Another Camping MB 9B Requirement Question :)

[SiouxRanger]

18 hours ago, DuctTape said:

However I would like to see the requirement have some  (10?) of the nights not be in shelters provided to the Scout.

I agree. And with counting "nights…in shelters not provided to the Scout" our unit has a firm rule that those nights are only counted if the Scout at least to adjust the thermostat AND they get their own ice from the machine down the hall.

[SSScout]

In the Troop of my yoooth,  the Troop had an overnight scheduled at least every other month, even thru the winter.  We had hikes and other events, but somewhere we had an overnight, if not at "The Property", which belonged to somebody's uncle's cousin....   

Summer camp too, both Council sponsored "official"  summer camp, and the one we set up in "The Property"....

I would hope the NEW requirements would differentiate between "under canvas, on the ground" (nylon? Plastic?)  and under "roof" (long term? On platform? ). 

Carrying your shelter on Philmont, Katahdin or on canoe  is a mark different than walking in to a Camp Scouter site and walking up a step onto a platform, even if it is under canvas held up by a 2x4 beam.   

[PACAN]

IMHO this change is unnecessary.    What is the purpose of 20 nights and requirement 9b?    Teach youth how to take care of themselves in different types of outdoor experiences?   If a scout goes to 4 summer camps, that’s 60 percent of the nights.

 

Some scouts today are finishing their Eagle nights and have 75-100 total.

 

we should go back to the pre 1960 camping mb requirement which was 50 nights with no longer term camps allowed.

Edited yesterday at 01:31 AM by PACAN
Lost some wordimg

[fred8033]

12 hours ago, PACAN said:

IMHO this change is unnecessary.    What is the purpose of 20 nights and requirement 9b?    Teach youth how to take care of themselves in different types of outdoor experiences?   If a scout goes to 4 summer camps, that’s 60 percent of the nights.

 

Some scouts today are finishing their Eagle nights and have 75-100 total.

 

we should go back to the pre 1960 camping mb requirement which was 50 nights with no longer term camps allowed.

My sons each have at least 100+ qualifying nights.  If the troop is active, it's not hard.  Opportunity exists for 7 years * 12 months * 2 nights a month = 168.  Add summer camps ... now 203.  Add other special high adventures.  ... Two of my sons worked at scout camps.  I swear one of my sons probably had 300 nights in a tent before he turned 18.

20 nights is low bar to pass.  

[skeptic]

15 hours ago, PACAN said:

IMHO this change is unnecessary.    What is the purpose of 20 nights and requirement 9b?    Teach youth how to take care of themselves in different types of outdoor experiences?   If a scout goes to 4 summer camps, that’s 60 percent of the nights.

 

Some scouts today are finishing their Eagle nights and have 75-100 total.

 

we should go back to the pre 1960 camping mb requirement which was 50 nights with no longer term camps allowed.

While that may be lore in your area or unit, it was not the case.  20 Days or nights was the amount needed, and, at least in the 1960 HB, which still had requirements in the back, there was no specification regarding summer camp.  Now in the pamphlet, which I may or may not have avaailable someplace that may have been discussed.  It is hard to overcome the lore from the past, much of it being simply poor memory or units that chose their own interpretations and so on.  For example, here we had one unit that added in pioneering and wilderness survival for their youth in order to become Eagle,  It had its purpose, but some choice to leave and go elsewhere, or sadly just left.  It may that type of thing that brought on the specific publication by National regarding adherring to official requirements.  Sort of like the long time story that the earliest scouts had to light a fire without matches to advance, but even then matches were allowed; only two max, but allowed.  Friction and spark were common though, and many did it regularly.  

[PACAN]

My bad.  The 50 nights is in my copy of the 1934 MB requirements booklet.  I’ll have to look further on when it changed to 20.

[qwazse]

What percentage of scouts are doing long-term camps, to the exclusion of multiple weekend (or midweek) outings? And how is it hurting them if they don’t earn Camping MB? If they’d rather advance as far as Life, let them age out proudly.

The fundamental problem is thinking that it’s a shame to disqualify from the nation’s highest scouting award youth who don’t practice hiking and camping independently with their mates.

I sympathize with counselors who feel like they are having to split hairs, but sometimes scouts and their troops need that little nudge to think out of the box.

[InquisitiveScouter]

9 hours ago, qwazse said:

If they’d rather advance as far as Life, let them age out proudly.

The fundamental problem is thinking that it’s a shame to disqualify from the nation’s highest scouting award

I think BSA should drop the age limit.  This deadline causes so much unneeded frustration for families and Scouts, and a rush to get it done, cutting corners, and detracting from the experience.

If we want to create a great outdoor experience, we do not need to overlay the pressure of doing it for an award you are going run out of time getting.

This would also help integrate Scouts with different needs (I do not like the phrase "special needs") who need more time to complete things. 

Edited 6 hours ago by InquisitiveScouter