Scout Drivers

[ustbeeowl]

What are the rules for Scout drivers (under the age of 18)?

 

We have been having a situation where Scouts who have just received their license, leave the troop meeting early, without obtaining permission of the Adult (SM) in charge.

 

(So I guess that this is really 2 questions for the price of one!)

 

What age for drivers and rules around that

 

and

 

What to do with Scouts that leave the troop meeting/activity early.

 

Thanks

[epalmer84]

The Guide to Safe Scouting and Tours and Expeditions have specific rules for youth drivers, but this only applies to trips. Your state or community may have laws that pertain to youth drivers (Here in Virgina there are a lot of limits).

 

Driving isn't the real issue here, it is the Scout leaving- driving just makes it more interesting. How would you treat any other Scout who left the meeting? What if they walked up the block to the 7-11 with their buddy (a problem we had before we moved)?

 

It sounds like it is time for a Scoutmaster conference. We have had to do this in the past. The first talk is a gentle wakeup to get their attention. The second time, I remind them that I know their parent's phone number- if they leave early, I will simply call home and let them know that Johnny left and should be home real soon. I've only had to do that once. It didn't happen again.

 

We have more of a problem in the summer when they want to hang out in the car showing off the new stereo.

 

Where does leaving early come into play with the Scout Law? Is it courteous to not tell the leaders? Is it loyal to leave the troop? Is it trustworthy to not be where their parents think they should be?

 

Ed

[John-in-KC]

Let's look at the Guide itself. As always, the boldface is National rules and policies, and there are other source documents mandating these events.

 

As our friend Beavah will remind us, the Guide is not a substitute for common sense. It's a set of reactions to a host of lawsuits and risk management decisions to meet demands of BSA's liability insurer.

 

http://www.scouting.org/pubs/gss/gss12.html

 

Automobiles

It is essential that adequate, safe, and responsible transportation be used for all Scouting activities. Because most accidents occur within a short distance from home, safety precautions are necessary, even on short trips.

 

General guidelines are as follows:

 

1. Seat belts are required for all occupants.

2. All drivers must have a valid driver's license that has not been suspended or revoked for any reason. If the vehicle to be used is designed to carry more than 15 persons, including the driver (more than 10 persons, including the driver, in California), the driver must have a commercial driver's license (CDL).

3. An adult leader (at least 21 years of age) must be in charge and accompany the group.

4. The driver must be currently licensed and at least 18 years of age. Youth member exception: When traveling to and from an area, regional, or national Boy Scout activity or any Venturing event under the leadership of an adult (at least 21 years of age) tour leader, a youth member at least 16 years of age may be a driver, subject to the following conditions:

a. Six months' driving experience as a licensed driver (time on a learner's permit or equivalent is not to be counted)

b. No record of accidents or moving violations

c. Parental permission granted to the leader, driver, and riders

5. Passenger cars or station wagons may be used for transporting passengers, but passengers should not ride on the rear deck of station wagons.

6. Trucks may not be used for transporting passengers except in the cab.

7. All driving, except short trips, should be done in daylight.

8. All vehicles must be covered by automobile liability insurance with limits that meet or exceed requirements of the state in which the vehicle is licensed. 9. It is recommended that coverage limits are at least $50,000/$100,000/$50,000. Any vehicle designed to carry 10 or more passengers is required to have limits of $100,000/$500,000/$100,000.

10. Do not exceed the speed limit.

11. Do not travel in convoy (see "Leadership Requirements for Trips and Outings," No. 2).

12. Driving time is limited to a maximum of 10 hours and must be interrupted by frequent rest, food, and recreation stops. If there is only one driver, the driving time should be reduced and stops should be made more frequently.

 

Don't drive drowsy. Stop for rest and stretch breaks as needed. Fatigue is a major cause of highway accident fatalities.

 

OK, I pulled this down on 4/11/07.

 

As I read #4, I see no exceptions for the under-18 rule. Troop meeting, local outing, overnight, OA event, Scout camp or Council seasonal employment, it doesn't matter.

 

That's where the common sense comes in. How many ???-18 YO Scouts take themselves to troop meetings or their summer jobs at Scout camp?

 

As for the leaving of the meeting, Ed is right. It's SM conference time. What's going on that the young man is bored to tears?

[kb6jra]

Well, the 18 yo and 16 yo driver thing is actually news to me, I'd be interested in knowing when it changed from 21 yo, or if it ever was only 21 yo...seems when I was a yout (Cousin Vinny speak) a few years back, we were told that you had to 21 to drive on an outing/event.

 

Maybe our SM's were smart and just made that up to keep us from all driving our cars to a campout. Good for them, it would have been a mess.

 

I too have a herd of drivers, my son is soon to join the ranks of the road warrior, I've had them leave early, but they usually tell me they're doing so when they arrive at the meeting. Just like employees, if they give me some fore knowledge of an event, I'll excuse them no problem, but sometimes a boy has left early, 30 - 45 minutes, and you don't know he's gone until it's closing time. That's when his patrol mates say "Johnny, he's been gone since 8:00". That'll steam your turnips.

 

I'm keeping the driving age a secret as long as possible, like an ace in the hole.

 

 

[LongHaul]

I'd suggest reading #4 again using the following definitions and see if you still think it means the same thing. area=Council event, regional=Regional event, national=National event NONE of these are unit events or troop meetings. Also note subsection c. Parental permission. Because written parental permission can not be obtained on an incident by incident basis those under 18 are not allowed to drive other scouts anywhere while attending my Council summer camp even though it is a Council event.

LongHaul(This message has been edited by LongHaul)

[C-BOLT]

Well, I don't know about the first question, there are probably a thousand legal reasons.

 

As for leaving early, why don't you just ask the scout at the next meeting why they left. Sure, its not courteous to just take off, but maybe they had homework to finish, things of that nature.

 

For one reason or another, cars have never really been a problem in our troop.

[ustbeeowl]

quoteAs for leaving early, why don't you just ask the scout at the next meeting why they left. Sure, its not courteous to just take off, but maybe they had homework to finish, things of that nature.

 

Nope, they were just bored, stating that they had already done what the troop was covering for that night. I am going to try and get them to teach the material, since they seem to know it so well, or so they say.(This message has been edited by ustbeeowl)