Guide to Safe Scouting

[InquisitiveScouter]

There are a lot of different threads relating to specific policies or activities discussed in the Guide to Safe Scouting.  As this is a fundamental document in BSA literature, I thought we might have a thread with just that title.  @John-in-KC had created some threads with the dated versions, but I think it might be useful to have an enduring topic with all things "Guide to Safe Scouting."  Please include in your posts the version date, section, and page for reference, so folks may easily find source info on their own.

From time to time, I review the G2SS, and I always seem to find something new that I had not noticed before, that might also be useful to others.  I intend to post those here instead of in new threads...

[InquisitiveScouter]

Just learned today that E-bikes are now specifically prohibited.  I guess BSA had that question posed several times, even though it is obviously a "motorized vehicle."

February 2023 version, Prohibited Activities, Item 6 (no page available yet, as updated pdf is not posted for download):

6.  Motorized vehicles used as program or activities—including all-terrain vehicles (ATVs), off-road vehicles, motorized personal watercraft (PWC), snowmobiles, E-Bikes and motorized speed events (exceptions: council-approved ATV and PWC programs that comply with National Camp Accreditation Program [NCAP] standards; go-karting conducted at a commercial facility that provides equipment and supervision of cart operation; youth completing the Motorboating merit badge)

This specific prohibition was not listed in the Feb 2022 download version (still available at the pdf link online.)

Edited April 20, 2023 by InquisitiveScouter

[RichardB]

5 hours ago, InquisitiveScouter said:

Just learned today that E-bikes are now specifically prohibited.  I guess BSA had that question posed several times, even though it is obviously a "motorized vehicle."

It obviously wasn't as obvious as it needed to be.  

[jcousino]

to part of that question my state does not treat them as motorized vehicles until they are greater than 750 watt. So are much greater

[InquisitiveScouter]

13 minutes ago, jcousino said:

to part of that question my state does not treat them as motorized vehicles until they are greater than 750 watt. So are much greater

OK, I can see where that might need clarifying, then.

[InquisitiveScouter]

@RichardB, the current online version (Feb 2023) (and Feb 2022 download version) incorporated a change in BSA SCUBA Policy, Medical Contraindications section.

Currently, prior to doing SCUBA events, each participant must complete the specific dive agency's medical form with the following additional instruction.  "The BSA requires review and approval of the completed form by a physician."

The last time we conducted a SCUBA event, the 2019 policy applied, and it was written thus: "The BSA requires review and approval of the completed form by a physician even if the scuba agency itself does not require physician approval." (emphasis added)

All SCUBA agency forms have the diver fill out a more detailed questionnaire (than BSA AHMR covers), but, if there are no "contraindications", then these agencies themselves say on their forms that no doctor signature is required.  I have attached the PADI form as an example.

Under the questions, it says,

"If you answered NO to all 10 questions above, a medical evaluation is not required. Please read and agree to the participant statement below by signing and dating it." (emphasis added)

Even under the old policy, the Summer Camp our Scouts attended for SCUBA did not enforce the 2019 BSA policy requiring the physician signature.  (We did at our unit level, but divers from other units did not have a physician's signature.  I pointed this out to the Camp Director (a professional), but he told me he wasn't going to enforce it because the commercial vendor conducting the SCUBA at the camp did not require it.  When I filled out our camp survey, I documented this for their council review process, but never heard anything of it afterward.)

As I read the current policy, it still seems BSA wants a physician's clearance for all participants. (That is, to have page 3 signed by the provider, regardless of medical status.) So, why eliminate the "...even if the scuba agency itself does not require physician approval." which seemed much more clear?

Can you shed any light on this?? Am I interpreting the update incorrectly?

P.S.  Before our last event, I spent almost an hour on the phone with the SCUBA policy expert at Sea Base clarifying the 2019 requirements for diver to instructor & certified-adult ratios (which is clarified better in the newer policies.)

10346E_Diver_Medical_Form.pdf

Edited April 21, 2023 by InquisitiveScouter

[RichardB]

The following medical contraindications are based on BSA operational considerations and may be more conservative than those listed in the “Diving Medical Guidance to the Physician.”

Emphasis added above.  

[InquisitiveScouter]

25 minutes ago, RichardB said:

The following medical contraindications are based on BSA operational considerations and may be more conservative than those listed in the “Diving Medical Guidance to the Physician.”

Emphasis added above.  

Yes I know those, but that did not really address the question.

Is a physician signature required on the agency form for all BSA SCUBA participants, whether the agency requires it or not?

That is, if a participant has NO medical contraindications, must they still be cleared by a physician, with a signature on the agency form?

 

[RichardB]

16 hours ago, InquisitiveScouter said:

Yes I know those, but that did not really address the question.

Is a physician signature required on the agency form for all BSA SCUBA participants, whether the agency requires it or not?

That is, if a participant has NO medical contraindications, must they still be cleared by a physician, with a signature on the agency form?

 

Light was shed as requested by the first answer.  You appear to correctly understand that "The BSA requires review and approval of the completed form by a physician."  

[InquisitiveScouter]

Thank you for answering.  Your method of clarifying never ceases to amuse.

[T2Eagle]

On 4/20/2023 at 4:14 PM, RichardB said:

It obviously wasn't as obvious as it needed to be.  

When I was young scout you could buy a kit that would add an electric motor to your bike --- it was advertised in the back of Boys' Life.  

[MattR]

11 minutes ago, T2Eagle said:

When I was young scout you could buy a kit that would add an electric motor to your bike --- it was advertised in the back of Boys' Life.  

When I was young we used the inside of the car as a jungle gym, while on the highway.

[InquisitiveScouter]

Just now, MattR said:

When I was young we used the inside of the car as a jungle gym, while on the highway.

We used the bed of the pickup truck 😛 

[InquisitiveScouter]

@RichardB, what is the best way for us to give constructive feedback regarding the G2SS (and related policies)?

Should that feedback be funneled to you, or somehow to another office of the BSA staff, or through our local council as a starting point?

I sincerely hope the answer is not the last, as, over the years, I have had many valid concerns and observations disappear into that black hole.  Most councils are very much afraid of seeming to have dirty laundry, and avoid (or ignore) these exchanges like the plague.  (Why is that?)

Thanks in advance for taking to time to share your thoughts & observations.

[RichardB]

@InquisitiveScouter your council is the go to for all volunteer related questions and feedback.    As part of the restructuring that was a choice made by the councils.   The national council no longer has that function nor resources.   Social media sites as feedback loops sometimes work, and sometimes the submitters don't like it when they get what they ask for.   It's hit or miss.   

Edited April 23, 2023 by RichardB