Reasonable Level of Evolvement & Troop Culture

[ramanous]

Forking off this post about parent communications

I've read the Troop Committee Guidebook, so I know whats supposed to happen...

In practice... what methods and level of information detail does your SM and TLC / Scouter Reserves discuss? What responsibilities does your TLC have, especially in how it affects troop plans and implementation?

For context in our particular case, the SM tells the TLC about the status of a few upcoming events, the treasure reports financial status, and the meeting is done. Several of the active, trained parents are frustrated they are basically sidelined at the TLC meetings, while the SM complains about lack of parental involvement.

EDIT: TL;DNR: What signs should a parent look for that the troop has healthy culture?

I realized after I hit submit that some of you might ask if this is about the youth or the parent. And, is this a case of parents trying to run the troop (rather than the youth.) There is more going on than described above. I am trying to understand a specific matter regarding troop culture. I've further edited to be more concise

 

Edited March 23 by ramanous

[InquisitiveScouter]

Parents and Committee members should never do something that Scouts can do for themselves.

The Scouts choose their program and capture it on the calendar in their "Annual Planning Conference".  Do not let the name fool you.  We have at least two of these each year... one per Senior Patrol Leader tenure.  And they are challenged to look out at least twelve months, so that we always have six months of program on tap.

Once the Scouts choose their program, it goes to the Committee for "approval."  It is not really so much an "approval" as it is a "yes, we can support this, with the adult constraints we have..."

For example, the Troop leaders set the constraint of one camping trip per month, and one day-long event (hike, bike, service project, etc.) per month, one long term Summer Camp per year, and one long term "high adventure" per year. That is what we can support with adult supervision requirements levied upon us by National.  Sometimes pop-up events are presented, like an additional service project, and we try to meet those.  Occasionally, (once or twice per year?) we have to cancel an event because we cannot field the adult supervision required.  

The committee then uses this calendar of activities to determine the unit budget, and, therefore, the targets for unit dues and fundraising for the year...

At each monthly Committee meeting, the SM and one or two ASMs present a "State of the Troop" and present any issues that have come up.

The committee goes over the upcoming events and asks if there are any shortfalls in supporting the Troop program. 

They discuss the status of spending against the budget; adult succession and training; status of equipment and what purchases need to be made to support our Scouts; determine unit policies; discuss the health of the Troop and any disciplinary issues that have come up, to make sure the leaders are handling things in line with parents' wishes. Etc, etc, etc...

The committee and parents conduct Boards of Review for all ranks (including Eagle Scout); they hear proposals for Eagle Scout projects

They discuss recharter and JTE progress.

And much more.  There is always a full agenda.

Does that help?

 

[ramanous]

Yes, that sounds much more like I would expect.

Does the PLC send their "annual plan" directly to the TLC for review or does the SM intercede?

Does the TLC follow a formal agenda?

[InquisitiveScouter]

23 minutes ago, ramanous said:

Yes, that sounds much more like I would expect.

Does the PLC send their "annual plan" directly to the TLC for review or does the SM intercede?

Does the TLC follow a formal agenda?

The SM and ASMs mentor the Annual Planning to help the PLC meet their targets, constraints, and restrictions.  (Restrictions like that they cannot plan to do skydiving, hot air balloon trips, parkour, or a Troop boxing tournament... you know, prohibited stuff that they would love to do!)

And, for clarity, please, what do you mean by TLC?

[ramanous]

TLC: Troop Leadership Committee - the adult committee that oversees the program consisting of the Chair, Treasurer, Secretary and various other positions. Or, the adults that sit around a table occasionally chatting about the scout program. I think when I was in scouts the TLC was the term used for the PLC now, but that was a long time ago. 

Who sets the PLC targets? JTE and/or troop specific targets, I assume.

[InquisitiveScouter]

Target program is negotiable.  Start maybe with identifying how many program elements the adults can support, since that is now the limiting factor.

Side note: I think this is one of the things killing Scouting.  Back in the day, we got together as a Patrol without adults.  We did hikes, service projects, meetings, or just hung out.  Scouts are not allowed to do such things now.

After you determine what the adults can support, present that to the PLC.  You saw my earlier post with what the Committee together with the direct contact leaders can do. 

We have an ASM assigned to each patrol.  So, each patrol is like its own Troop.  The patrol also gets to sprinkle in two or three patrol-only camping trips during the year.

This takes a good many adults.

If the ASM has additional bandwidth,  they can do extra patrol activities.  This used to be easier, as they could do day only activities with only an extra parent present.  Now, two registered are required, so it is much more difficult.  Again, killing Scouting IMO.

We do ask the PLC each time if THEY want to use JTE.  The metrics are useful for determining a quality program.  The PLC has a culture of accepting the JTE targets and using them to help achieve a quality program.

If they ever decide to ditch it, the Committee will have to be good with it.

 

[InquisitiveScouter]

P.S.  We adults do have to limit their appetite.  The Scouts ask to do many more activities than we adult volunteers can support.  But, I have noticed their eyes do tend to be bigger than their stomachs.  That is, the more activities we added, the fewer the average number of Scouts who participated in those activities.  A bit of scarcity in supply seemed to increase the real demand/uptake.

 

 

[curious_scouter]

On 3/23/2024 at 2:30 PM, InquisitiveScouter said:

"Annual Planning Conference".  Do not let the name fool you.  We have at least two of these each year... one per Senior Patrol Leader tenure.  And they are challenged to look out at least twelve months, so that we always have six months of program on tap.

We follow a similar process to @InquisitiveScouter's.

• SM and CC conference ahead of annual planning, align on any fundamental shifts in year-to-year policies (similar to IS's notes:  We have standing expectation of 1 outing per month, 1 in-state / 1 out-of-state summer camp, and certain other activities we pre-commit to each year like helping with pack crossover weekend, etc.)  This seed the "parameters" for annual planning.
• SM and PLC conduct annual planning.  CC is invited to participate. 
• We review school, council, district, and OA calendars so we can participate and avoid conflicts
• PLC selects Choice A and Choice B for outing sites for each month of the year
• PLC "swags" in themes for each month as a guideline - these tend to align with the outing... going canoing?  Monthly theme will be aligned to help prep for the outing.  But... these often change in our monthly PLCs.
• Annual planning concludes with list of destinations and other activities
• SM and SPL present annual plan to Committee over the summer, get their approval (this feels more symbolic but technically they could tell us to go back to the drawing board) and then the Committee sets about budgeting, assigning the outdoor chair to start booking reservations for outing locales, etc.
• Throughout the program year we meet every 1st Thursday and the SPL leads detailed planning for the month and sometimes into the next month if there will not be a PLC before a meeting occurs.

I love the note from IS about re-doing annual planning midway through.  It makes a ton of sense to at least have the incoming "administration" look over the remainder of the plan and provide input.  By then, a lot of things are committed.  But I have also seen that by then, a lot of plans have fallen through (places we wanted to book were too popular and we didn't get, things we planned to do got canceled, etc.) and it would be a good way to set the tone with the new SPL as well as revisit "the plan" more holistically.

The committee operates on their own schedule.  I attend at SM but again - this is symbolic.  I'm not on the committee of our unit, I'm there to give the committee an update about the program, make any asks for support and gear, etc.  We try to keep the committee like the wizard of oz - busy but invisible to the youth.

I do not run that meeting and I only speak when asked to or when it's my part of the agenda.

[ramanous]

How does your Key3 address parental suggestions and concerns, especally those brought up at parent / TLC meetings, that are at odds with the Key3 methods? Will they take the time to discuss the matter(s) with parents? Or, are the parent meetings basically presentations?

[curious_scouter]

Get involved or get informed is my mantra.

Serious concerns for safety or logistics are always welcome, but nit picking the plan the scouts create isn't something I tolerate if you weren't willing to make the time to participate