Cub Scout Single Night Camping Only

[5thGenTexan]

New Cub Scout program edit in GTSS

 

Edited February 21, 2023 by 5thGenTexan

[RichardB]

Not new.  https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/overnight 

 

Edited February 21, 2023 by RichardB

[5thGenTexan]

Well... the "single" part didnt used to be there.  Implying can only camp overnight 1 night.  Not 2.  Which is crummy.

 

2023 GTSS - New guideline included as above.

 

2022 GTSS - No mention of overnight camping restriction (that I can tell)

Edited February 21, 2023 by 5thGenTexan
Images for clarification

[RichardB]

 

Cub Packs or Webelos / AOL Dens can organize Overnight activities, at council designated locations, with a BALOO trained leader.  This is neither a new nor changed age appropriate requirement.    It does appear that the intent of overnight, included in BALOO training: https://www.scouting.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/510-03318-BALOO_web_v2.pdf, on the Cub Scout Page:   https://www.scouting.org/programs/cub-scouts/activities/cub-scout-camping/  has been clarified by this update.  It's been in place decades.   

Councils can run longer Cub Scout camping following the National Camp Accreditation Standards.   But units remain limited to overnight opportunities.  Perhaps this is the source of confusion.  

[Eagle94-A1]

As someone involved in Scouting since before Cub Scout packs could conduct overnight camping trips, and as someone who taught BALOO, this "Single Overnight Experience Policy" is indeed new.  I have never seen it written in any BSA literature I have or used to teach BALOO that limited Cub Scout packs to 1 night. This is going to hurt many packs now, and in the future, especially when all the camp closures come about due to the bankruptcy.  

On a different note, what happens in those councils that do not have a list of approved campsites? And when asked about the approval process are told "Cubs don't need to camp." I ask because because there are councils out there that do not have a list, so packs use the OA's Where To Go Camping. Especially since state parks meet the Cub Scouts standards better than their own camps.

Edited February 21, 2023 by Eagle94-A1

[mrjohns2]

53 minutes ago, RichardB said:

Cub Packs or Webelos / AOL Dens can organize Overnight activities, at council designated locations, with a BALOO trained leader.  This is neither a new nor changed age appropriate requirement.  

It is much clearer, to me, since what do you call 2 overnights? Not sure. Overnight is the opposite of not staying just the day, to me. It doesn’t mean singular, to me. 
 

It clearly says camping. Does that mean a tent? What about 2 nights in a council cabin? Our council cabins are booked solid from September - March with Cub Scout packs doing 2 “overnights”. 

[seattlecyclone]

My son's pack has been doing multiple two-night outings each year for decades. I find it hard to believe we could have kept that a secret from our district and council leadership for that long, and AFAIK nobody has told us to stop doing this before. It therefore seems far from universally understood that this rule has been in place this whole time.

[awanatech]

3 hours ago, seattlecyclone said:

My son's pack has been doing multiple two-night outings each year for decades. I find it hard to believe we could have kept that a secret from our district and council leadership for that long, and AFAIK nobody has told us to stop doing this before. It therefore seems far from universally understood that this rule has been in place this whole time.

District & Council leadership have been known to turn a blind eye to many things that are actually against BSA policy. 

[InquisitiveScouter]

Ludicrous

[5thGenTexan]

Looked at the FB comments just a few minutes ago.  Saw a comment from the Circle 10 SE that he is communicating with National to find out about this....

[seattlecyclone]

4 hours ago, awanatech said:

District & Council leadership have been known to turn a blind eye to many things that are actually against BSA policy. 

Rules that nobody is interested in enforcing, for decades on end, are effectively meaningless. So...does this "clarification" signal that people will now become interested in enforcing this rule, or is it actually true that nothing has changed here?

Edited February 22, 2023 by seattlecyclone

[scoutldr]

Again, clarity seems to evade most BSA statements.  Does the adjective "singular" modify "overnight" or "experience"?  If the intent is to spend only one night, then say that.  Or, "Cub camping is limited to one night per outing."  And in all my years of unit service, Council never kept tabs on when units were camping or for how long, except when a tour permit was required or a Council property reservation was needed.  With no enforcement, people tend to do what they want, when they want, whether there is intent to disobey or not...yes, even in Scouting.

[PACAN]

@RichardB   Oh keeper of the G2SS can/will you provide us more than a link to the dictionary on the whys/logic/decision process on the cub "single overnight experience"?    Is there a safety issue?   YPT issue?  Thanks.

[Eagle94-A1]

1 hour ago, PACAN said:

@RichardB   Oh keeper of the G2SS can/will you provide us more than a link to the dictionary on the whys/logic/decision process on the cub "single overnight experience"?    Is there a safety issue?   YPT issue?  Thanks.

Especially since it appears that not even a SE knew about this rule.

And why can councils do multinights, but not units? I've known packs that not only had BSA qualifcations for Cub Camping, but Scout and advanced outside agencies, i.e. SAR, Swift Water rescue, ad nauseum.

 

[Eagle94-A1]

4 hours ago, scoutldr said:

Again, clarity seems to evade most BSA statements.  Does the adjective "singular" modify "overnight" or "experience"?  If the intent is to spend only one night, then say that.  Or, "Cub camping is limited to one night per outing." 

Good catch. A two night weekend camp out is a 'single overnight experience.