New to forum, have a question about inappropriate camp behavior

[scoutmom2]

I've come across this site a few times this past year and have "lurked" a bit on topics that have come up in our troop. We just returned from Scout camp this week and the other adult leaders and I witnessed behavior by another Scout troop that was less than what would be expected from a Scout. I have been debating if I should contact this Troop's council and let them know about it or just suck it up and make sure it never happens in our Troop. I'd appreciate some input from other Scouters.

 

The most alarming incident occurred during a Flag/opening the day ceremony. Each Troop was to come up with a yell (not unusual for any camp I've been to). This Troop used foul language and a sexual reference in their yell. Their adult leadership did nothing in response. The women leaders who were along looked shocked but no one, not one leader said anything to the Scouts about it. The older scouts were not reprimanded in anyway. When our leaders and the other scout leaders expressed concern to the camp director and program director, we were told that they would "look into it". Our SPL even brought it up at the next SPL meeting and was told that they would "check it out." For the remaineder of our time at camp, there appeared to be no consequence to this behavior. In fact, our Scouts said the other boys in that Troop thought it was funny and that they had gotten away with it.

 

Not as alarming but irritating, this same Troop would not wear their Class A/Field uniforms to morning flags. Even though this was a camp requirement. They didn't want their younger scouts to get them dirty. Well, then teach them some table manners! They also did not remove their hats during flags or meal time prayer (the scouts and the leaders). The camp director allowed them to get away with this because he didn't want to make waves with such a large troop. Our leadership expressed our dismay with this in our final evaluation.

 

The other leaders in our troop and I took turns visiting the merit badge classes our scouts were taking. We repeatedly saw members of this other troop being verbally disrespectful to merit badge counselors and becoming upset when they realized they might be getting partials on some badges. Temper tantrums are not a part of scouting behavior at any age. At first I thought maybe we were being overly sensitive to what was going on. However, as the week went on, other troop leaders began asking if anyone else noticed this behavior and if they had to step in and support the merit badge counselors.

 

I know that my scouts are not perfect and do some less than steller things. We take the time to review with them behavior expectations, whether we are present or not. And if they are doing or saying anything inappropriate, it is addressed as soon as possible.

 

So, am I being cranky from 10 days away from home? Or do I have legitimate concerns? I'd like to point out this camp was not in our Council or even in our state. Any suggestions?

 

Thanks for any input!

[SemperParatus]

Welcome.

 

Bad behavior is never enjoyable to see, especially from scouts who are inculcated with the ideals of the Scout Law. My suspicion is that this troop may have been in-council and on its own turf, which could explain why the camp leadership seemingly gave them a pass (although, you do not know for sure if there was some form of discipline that eventually occurred). As a 'gypsy' troop, we see 'home' troops get preferential treatment all the time (just a fact of life, I don't blame the camp staff). My feeling is, let it go and redouble your efforts with your own troop to make sure that you raise scouts that are mature, follow the rules and don't embarass themselves or their unit with bad behavior.

[orennoah]

For my part, I advise to contact the Council Executive of that troop's home Council. You really can't do anything more than that and doing anything less, I get the feeling, will leave you with a sense of undone justice.

 

I'd also like to point out that I, too, have noticed a direct correlation between poor uniforming and poor behavior. Both, I beleive, stem from a lack of pride in the unit, in Scouting and in oneself.

 

- Oren

[madkins007]

Hey! We have a troop like that in our council too! Big, obnoxious, acts priviledged or above the rules at camp and camporees. Ours churns out bunches of merit badges but oddly, the leaders rarely show up at training or roundtable.

 

I'd bet the troop's own council already knows them, and has already done pretty much all they are going to do. Frankly, there is not much they can do.

 

I'd suggest you let it go- except as a gentle reminder to your own Scouts about the right ways to act and how you appear to others.

[watercub]

I was at summer camp three weeks ago, same thing. Our Scouts were asking "what will be done?" about those Scouts, and the answer is that we must never conduct ourselves that way. Sometimes it takes other's bad example to teach the right path to take... I wish there was a better answer, but it is up to each unit to enforce the standards of appropriate behavior.

[Lynda J]

Write a letter to your council telling them what happened and which troop it was. If nothing else someone may say something to the leaders.

 

Last year at our Merit Badge College there was one troop that had the rudest boys I have ever seen. We use a local college campus and buildings for the event and are ask to please take no food or drinks into the rooms. This troop pulled out their lunches and started eating during one of the badge workshops. I told them they had to put their food up. One of the boys said "up yours". I walked out of the class room and went and got their SM. He told the boy he was rude but said nothing else. Later that day I caught them climbing on the campus bell which had a sign on it stating no climbing. The SM was sitting right there. I knew there was no point in saying anything further to him. I contacted the Council office on the following Monday. The troop will not be allowed to take part on any further MBC. Since our are invitation only we make sure our boys are on their best behaviour.

[SeattlePioneer]

Sorry to hear of your bad experience, Scoutmom.

 

 

I'm glad to be able to report that I've never witnessed such bad behavior being tolerated in my fairly extensive experience with Scouting.

 

However, Scouts in units I've worked with have displayed bad behavior. One boy earned himself a month suspension from the program after several incidents of bad behavior at a Cub Pack overnight our troop was supporting.

 

Another outing a year ago might have had boys responsible for breaking up restroom fixtures at a state park. There was some anecdotal evidence that a late night group of teenagers may have been responsible, but I'm afraid I had my doubts about that explanation. I wound up leaving that troop as a volunteer, largely because of bad experiences on that outing that were tolerated by leaders.

 

 

It does sound like the unruly comments made weren't repeated at later ceremonies, so I would suppose that action was taken to deal with that complaint.

 

The complaint about uniforms is something I could ignore.

 

I think I would have reported the unruly behavior in the Merit Badge classes to the Camp Counselor, and expected that boys persisting in that would be sent back to their campsite and removed from the class or classes where they were refusing to cooperate. Camp staff shouldn't have to put up with that, and other Scouts shouldn't be exposed to that kind of bullying behavior.

 

Too bad you didn't have a chance to draw out the Scoutmaster at a crackerbarrel or other informal occasion. One wonders what troubles he had to deal with.

 

 

 

Seattle Pioneer

[acco40]

"In fact, our Scouts said the other boys in that Troop thought it was funny and that they had gotten away with it."

 

There is the key. If your Scouts (oops, the Scouts that are in the troop which you serve) feel that they are being punished by being forced to wear a uniform and act "respectful" while another troop does not and "gets away with it" you have a tough row to hoe. If your Scouts felt pride in the way they themselves acted and felt glad they did not bring disrespect or dishonor to their troop like the other boys - you have a great group of boys. In either case, don't worry about the other troop but the boys in your own.

 

I was extremely proud of one of our PLs and our SPL last year at summer camp when on their own they pointed out another troop bad behavoir to their fellow troopmates and made of point of telling them that is NOT how we act. They had pride in themselves, their patrol and their troop.

[SR540Beaver]

Not to worry! This is just one of those innovative troops we've been discussing in other threads where using the program and methods as designed by the BSA is merely a suggestion. They obviously have found their own methods that works better for them. They are a big troop, so they must be doing something right. Sorry, couldn't resist.

 

[evmori]

The best thing you can do is use this Troop as a "bad" example of how your unit should never do things.

 

Ed Mori

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

[scoutmom2]

Thank you all for your input! As unfortunate as it is, I'm glad I'm not the only person who has encountered less than acceptable scout behavior.

 

The adult leaders on our trip did use our travel time home to talk to the boys about behavior expectations and scouting expectations. The SPL and ASPL as well as some of our older boys made sure the first year boys knew that this would not be tolerated by them or anyone else in the troop. They were able to share "horror" stories from other events with the first years. We have some boys who are easily led and want them to be led in the right direction. We also are experiencing for the first time, a large influx of new scouts with ADD/ADHD issues that impact their behavior. We are findng that we are needing to be extra viligent and there have been a lot of those teachable moments.

 

Thanks again!

[GopherJudy]

Sorry you & the boys in your troop had to witness this. My son is going to summer camp, his first, on July 17th. I remind him to be on his best behavior & if he knows that something is wrong, not to follow the crowd. If told him that many times!

 

I can't add to any of the suggestions but to repeat to the boys in your troop that what they witnesses was totally inappropriate & unacceptable behavior. I think if I was there I might have said something along those lines to the "my" boys about the behavior of the boys in the other troop just loud enough so those boys & maybe one of their leaders could hear it.

 

Hopefully you'll never have to encounter that again!

 

Judy