Scouting - support group vs team

[ps56k]

I've posted several different threads here over the past couple of frustrating years. They pretty much chronicle our failing vision of what has become Scouting. As I've mentioned, we have a 14yr old Life Scout with 2 MB's + project left for Eagle... and he has been: SPL, ASPL, PL, and is now the Scout QM, along with being the only Troop Scout to be heading to Jamboree and also to JLTC/NYLT Staff for 2005. He is also in OA, and on Track, Soccer, and Swim Teams.

So - he has reached a final plateau in the Troop. There are about 20+ Life ghost scouts on the Troop Roster that have not been seen in years (many topics on this), don't come to meetings, outings, etc... So, our son really sees the difference like at the NYLT and Jamboree meetings where everyone "wants" to be there, which is very different than at a Troop meeting.

It appears more and more that Scouting is a place for boys to come/join where they may not quite fit into other groups - I guess this is both good and bad. It seems like we get more of the boys that need some social help, and the 14+ high school scouts (20+ Life scouts) just vanish what with school, sports, and other interests.

So - is the Troop there, like a charity, counselor, or shelter, to offer sanctuary to these drifting Scouts as they come and go, wear their uniform or not, attend or not, and we are to be grateful for helping to retain a Scout. Great for the Scout, with no expectations, demands, or responsibilities except to himself. But what about the effect on the Troop - can't count on ANY scout being at the meeting or campout, being a leader, knowing the skills, etc.

Or - should the Troop be like a school sports team? Let's have the same level of rules.... wear the uniform, attend meetings ("practice"), attend the games ("campouts"), learn the playbook ("scout skills"), work with the rookies ("POR"), etc... And then you have the adults - as others have mentioned - always wanting to jump in and save the situation, meeting, whatever. After going thru this same "groundhog day" scenario for several years, it gets frustrating at re-teaching new PLC, because there are no older Scouts to act as mentors, along with the revolving door of uniformed leaders that each have their own agenda.

After Jamboree we'll see how our Life'r does. He has shown no interest in his final personal advancement toward Eagle, and little interest at once again being one of the few older scouts actually trying to lead the Troop.

 

[Lynda J]

4 years ago the troop I am with was about to fold. They were down to 4 boys that attended but had 16 on the roster. New SM took over. Not we have 19 on the roster and at this weeks meeting at had 17 of those there. Your program will make a big difference in attendance. If boys start getting the feeling that all the focus is on one or two boys the others will stop coming. This is what happened to us. The boys got to feeling that all the focus was on the SM's son and stepson. That they were the only ones that got to do anything or hold offices. That they were the only ones that had a chance of making Eagle.

So make sure you have a good and interesting and challenging program.

[Bob White]

If you try to make scouting fit the mold of anything other than scouting it will not work, because Scouting is unique.

 

When done correctly it is a youth program designed to teach ethical decision making using a set of prescribed methods. When done incorrectly it is anybody's guess what is result will be, or how it will be percieved by others.

 

 

[scoutldr]

ps56k - I like the sports analogy. The SM is the coach. If the QB is performing badly, the coach cannot enter the game and take his place. It's simply not allowed, and all the parents accept that. The coach has to keep coaching until the QB gets it, or is replaced. If the other players tire of losing, they either improve their performance or find another team.

 

I like it!

[Eamonn]

Sometime back in these forums we discussed if Scouter's get the Troops they deserve?

The Patrol method only works if adults work at making it work. Advancement if managed correctly is a wonderful tool. Personal growth does mean that every now and then a Scout has to hear "Well Done" The adults do at times have to stoop down to help pick a Lad up. The outdoor program should cover skills learned in the meeting room. The ideals of Scouting are based on the Scout Oath and Law. Each Law states that a Scout is. We have to let him bring it to life.

If we are not keeping the promise made on page one of the Scout Handbook, we are doing something wrong.

If each and every meeting was the best show in town I think that the Scouts would move heaven and earth to be at the meetings. If the program challenged each Scout and was fun and adventurous there wouldn't be any "Ghost Scouts"

You have identified the problems now is the time to go about fixing them.

Eamonn.

[jr56]

I have had the biggest problem finding enough boys who wnat to run the troop program. They won't do anything, they just want to show up at troop meetings and have the program already provided for them, just like sports. There are very few boys ou there that I have seen that are willing to jump in and frun the program. But when one comes along, it is amazing how well it works, the boys like to listen to one of their own much more than listening to any adult leader.

[Bob White]

If you are waiting for an untrained boy to run up and grasp the reins of leadership you will have a long wait. You first have to make scouts comfortable with the idea of them being able to makje decisions by teaching them to do small tasks, giving them positive reinforcement and rewards as they gradually take on more complicated tasks. You have to lead them through leadership. You cannot just turn the program over to them and expect them to know what to do or how to do it.

 

Thats what the program is about, using the Methods of Scouting to lead them.

[acco40]

In short - you get out of it what you put in to it and that goes for the adults and the youth.

 

It is a l o n g process.

[Oak Tree]

Having done both sports and Scouts, and having observed/participated in both as a parent, I can say that I don't find the Scouting and sports analogy to be at all close, although I'll admit for a few similarities.

 

Sports teams have practices and games, where the practices are entirely focused on how to become better so that you can win the games. Scouts have troop meetings and the random contest or two, but the troop meetings are not entirely focused on preparing to win the Klondike Derby (well, maybe in a troop or two they are). Sports have a limited number of players on a team, with the players competing for the starting positions, whereas everyone is welcome in Scouts. In sports, the slower or less talented player just can't keep up with the better players. In Scouts, with enough perseverance, even the clumsy kid who's not the brightest can eventually earn Eagle.

 

In basketball, if you say you were the high scorer on the team, I have a pretty good idea that you know how to shoot. But if you say you have an Eagle, I'm not even sure you can tie a bowline. I do know that you've done a bunch of stuff at least once, and have been camping a number of times, and have stuck to the program for awhile, but beyond that...

 

If I had to make up my own analogy, I'd say Scouting more closely resembles the other clubs that schools/churches offer - ski club, chess club, church youth groups, cycling club. Feel free to poke your own holes; Scouting does take it a bit further than these groups, with the uniforming and rank advancement.

 

And at the elementary school level, where sports teams practice once a week and everyone plays roughly equal time, I'll grant you more similarity to Cub Scouts. But the focus on one specific set of skills is still very different from Cub Scouts.

 

Not that one's better or worse than the other.

 

Oak Tree