Scoutings Gray Areas

[Eagle Foot]

Over the past months our district has made us aware of the new BSA Policy listed as "Scoutings Gray Areas" areas where we should not go. I'm not so sure I can fully agree with this but some areas I can.

 

i.e. the skit "JC Penny, The Ugly Girl Scout, the song Pink Pajamas, and so on. The gray areas would be anything that reflect gays, nudity, dressing up as girls (women) and the like. We have to be very carful about what we say, act out, or sing.

 

Well we just got back from summer camp and I guess our Council seems to have not gotten this information. We had a skit with two guys that obiviously look like to gay men, not to mention that that they talked and acted as such...they delivered the gay impression. We had scouts (staff) cross dress as women, and to cap it all off they sang Pink Pajamas (pink pajamas is not so bad but the gay stuff?) The bottom line it was sick. Were are the real men we used to have as staff members (mature young men) we've got a bunch of sissieees. BSA has spent a lot of money in court fighting the gays and here we are working from the inside out, at least it appears so. They only thing they over looked was racial...and they got close, but did act a person with some sort of disability, not able to function and low mental capabilities.

 

For some of us...if this is the way...I'm out...This is a hot topic and I and others were really upset about what we saw. When mentioned to the staff they just laughed...and brushed it off.

 

The values I have learned in Scouting are not of this kind of kinky behavior. When the district talks now...it's gone a be...talk to the hand...practice what you preach.

 

edited by Eagle Foot (This message has been edited by a staff member.)

[SueM]

Eagle Foot,

 

That's just sad! Do you think that maybe they did this deliberately as a protest to the new policy? It's just a thought..

 

Sue M.

[FScouter]

Pray, tell us more about what you're refering to as a new BSA policy, "Scouting's Gray Areas". Is there a pub number?

 

Yes, some skits dredge the bottom. There are a million + 1 skits out there and new ones being invented every day, so there's really no point in presenting depictions of bodily functions etc. as humor.

[Beavah]

Yah, but bodily functions are funny, eh? At least to da average 6th grader. Surely you've had to endure a car ride to camp filled with endless fart jokes?

 

Eagle Foot, I hear ya. Still, we must remember that good people and good staffers often make mistakes, especially when they've been in the woods for a bit too long. Sounds like an "ethical moment" to share with your boys at least. If you can't get through to the staff, do your best to do your duty for da kids in your troop.

 

And then don't forget to thank the staff for the things they did well. Those kids are paid a pauper's wages for a hard job. And down the road if anything comes up again, gentle correction from a friend speaks most loudly.

 

 

[Fuzzy Bear]

Most of us have a sense of humor but having a sense of judgment about what one finds as being funny is derived from ones ethical background. Such as, being considerate of others could be the imperative but joking about being overly cautious about such things might lead one into the making of a skit. Something like this might be the setting: A Patrol of Six Scouts in a room trying to figure out how not offend anyone while all of the time alienting each other over several perceived slights about such things as bisquit dough, water, and rice. They all have on various costumes (*costuming is the essential foreground of any good skit, especially hats of varied sizes and shapes, color is also good). Each time one idea is put forth, another Scout becomes distraught, until they chase and throw things at each other and then run screaming off the stage (*Slapstick is the all important ingedient for youthful mirth but this also has a twist of satire for the adults in the crowd.). Humor training should be the next big push in Scouting. I want to see an experimental program at Philmont to develop what has to be a real low in Scouting at this time, a lack of vital humors. FB

[evmori]

I'm sure there is a point here but for the life of me I don't see it.

[Lisabob]

Beavah, fart jokes are fart jokes. Somewhat crude, but hey, we can all probably live with that as long as we don't go delving too much further into bodily functions. But I've been to scouting events where the *adults* put on skits and told jokes that would be considered extremely rude in most settings. This included denigrating comments about women's bodies (I'm talking about women who were present or else well known to the group, not in the abstract), racist and sexist jokes and skits, jokes about various religions (I had no idea how much Catholic bashing, in particular, is apparently considered an acceptable sport in some circles), cross dressing, and the like. What floors me about the gay jokes is that there seems to be more enjoyment of, and willingness to participate in, this "humor" among (primarily) men who are none the less rampantly homophobic most of the time, than one might ever have suspected! What's up with that??? It doesn't take a psychology degree to begin wondering.

 

I often find myself in the (gender) minority at these events and I have been careful over the years to develop a rather thick skin. The guy, for example, in my WB patrol who insisted on relieving himself in plain view at every opportunity "because that's just how men are made," got no reaction from me (I think he was disappointed). So I don't count myself squeamish or overly sensitive.

 

But I'm with Eagle Foot. This kind of behavior is not acceptable and should not be what scouting is known for. Ideally we shouldn't need reminders in the form of a "gray areas" policy such as Eagle Foot described- this should be plain common sense and manners. And it isn't just "boys will be boys" either. It is a direct affront to the values we claim to be teaching our boys.

 

And honestly, if I found that the adult leaders in my son's troop were engaging in this kind of behavior, or allowing the boys to blithely engage in such behavior, we'd be finding a new troop right quick. These are not the lessons I want my son to learn from scouting. He gets enough of this garbage riding the school bus.

 

Lisa'bob

[Cheerful Eagle]

Lisabob and others have taken the words right out of my mouth. And Bevah's right, you'll catch more flies with honey.

 

One thing to bring up for discussion if you get the response "Awe, then there's nothing funny for skits anymore!".

 

Consider popular vaudvule comedy from the early 20th century that featured blackface, or other racial slurs. NOW we view that as TOTALLY unacceptable. Did comedy die out when mainstream culture started to value racial equality? No. Truely funny stuff continues to be truely funny.

 

Putting down another to make yourself laugh is only a half step away from putting someone down to make yourself feel better. Actually, maybe it's the same thing. If you want to make comedy using stereotypes, use stereotypes that you are identified with. All the great comedians prove that's where the best laughs are.

[infoscouter]

Here's a link to one version of the gray areas document: http://troop-42.net/Files/Grey%20Areas.pdf

[John-in-KC]

Well, this appears to be a Northeast Region document, not a National document.

 

Tell you what: I'll ask someone and get back to the Forum.

[Lisabob]

John, with respect, I do think it misses the point to determine whether or not it is a regional, council, or national document. It almost certainly is not national policy. Nor should it have to be and who knows what sort of garbled, ambiguous bureaucratese would be produced as a result if it were, anyway. My sense of the northeast region document is that there was a feeling of "people ought to know better, but obviously some don't so here are some common sense guidelines." And I like the NE region's approach that in some cases, it isn't just what, but how.

 

 

Lisa'bob

 

[Beavah]

If you want to make comedy using stereotypes, use stereotypes that you are identified with. All the great comedians prove that's where the best laughs are.

 

Nah. They all make fun of politicians and lawyers.

 

[Fuzzy Bear]

Lbob,

A man relieving himself in full view of a woman is not how men are made but more along the lines of how men are made to answer for sexual harassment. Such antics have long been relegated to the courts. It has nothing to do with humor.

FB

[evmori]

Have we become so politically correct that poking fun at one another is now taboo? If so, we are really in a bad way.

 

I'm still looking for the point.

[Eagle Foot]

EVMORI

 

The point is I not so sure I'm in agreement with this "Gray Areas" issued by National...The point is our council and district has made them an issue not to do. We had training regarding them...yet we go to our local Council Camp and they are doing the Gray Area skits, songs, cross dressing, and gay stand up comedy. We seem to be saying don't do as I do, but do as I say.

 

Is this "Gray Area" thing just in our area or is it really national, I haven't called national, I just want to get it straight.

 

 

 

(This message has been edited by a staff member.)