Juding Unit Level Leaders

[hotdesk]

In the thread that I spinned this off of there was much talk about how paid executives were rated/judged using membership and dollar numbers.

 

Okay, so this does happen. It needs to. Their main job/duty is to promote scouting to both perspective members and to donors. They spend most of there time crunching numbers (budgets), working on program, and doing Friends of Scouting. Just look at where the pros are, Program Executive, Financial Executive, and Scouting Executive. If they aren't judged on what they do, what should we judge them on?

 

Then someone mentioned how they aren't judged on unit camping, advancement, etc. But, eveny if they are not judged on this, someone is. The Chartered Organization (at least in the units close to me) judge there Scoutmasters and Committee Chairs (who are charged with providing the program) with these numbers. Any Chartered Organization that does want to ensure a quality program will put in place a Scoutmaster and Committee Chair who will show results. It works and shouldn't be dismissed.

[scoutldr]

"Judging" is such a hard word. Indirectly, the professionals are evaluated on the program end. To make Quality District, 60% of the units need to make Quality Unit. Those requirements involve delivery of the program as well as recruiting. A DE who consistently fails to lead his district to the QD award will face a closed door session with his boss. So, a DE's career is dependent on his/her ability to encourage, cajole, persuade and coerce volunteers to do the many and sundry jobs that need doing, without any real hammer or power to do so. Not an enviable position. Most of them earn far less than the job's worth when you consider the hours, hard work and frustration involved with working with old curmudgeon scouters who were Silver Beavers before he was born.

[frank10]

In the end, we are judged at all the levels by our program. And it's the boys (and their families) that do the judging. Good programs will bring them in, lack of program/training/camping/you-get-the-idea will keep them away.

Problems enter in when the boys/$$ start to walk and the adults look for excuses rather than beefing up the program.

[Eamonn]

Judge?

Maybe for a moment we need to look at replacing the word judge with "Meeting Expectations"

Sadly a good number of Chartered Organizations either don't know or don't want to know what is happening in their Scout units.

It's hard to judge something when you don't know what is going on and if they don't have any expectations, the DE is at fault.

The DE is the person who is in charge of ensuring that the relationship between the BSA and the outside organization is a healthy one.

When it comes to unit leaders I feel that they have to ensure that the program offered meets the expectations of the youth they serve.

Youth members judge a unit and vote with their feet.

Most established units are capable of providing a worth while program with very minimal support from the professionals.

When it comes to judging the pros? Different groups have different expectations.

What I expect from our DE now that I'm back at the unit level is very different that what I expected when I was District Chairman.

The tool most used to judge if expectations are being met is "Quality"

I'm not sure if units attach a lot of importance to being a Quality Unit or not?

I might be wrong ? But most units I know don't make being a Quality Unit a goal. If they fall into meeting the requirements, that's fine but if they don't? It's no big deal.

Quality District seems to be a much bigger deal. Could it be that District types have bigger egos?

Also when it comes to Quality District and Quality Council careers are on the line.

We can agree or disagree about what the requirements should be, but the requirements are what they are and while these requirements might meet the needs of the Region and National, they may not be seen by the unit volunteers as doing anything to meet their needs or expectations.

I don't have all the information at hand, but the expense of running a Council is not cheap.

I have never done any comparisons with other organizations so I don't know if the costs are in line or not.

The Median Household Income for our area is $38,040. The starting rate for a DE is over $30,000. Many volunteers and parents have a hard time handing their hard earned money over to help pay the wages of someone who is earning more than they are. Some might be unhappy with the level of service they are getting.

This of course doesn't mean that the DE or the other Professionals are not doing their job, it just means that they are not meeting the expectations of the person they are asking for the money.

My thinking is that it is up to them to find a way of winning that person over.

That might mean that they have to do a better job of explaining what they are doing or improving the level of service so that they are meeting the expectations.

Again my thinking is that a lot of pros are not doing a very good job of letting people know what they are doing.

In fact we as an organization don't do a very good job of telling people outside of Scouting know what we are doing. Sure they have heard about Scouting and the BSA, but if you ask they have no idea what we really do.

We just interviewed 30 people about donating to our Council. I thought everyone was aware of what Scouts and Scouting was all about. I was wrong two thirds of the people had no idea. They wanted hard numbers and details about what we were all about. The strange thing was that our big selling point was the programs that the units are offering.

Eamonn.

 

 

[Newbie Den Leader]

"In the end, we are judged at all the levels by our program. And it's the boys (and their families) that do the judging. Good programs will bring them in, lack of program/training/camping/you-get-the-idea will keep them away.

Problems enter in when the boys/$$ start to walk and the adults look for excuses rather than beefing up the program."

 

 

That pretty much sums it up. I would also add "communication" with the parents is very important. Don't announce upcoming events at the last minute and expect great attendance. Plan early, announce early, and remind often. Schedule phone calls to parents and let them hear your voice and enthusiasm. E-mail is a great tool, but don't fully rely on it.

 

As an ADL, I'm learning alot from a fine Cubmaster who practices the above and I'm grateful for his devotion to Scouting.

[SSScout]

As the Carny barker says, " Ya pays yer money and ya takes yer choice"

All the above is true.

In one of my past lives, I was a CM. I never had more fun in my life. When it came time for me to move on into Scouts with my son, I had a Cub parent approach me and ask "can I pay you to stay on as CM?" He was serious.

We ( my dear wife was CCh) had a fair amount of support in keeping things Cubby. Parents went to the Leader Training. But ultimately, I could not get anyone to step up to be CM. Even tho the P/T income might have been nice,(!) I had to consider 1) how BSA would look on it 2)it was apparent that I would be ALONE. None of the other Cub parents would step up to be CM, or CCh, or Treasurer, or DL for the remaining 3 Dens. ( my dear wife was CCh and had agreed with me that without us, the Pack would dissolve. It did) 3) the dad that had promised to be Webelos DL took all the books and materials and we never heard from him again ( asuccessful contractor, his son was very active, and he watched me every meeting. Even took notes). Two Ws went to other Packs, the other 12 boys either went to other Packs or dropped out. Our DE tried hard to recruit at the schools we drew from, to no avail.

In conversations with folks, it was apparent that many parents wanted the "Scout Experience" for their son, but ultimately were not willing to support it. As my DE and I agreed over some coffee one night, " all you can do is offer". In our community, one will often see exhibited what I call "the soccer syndrome", the parents are so used to giving their sons and daughters over to professionals, (or even authoritative volunteers-- the soccer coach), that they have lost the ability to take time to do for their son/daughter themselves. Let me drop off my kid and come back in 2 hours...

[Lisabob]

SSScout writes: "In conversations with folks, it was apparent that many parents wanted the "Scout Experience" for their son, but ultimately were not willing to support it."

 

So true. I'd go a little further. It isn't even just that they won't support it. I've met lots of parents who will whip out the checkbook and write the pack/troop a check for whatever might really be needed, give generously to FOS every year, and make sure their boys and others who need it have the proper uniform and gear. In an important sense, they are willing to support the unit. But then they can't be bothered to take their kid to meetings on a regular basis or they use the "drive by" method whereby we become babysitters of America, and when you ask them to be on the committee even in some minor capacity they look at you like you're offering them something especially nasty to eat. They don't realize that if they want their son to HAVE a scouting experience then THEY have to help GIVE HIM that scouting experience.

 

Anyway. On a brighter note, today I set up an Eagle BOR on rather short notice for a scout in our troop and EVERY person I called to ask to sit on the BOR was more than happy to do so, even if it required them to re-arrange their own schedule. Thank goodness for dedicated volunteers.

 

Lisa'bob

[CNYScouter]

After meeting with the organization that is considering becoming the CO for a Sea Scout Ship I was talking with the DE for this District. This is the District borders mine and I hadnt had much dealings with him.

 

I told him one of the reasons I wanted to start a Sea Scout Ship was that I didnt think my son was having a very good Scouting experience. I went to tell him the problem I trying to find a Troop that was doing a good job running the program as suggested by the BSA.

 

He said that in his District they are on the lookout for signs that a unit maybe in trouble or is not running a quality Scouting program.

When I asked him about the Leader from a Troop in his district that had called me about getting involved with the Sea Scout Ship. His son was 13 and almost Eagle and he was looking for something to keep him in Scouting.

The DE knew exactly which Troop this person came from and he went to say they had brought in the SM for counseling when this Troop had produced its 19th Eagle in 2 years. They quietly looked at the program and saw it was the classic Eagle Mill and did nothing but move kids through advancement as quickly as possible and did little else. They had stopped using the patrols method and did very little in the way of camping. These kids were making Eagle and then dropping out of Scouting at the age of 14.

The DE, SE, UC were in this meeting and this SM was offered help to turn this program into a good scouting program.

A year later after this Troop has just produced its 28th Eagle in 3 years they brought the SM in again asking him to start running the Troop more along the guidelines of the BSA, and again offering help to make this happen or he would be asked to step down as SM.

 

The DE went on to say that they were taking a look at the program again to see if this Troop had made any progress in moving more into line with the BSA guidelines and if not, they were ready to replace the SM if necessary. (and yes, the CO is aware of what is happening)

 

I do like that the DE is taking an active role in making sure that the units are trying to run a good quality program and this district has a good enough commissioner service to recognize a unit like this.

 

But I am not sure if this way is a good idea or not.