Adventure Guidelines

[CaptainRenault]

Hi. I am a new Scoutmaster and a new member. But I have been reading this board for a little while.

 

My troop committee is trying to help me get started, and asked me for feedback on a page or so of "Adventure Guidelines" that they want our troop to adopt.

 

Some of these guidelines seem to me to be out-of-sync with BSA policy.

 

Would it be OK for me to put them up on this site to get feedback from all the experienced scouters here?

 

Thanks

[FScouter]

Welcome to the forums, Captain!

 

Post away. Your guaranteed to get lots of conflicting opinons!

[CaptainRenault]

Ok, here they are. I think one or two are Ok, but some of them seem way over the top to me.

 

Edit: please respond to any or all of these. Let me know which ones are good and which ones are bad.

 

General

 

A minimum of one overnight adventure shall be scheduled for each month except November, February and April.

 

One parent from each family must participate in an overnight adventure as a chaperone or driver annually. This does not include Summer Camp.

 

Each trip shall have a stated purpose and be approved by the Troop Committee.

 

At no time will there be two outings scheduled on the same weekend without the approval of the Troop Committee.

 

Should the Troop Committee approve two trips on the same weekend, Scouts may attend only one outing.

 

All Trips require the attendance of one Trained BSA Leader identified as the Tour Leader for the duration of the adventure.

 

The ratio of 2 adults for every 10 Scouts shall be maintained for all trips. At no time shall a scout be denied attendance because of an excess number of adults.

 

Should it be necessary to limit attendance on any trip, the specific limitation will be communicated in writing and adhered to unless the Troop Committee approves a change.

 

One month prior to any scheduled event, the Tour Leader must be identified by the Scoutmaster and drivers recruited .

 

 

Permission Slips

 

At a minimum, permission slips shall be distributed three weeks prior to the scheduled event either at the regular Tuesday Meeting or electronically.

 

All permission slips must be returned no later than the next Tuesday. All permission slips will include a notation indicating the date turned in to the Troop. Scouts who do not submit their permission slips by the required date will not be allowed to participate if the trip is full. If the trip is not full the Scout must have the permission of the Tour Leader and Adventure Coordinator to attend.

 

 

Planning

 

The weekly meeting prior to an adventure shall be dedicated to Trip planning. Scouts who are not attending the adventure will assist with planning where appropriate (i.e. checking equipment, rank advancement, assisting with menu planning) or complete another task assigned by the Scoutmaster.

 

The Scouts, with the supervision of an adult leader, shall be responsible for developing the menu, and preparing a shopping list. The Scoutmaster shall be responsible for determining which Scouts shall complete this task based on outstanding advancement requirements. Each Scout is also responsible to complete the shopping for one adventure which is required for rank advancement to First Class. The Scoutmaster, or hi designee, shall keep records and determine who will be responsible for purchasing food for each trip.

 

At the conclusion of the trip, and on the weely meeting following, the Quartermaster shall be responsible for checking in all returned equipment and determining that it is in good condition. Scouts who do not return troop equipment in satisfactory condition will be held financially responsible for the equipment in question.

 

(This message has been edited by CaptainRenault)

[FScouter]

Well, I don't want to be too harsh, but.... after briefly scaning your committee's edict I have three comments.

1. Ask the committee attorney to take off his attorney hat and put on a Scout hat.

2. Toss out the entire edict.

3. Send them all to training.

[Kahuna]

The province of the committee is to support the program. The job of the SM is to provide the program. The two are not mutually exclusive, but I would tell 'em to put it where the sun doesn't shine. They certainly can set guidlines, but this is out their area.

[Bob White]

Some of what you have there is fine but most is uneeded or more restrictive than needed to have a good scouting program. Ask the committee to get trained and read the BSA resources reggading trips then decide if they really think these additional rules are warranted.

 

Good luck,

BW

[anarchist]

Welcome aboard Capt'n!

 

Question? You said you were a new SM...is this a new troop?

 

Many troops have "troop guidelines" and "policy statements" or "Parent handbooks" and some of them actually do a nice job of informing the troop, the parents and the CO of the general goals, methods and expectations of the program. I am guessing that something motivates this work in progress... any idea as to the background or are they just trying to "get it right"?

 

my thoughts (coming from the committee side of the fence):

 

"A minimum of one overnight adventure shall be scheduled for each month except November, February and April."

 

***{this is not a bad goal...but what is special about these three months? Our troop schedulesat least on adventure a month - year round and many months two activities}

 

One parent from each family must participate in an overnight adventure as a chaperone or driver annually. This does not include Summer Camp.

 

***{not a bad policy if you can get the parents on board with it... fexibility for some? ...like our troop has a hearing impaired couple... }

 

Each trip shall have a stated purpose and be approved by the Troop Committee.

 

***{sort of "tense" but most committees approve the troop program annually anyway}

 

At no time will there be two outings scheduled on the same weekend without the approval of the Troop Committee.

 

***{this is a bit short-sighted... I can think of several times we have one activity aimed at younger scouts and a second activity aimed at older boys...High adventure like caving for scouts 14 years and older}

 

Should the Troop Committee approve two trips on the same weekend, Scouts may attend only one outing.

 

***{question as to why...next weekend we have a flat water canoe training campout (very popular) nearly the whole troop will attend...Friday night and Saturday...breaking Camp early Sunday Morning...Sunday afternoon several of our boys are taking a trip to the C&O canal and doing a 20 mile bike trip for part of the biking merit badge)why should they be able to do both??? Isn't that a parental decision?

 

All Trips require the attendance of one Trained BSA Leader identified as the Tour Leader for the duration of the adventure.

 

***{necessary for a tour permit in many/most councils)

 

The ratio of 2 adults for every 10 Scouts shall be maintained for all trips. At no time shall a scout be denied attendance because of an excess number of adults.

 

*** I can understand 2 for ten on water, but say for a hike???two adults for thirty boys is not a stretch...we however usually book three adults for all events (even one with five scouts)...so that if one adult gets called away for a family/work emergency, gets sick or just bails out at the last minute, the activity is not forced to "cancel"

 

Should it be necessary to limit attendance on any trip, the specific limitation will be communicated in writing and adhered to unless the Troop Committee approves a change.

 

***{seems a wordy way of saying the rules are the rules, I guess if the campsite only holds 25 campers and you 'advertize it to the troop' thats the way it is????}

 

One month prior to any scheduled event, the Tour Leader must be identified by the Scoutmaster and drivers recruited .

 

*** heck, we do this in our adult planning meeting each summer, when we approve the PLCs annual activity calendar...At a minimum we know in August who is "on the hook" for September through December and by December we have planned and identified "activity" leaders through the summer. Why so late? Many events take months to set up and the tour leader should be working with the PLC as early as possible...we already know who the "tour leader" for summercamp 2007 will be and who is running our two canoe trips next June. Drivers are another thing...they are pinned down in the month or so before an event}

 

 

Permission Slips

 

At a minimum, permission slips shall be distributed three weeks prior to the scheduled event either at the regular Tuesday Meeting or electronically.

 

***our permission slips are on line (on our web page) and the SPL starts collecting them after our sign up sheets are posted...usually in the last two weeks before an event...the tour leader always has a few for the "stragglers"...unless there is a deadline or it is number critical event}

 

All permission slips must be returned no later than the next Tuesday. All permission slips will include a notation indicating the date turned in to the Troop. Scouts who do not submit their permission slips by the required date will not be allowed to participate if the trip is full. If the trip is not full the Scout must have the permission of the Tour Leader and Adventure Coordinator to attend.

 

***little tense again

 

 

Planning

 

The weekly meeting prior to an adventure shall be dedicated to Trip planning. Scouts who are not attending the adventure will assist with planning where appropriate (i.e. checking equipment, rank advancement, assisting with menu planning) or complete another task assigned by the Scoutmaster.

 

***again kind of wordy...this is PLC/SMs area...and a week before a trip should be patrol planning but troop planning should be done much further out and on this stuff the SM should have a better handle than the committee and the PLC should be doing most of the troop planning...

 

The Scouts, with the supervision of an adult leader, shall be responsible for developing the menu, and preparing a shopping list. The Scoutmaster shall be responsible for determining which Scouts shall complete this task based on outstanding advancement requirements. Each Scout is also responsible to complete the shopping for one adventure which is required for rank advancement to First Class. The Scoutmaster, or hi designee, shall keep records and determine who will be responsible for purchasing food for each trip.

 

***{if this is a boy led troop the SPL, PL and PLC should be assigning this with the SM looking over their shoulders helping them get it right. Troop should have an advancement coordinator keeping advancement details in a troop record not the SM. Patrols should determine who the grubmaster is and do their own shopping...SM should stay out of that picture as much as possible...SPL can or should be able to guide his boys with the advice of the SM}

 

At the conclusion of the trip, and on the weely meeting following, the Quartermaster shall be responsible for checking in all returned equipment and determining that it is in good condition. Scouts who do not return troop equipment in satisfactory condition will be held financially responsible for the equipment in question.

 

***{ Not bad proceedure...Unless the gear is wet what is wrong with checking most of it back into the trailer or back in the scout storage area at the end of the event? Who is responsible if the patrol stove is messed up, a single boy or the patrol???? WE believe in responsiblity and that boys should take care of gear...but this needs to be monitored to be sure gear is in good shape when it is checked out}

 

Keeping in mind that your committee wants you to look it over and give them your feedback seems like a good start...a two-way dialogue. At least they did not hit you over the head with carved in stone rules before you even got to see them...Sounds like they need to take some training...and we have found that at least a few of the committee members should go through SM fundimentals to know what the SMs job is supposed to be as well as what BSA requires of the program guys/girls. Which ones give you heartburn?

hope it helps

YiS

Anarchist

 

 

[Eagle Foot]

Here are your opinons Captain.... FScouter is right.

 

The committee does need to get trained. This program has been going for a long time and each year I see those that come along and try and change what has been tested to be the most workable way.

 

Sounds like the troop committee is forgetting that this is "Boy Scouts" and it is for the boys, by the boys.

 

What happen to the term "Camping Trip" it is the responsibility of the Scoutmaster to promote 10 overnight camping trips and one long term "Summer Camp" each year for the scouts.

 

Looks like a little too much control going on here.

 

Eagle Foot

 

 

 

 

[CaptainRenault]

Answer to question by anarchist. No, it is not a new troop. But the committee member that wrote the list is the wife of the previous scoutmaster. And the troop is not boy-led, and does not use the patrol method. I have been trying to change that, and some of the boys are complaining, because in the past the adults have done most of the work. And these complaints have got back to the committee.

[Kahuna]

I would have guessed it wasn't a boy-led troop. Your committee needs training urgently.

 

BTW, welcome aboard!

[CaptainRenault]

I see a lot of comments about training. That is another problem that I have. One of the ASMs who has been around a lot longer than me has told me that the committee chair is not trained, and even though the adult training coordinator keeps sending our committee chair info about training, the chair still won't go.

[evmori]

Like some others have posted, training is a must! And most of what you have is already part of the BSA program! And some has no part in the BSA program. Remember, this is for the boys! If you keep piling on the restrictions you won't have any boys.

 

I hope fun is a good enough purpose for a trip cause if it isn't then why go?

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

 

 

[SWScouter]

The troop committee challenge, the leader specific training for troop committee members, is best given to the committee at one time, not to a member here and another there. You may suggest that your committee work with the district training committee to set up a special challenge just for your troop committee.

 

SWScouter

[Prairie_Scouter]

Not that I'd want to ruin a perfect string of not agreeing with anything that BW or FScouter have to say (not really, just seems that way ), but I have to go with their thoughts on this.

 

If your committee was trained, they'd see that most things on your list are already covered in BSA guidelines. Not really any need to write them down again. Seems like a lot of nitpicking. Do you have lawyers on your committee?

 

You want all of the troop leaders to act as a team, but when it comes down to it, you, the SM, are in charge of administering the program. The Committee is there to support you in doing that. As far as I know, there is no requirement that the Troop committee approve all outings and their objective. It's nice to all be on the same page, of course, but I guess I'd ask "why wouldn't they agree?". Within some common sense limits, of course. Not too many campouts to Bora Bora, things like that .

 

All that stuff about permission slips and dates and planning and shopping? Ditch all that stuff. You need to do it all, but it's all covered elsewhere in the detail that you need.

 

My advice, in all seriousness, would be to get back to them and say that this all appears to be covered very well in available Scout materials. Rather than re-invent the wheel, invite them to attend training, and re-convene the discussion at that time if needed.

[nldscout]

my opinion is that you have one major problem to overcome first.

 

" But the committee member that wrote the list is the wife of the previous scoutmaster. "

 

Sounds to me like she wants to keep things as her husband ran it. Was there anything like this under the previous SM? I suspect not!

 

Time to stand up and say , no thanks, I don't need these guidelines.