Can you have to man adult leaders at weekly troop mtgs?

[JerseyJohn]

Edited to clarify topic:

Can you have to many adult leaders....

 

We have about 60 boys in the troop with weekly attendance floating around 40 or so scouts.

 

At the weekly troop meetings there are usually four or five field leaders and another one or two committee members. I have been getting the feeling that the adult presence impacts the scouts in terms of being boy led. It makes it too easy for them to find an adult rather than rely on themselves in some instances. I would say they do perhaps 70% of whats required but we are not quite where they need to be.

 

I have been tinkering with the idea of asking that only one field leader attend the weekly troop meetings with me for the first three months of 2007. This way it forces the scouts to rely more on themselves and reduces the scout option to go to the adults.

 

We do have them work the chain of command, etc, etc.

 

I would like to know if you somehow limit adult participation at weekly meetings?

If so, how has it impacted the boys?

 

I hope I explained this enough for you to get the jist of what I am getting at.

 

Thanks for any and all input, advice & comments.

 

YIS,

JerseyJohn(This message has been edited by JerseyJohn)(This message has been edited by JerseyJohn)(This message has been edited by JerseyJohn)

[Hunt]

If your physical setup allows, you might try what we do...the adults are in a separate room, and the boys run their own meeting. Adults are only involved in the meeting if they are making an announcement, or teaching something. The SM goes in at the end and closes. The adults are there primarily as a resource (ie, if somebody needs a BOR scheduled, or is working with one of the boys on a Merit Badge).

[SR540Beaver]

Jersey,

 

We have almost identical troops. I'll say ditto to what Hunt said. Some adults sit at some tables off to the side of the troop meeting. Others go to an "adult" room. We don't restrict where the adults go or who can come, we just ask that they stay out of the boy's way as they run their meetings. We couldn't function without the adults we do have there. We usually have some sort of financial stuff going on that requires the treasurer and committee members are doing BOR's. Yes, we have some adults just standing around and visiting, but many have jobs to do and are busy. The boys do their thing and we do ours and we interact where needed.

[OneHour]

We have about 70 scouts. Of which, we have 40-50 active at troop meeting. We have an SM and 5 ASMs. Of which there are only 3-4 present at the troop meetings. With this size of a troop, our SM constantly has SM conferences. So the ASMs would be roaming about to be available if the junior leaders need assistance. We also teach the skills if our instructors and junior leaders are not available (namely busy with mb or patrol meeting). At the start of the meeting, the scoutmasters stand in the back of the room until called upon. At which time, we make our announcement(s) and head back to our places in the back of the room. The SPL and his staff (and the scoutmasters) were given instruction that the adult leaders will not intervene unless being asked by the junior leaders and that the chain-of-command has been exhausted. It has worked out. I was almost floored two troop meetings ago when the SPL (a young 14.5 years old scout) lectured the troop about respect and leadership. It was almost like seeing your toddler takes his first step! It was poetically beautiful!

 

 

ps: Our parents are there only if they participate in a BOR. Our advancement chair has a running spreadsheet of whose turn it is to be part of the BOR team. The rest of the parents are non-existent during the meeting.

 

 

[BrentAllen]

The Troops around here operate as described by OneHour and Beaver - with one exception. An adult must be in full uniform if he is going to be in the Troop meeting for any period of time. This is the boys' rule, not the adults'. Adults must go through training to wear the uniform in the Troop. This helps keep those busy-body parents who don't understand the program from doing any damage, if you will. The adults have a separate area where they meet. I like their plan.

[LongHaul]

JerseyJohn,

Sounds to me like you have a discipline problem with your adults.

If the adults can't control themselves and not undermine the ability of the SM to build responsibility and leadership within the youth members then that individual should be asked to get with the program or stay home. It is best to have the adults separate from the boys so the boys feel that they are in control and not under surveillance but it should not be necessary. Boys will at times seek the path of least work. Why figure it out myself if I can get the solution from someone else? Its the adult that needs to say Ask your PL, ASPL, SPL, or whoever is in the position to answer that question. I personally cant think of two questions that an adult should feel they have to supply the answer to coming up at a troop meeting. Before I asked them to stay home Id explain why they need to support the chain of command and learn to say, Thats not within the scope of my job description.

LongHaul

(This message has been edited by LongHaul)

[EagleInKY]

I would discourage you from asking them to not come to the meeting. Adult association is one of the methods of scouting and meetings are just one of those opportunities for scouts to interact with adults.

 

I would have a pow-wow with your adults and set a new standard. Make sure they understand what their role is at troop meetings. What's their role? First, and foremost, it's whatever the SPL asks them to do. Additionally, our job is to assist the troop leaders in running the meeting. Assist is the key word. What does that mean? Here are some ideas:

- Helping keep them on time.

- Dealing with discipline issues.

- Providing a helping hand when needed.

 

Occasionally I'll interject an idea if I think I can add value without undermining whoever is in charge.

 

Our adults hang out in a separate room. We have our opening in a fellowship hall. The scouts then break out into various areas around the church. The adults usually stay in the fellowship hall or in the foyer. Rarely does the meeting take place in the same room as the adults. I and the ASMs roam the church and bounce between checking in on the guys and socializing with the parents. If the boys are in the sanctuary or outside, some of the parents will occasionally hang out and watch from afar. Overall, the adults keep their distance and enjoy watching the boys grow.

[Hunt]

I'd just add that if you have a separate room, there's no reason to discourage parents from hanging out there if they want. Indeed, that's a first step toward sucking them in to getting more involved.

[SR540Beaver]

To build on what Hunt said, many troops are always in need of adults. How many times have we seen posts here asking how to get parents involved in serving on the committee, providing transportation or working directly with the boys? We are fortunate in our troop to have a large number of parents and registered leaders who support the functioning of the troop. When you take anywhere from 40 to 50 boys to camp each month, you'd better have adults willing to drive or someone is staying home. Tell them they are not welcome to hang around ant meetings and you won't see them when you do need them.

 

As has already been said. Lay down some guidelines about how the troop is to operate as a boy led troop and ask them to just observe unless they are really needed. The biggest task we have with new parents is teaching them to consistently say, "go ask your PL/SPL". But they do learn.

[JerseyJohn]

All good advice folks. Thanks for the input.

 

JerseyJohn

[CalicoPenn]

Don't forget that part of what needs to be done is to train the boys too - Questions get asked of the PL/SPL - the adults telling the boys to "go ask your PL/SPL" reinforces this idea.

 

I've found that the most difficult obstacle to overcome is when a Scout's parent is one of the leaders - it's common for a Scout to go to mom/dad and ask a question. In my Troop, there was no Mom or Dad. During Scout-time, Bobby Smith's dad wasn't "Dad", it was "Mr. Smith". And unless it was an emergency situation where the natural instinct was to yell out Dad, every time "Dad" was addressed as "Dad" and not "Mr. Smith", Scout Bobby received a "demerit" and 4 demerits led to kybo or dish washing duty. It doesn't take long for the Scouts not to pester "Dad" with their questions.

 

Calico