Retaining sails and dropping anchors

[Eamonn]

"Those at Council or District level get paid to right these sinking ships"

Hi Jerry,

Two years ago we lost pack 111 and this year Troop 111 failed to recharter.

Some of the reasons for this go back a very long time. They have mainly to do with one man being a one man band who didn't allow new people in. But that's another thread.

Our DE at the time held 111 very near and dear to her heart, her son had been in both the Pack and the Troop. This is where he earned his Eagle Scout rank.

When things started to go wrong we had all sorts of meetings with what was left of the committees and with the church that was the CO.

Phil, the preacher is a wonderful man and was /is willing to do what he can to support the program. Sad to say the people that he gets to attend to attend the weekly services are old. Hardly any families with children. I know I went and made a plea from the pulpit.

Everyone loved and still loves the Scouts, but we just couldn't find adults willing to serve as leaders.

We did manage to find a Lady who was unhappy with the pack she was in to become a Tiger Den Leader. She tried to offer a Summer Time program, but when only about half the Den turned up (3 boys) She wasn't willing to give up the time for so few boys.

The District was doing everything that we could, the DE was doing everything that she could and maybe more than she ought. The Preacher and the Church Council were doing everything they could. But without leaders and without people from the church wanting the program we just couldn't pull it off.

How could we be the youth program for a church with no youth?

I don't have a list of adults waiting on the sidelines to be called into service.

If there is any good that has came out of this; it is that the Troop and pack down the road that is really following the program and offers a wonderful program is really doing well.

Eamonn

[Bob White]

Jerry, we can't create sails.

 

We need the COS to recommit themselves to selecting good people and getting them to make a personal committment to learning and following the scoutng program.

 

Isn't it ironic that leaders ask that same thing of scouts each week yet many adult leaders never take that committment to heart themselves.

 

What we can do depends on our role in scoutinbg. The first thing is learn your job and do it as best you can, if you need help ask. The Scouting community has ample resources for most situations.

 

But think of the posters we have seen and the units we know of in our own councils who have made the choice, not only to not ask, but to isolate themselves and rfeuse any assistance offered them by the district or council.

 

Let me add a couple things related to other posts in this thread.

 

Council and District people are NOT paid to fix leaky ships. Service that supports units and scouters in need are provided by volunteer members of the district and council committees.

 

SST3RD, you may not like this and I do not mean to be unkind or discourteous, but you have mistakenly put the blame on the wrong person. Your scoutmaster trained dad understands what the problem is...

 

"I've delayed this Scout's SM Conference for a couple of weeks."

 

That is not the decision that is in the best interest of the scout. Instead of working long and hard to find committee members you should be doing Scoutmaster Conferences. Recruiting committee members is the committee chair's job not the scoutmaster's.

 

If you are too busy to help a scout advance then you are TOO busy doing the wrong things.

 

I suggest a phone call to dad with an apology for being distracted from your primary functions. Then an apology to the scout for having put him off, then set a time in the next few days to meet with him.

 

Have a cheerful, thoughtful conference and get him to a board of review as quickly as possible. Scouts do not need to wait for a court of honor to advance.(This message has been edited by Bob White)

[evmori]

Opinion as fact again!

 

Delaying the SM conference might not have been the best course of action, but the dad blowing up like he did wasn't the best course of action, either. The Scout is the one who should be requesting SM conferences, not dad or mom. After all it is the Scout's rank, isn't it?

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[Bob White]

Greetings and welcome neighbor.

 

"The Scout is the one who should be requesting SM conferences,

 

Actually there is NOTHING in the BSA Handbook or Scoutmaster handbook that says that. But the BSA teaches that the adults are there to serve the boys, especially the scoutmaster, and not the other way around.

 

A scoutmaster that knew a scout needed a scoutmaster conference should be sitting down and having one not "delaying it for a couple of weeks". Dad is correct and knowing that, as a trained leader, he has some concerns. It does open up the question 'if the SM was to busy to this job while he was doing the CC's job', what other SM responsibilities is he "delaying"? For the trained dad this might have just been the straw that broke the camel's back.

 

If you were commissioning a unit would you tella Scoutmaster that "if he were having trouble with a parent" that he should punish the child?

 

SST3rd's problem seems to be that he delayed it because he is busy. But he seems to be busy doing things other than what the SM is there to do. You cannot be too busy to serve a scout when that is what your job is.

 

Thanks for visiting Ed, come again soon,

BW

[sst3rd]

Bob,

 

No, I don't think you're meaning to be unkind or discourteous. See, you thought I was going to try and defend myself.

 

sst3rd

[Bob White]

My hope was not that you would defend yourself but that you would re-evaluate the situation and see that the problem here is not dad.

[johndaigler]

I assume BW is on target with his explanation of the SM's responsibilities and Advancement process for Scouts. Even if I was a Boy Scouter rather than a Cub Scouter, I would trust BW's description of how the SM could have differently directed the set of events.

 

But, I think SST3rd's and BW's conversation is a good example showing that, given the right (wrong) set of circumstances, sails and anchors can change (be changed) - or at least be viewed differently by the other Unit leaders.

 

Except in rare cases, I think most Scouting Volunteers are worth working with in order to make them and the Unit better. Let's not be too quick to judge people, and Unit's, to be anchors and worthy of abandonment.

 

jd

[Bob White]

and lets not take so long that we allow a unit to be harmed or a single boy leaves scouting.

[sst3rd]

I was giving an example of an extreme situation that recently occurred. I didn't ask for advice or direction. There is much more to the situation than was listed.

No, I will not be apoligizing to anyone. Our adult leaders all work very hard for our unit, and things are great. This Dad has been smothering his son since he brought him from Webolos. Dad interferes in the Patrol and Troop functions, and won't let his son be a Scout. We've all tried to get Dad away from his son. His PL has asked several times for the Dad to leave the Patrol meetings and campsites. And, his son has not completed his leadership requirement for Star. He procrastinated on this. Dad knows this, and is fighting me for it anyway. That's why the Scout isn't getting a Conference or Board just yet. So much more to tell, but you don't need to know!

I will respond no more to this subject.

 

sst3rd

[Bob White]

I understand that you are frustrated with the dad sst3rd but if I may interject...all scouts come with parents, you need to keep your focus on the scouts. Things are not great if you have a scout who gets purposely delayed for his SM conference.

 

The fact is that if a scout is ready for a SM conference then the SM should make it happen. There is nothing gained by delaying it two weeks is there?

 

You mentioned that you have been working tirelessly to get more committee members and ASMs. May I ask, when you are at a typical troop meeting how do you typically spend your time? Are you recruiting committee members, conversing with parents, going over things with the CC?

[evmori]

Let's see. Who earns ranks & merit badges? The Scout or the Scout's parents? Wait I know the answer! The Scout! So if the Scout needs a SM Conference or BOR who should be asking for/about it - the Scout or the Scout's parents? I know another answer! The Scout. It might not be written in any BSA manual or handbook but nowhere does it state a SM Conference or BOR is between the Scout, parents & SM or BOR. It is between the SM/BOR & the Scout.

 

And why when these type of problems occur there are those who feel the problem is always with the leader and never the parent? It is possible, very possible, the parent is the one at fault!

 

You're welcome, Bob. Glad I could return so soon.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[Bob White]

Eamonn or Fscouter would care to handle this less I be branded a bully as well.

 

Thanks

Bob

[FScouter]

As sst3rd said, theres more to the story, and there always is. The SM is holding up the conference and the dad wants it to happen. Being involved in other responsibilities is not really much of a reason to keep a boy waiting. The dad may be guilty of other things, but insisting that the SM conduct the conference doesnt seem out of line. Neither the dad nor the boy are delaying the advancement.

[Bob White]

Thank you FScouter you are a welcome port in an unwanted storm, and as usual you are right on the money.

 

Happy Sailing

BW

[evmori]

Thanks for your insight FScouter. However, my question wasn't answered.

 

I agree that SM Conferences & BOR's should not be delayed. But let's remember something - we are all human & sometimes things happen! In a perfect world, a SM Conference or BOR would never be delayed & we would all be shopping at Walgreens! But this isn't a perfect world. Mistakes will be made by everyone not just the adult leadership of a unit. Believe it or not, parents are not always right!

 

And sails can be created. Just like anchors can be created. To think otherwise is being close-minded.

 

Thanks for listening!

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10