout must fulfill requirements in the areas of leadership, outdoor skills, and community service, including a service project.

 

Harrisons Eagle Project was to plan, design, fund, and construct four benches around the tennis courts at Wesleyan, where he is a senior. Harrison, with the help of other scouts and friends, designed and built the benches, dug postholes and sunk them in concrete, and landscaped the surrounding areas, a task that required 222 total hours.

 

During his Scouting career, Harrison served Troop 266 as Senior Patrol Leader, Assistant Senior Patrol Leader, Chaplains Aide, Bugler, Northern Tier Crew Leader, and Patrol Leader. He has completed three high adventure treks, two to Northern Tier and one to Philmont, and is a member of the Order of the Arrow, Scoutings National Honor Society.

 

At Wesleyan, Harrison is active in a variety of activities including Honor Council vice-president, marching band senior captain, track and field, swimming, literary magazine editor, National Honor Society vice president, Science National Honor Society, Spanish National Honor Society, Mu Alpha Theta Math Honor Society, and the Senior Boys Bible Study.

 

Harrison is also a member of the Dunwoody United Methodist Church youth program. He has participated in DUMC mission trips to Brazil, south Georgia, South Carolina, North Carolina and the Gulf Coast.

 

Harrison is a National Merit Semifinalist, an AP Scholar with Honor, and writes weekly Wesleyan sports articles for The Crier, covering a variety of different sports each season.

 

The son of Don and Cathy Harrison of Dunwoody, Harrison plans to attend the University of North Carolina, Vanderbilt, the University of Virginia or the University of Georgia next year."

 

Bradley would be considered "uncool" on many fronts - Scouting, marching band, all the honor societies, church groups. I think we all know where a lot of those "cool" kids will end up, compared to Bradley. Point being, if a boy drops out of Scouts because it is uncool, how many other groups or activities is he going to miss for the same reason? Hopefully we can convince our sons and Scouts that they need to follow their own path and to remember that "cool" is a moving target, with no real definition or set of rules. Being cool and 50 cents might get you a cup of coffee. The experience of Scouting will prepare you for the rest of your life.