Scout Sprit

[Eagle Foot]

Last March I took over a troop that diden't have any adult who would step up and fill the position of SM. As time went on I have one scout who told me he was going to be an Eagle Scout....very good. Lets see what all you need to do since you are going to be seventeen shortly.

 

Long stroy short...he as a bad attitude....bully's the other scouts and uses bad language...(**)*_+**&^$#( and the like. He is down to the wire now only five months until his eighteenth birthday. He was always border line but the last camping trip he was bullieing the scouts, hitting them in the lower parts and so on.

 

I'm sorry that's not scout sprit....how could any SM approve this as scout sprit in the SM conference? He has the MB and has approval for his project....just horific manners, and lack of respect for adults and his SPL.

 

The bad thing about it he almost had overcome this behavior,,,but has sliped back into it again.

 

Do you ever see this in your troop? I know I'm going to get hit hard from his parents....but I won't do it... to approve scouts like this does a dis-service to the program...sets a sub-standard.

 

 

 

 

 

[EagleInKY]

You don't have to account for the sins of the past. If previous SMs did not hold him to a standard, then that's not your fault. It's theirs.

 

You have every right to hold him back. You should be very clear regarding your expectations. You'll probably need to include the parents. Although, at almost 18, he's pretty much an adult and will do what he wants to do.

 

I would give him every chance to turn things around. But I would not approve him based upon the description you gave today. You do run the risk that they might try to go over your head. That's something you'll have to be willing to defend.

 

And, yes, I've held boys back due to the Scout Spirit requirement. Do a search in this and you'll get a lot of good threads. However, I've never dealt with it at the age you're talking about and the Eagle deadline approaching.

[boleta]

A SM friend of mine clearly told an older boy what was expected- obey the Scout Oath and Law or find another troop. The Scout was told that he would not pass muster in this Troop and that he should find another. The SM had no problem that with 5 months to go before 18 the Scout would not be able to complete the 6 month POR requirement. The message given to the rest of the Troop is also an important part of this lesson. Bullying and hazing will not be tolerated in any form.

[Eamonn]

I hope you have made the Troop Committee aware of the behavior that this Lad has displayed?

I don't think him making Eagle is the question. In my book I would be asking the committee to remove him from the troop.

If you get a spare minute take a glance at the G2SS. I think that he should be gone ASAP.

Please believe me that I hate to see a Lad go,but for the good of the other Lad's he has to go.

Eamonn.

[BigMac]

Let me tell you a little story about my eldest son:

He was a boy that needed constant reminding from the start. But we had a pretty Gung Ho troop and it really carried him along, well then we moved 300 miles for 9 months and then moved again.

 

When we arrived in Spokane he was a star scout with well honed camping skills, but with an attitude, the attitude was that he saw the meetings as useless because he was not getting requirements (merit badges), I tried ever so much to lead him to the revelation that he was entering into the next phase of scouting and it was now time to give back more to scouting than he had received. At the time I was involved with cubs and his younger brother (by 6 years). All I heard was complaints about the troop and how useless the meetings were, I just could not get across that he was the troop.

 

 

Well I finally got tired of his complaints and we had a come to Jesus moment and he switched troops and from then on just would not participate. Well he made Life at 16, and was mostly complete on his merit badges, but just would not step up to leadership positions. At age 17 I just quit nagging him about leadership and his project, I came to that thought through many hours of contemplation. To put it simple I believe that part of becoming an Eagle Scout is that the boy has taken charge of his life, given back to scouting more than he has received, and is the pillar of virtue (even if they do not realize that).

 

 

He wasted that year and tried to rush his project and he BS'd his way through POR. I reclused myself even though I was an ASM. I really did not want to give my honest opinion. Well he bet on getting an extension and that failed. The only issue that I raised was that I wanted him treated no different than any other Scout in the council.

 

 

I wanted nothing more than for him to become an Eagle Scout, for his sake. But that did not happen. He graduated HS and had very poor grades (C ave) with a very easy schedule.

 

But this story has a bright ending, in Sept of his junior year he signed up for the Marine Corps Reserve and by Nov he changed to the Regular Marine Corps. He is now an avionics mech stationed in Okinawa. Hopefully his mental and physical laziness will be corrected service to his country.

Let me be clear he was never any trouble on a personal level.

 

He gave his younger brother a fine example on how not to provide himself with options. His brother is the complete opposite.

 

 

I relate this story because the behavior you described in the prospective Eagle Scout is totally unacceptable, and you would be doing a great dis-service to scouting and the boy if you let him pass. He has proven he can behave for a while, scouting behavior is not something you turn off and on, and it is a lifelong pursuit. If I,a wanting father can not endorse my own son for being lazy, then an abuser certainly can not be advanced.

(This message has been edited by BigMac)(This message has been edited by BigMac)

[KoreaScouter]

I didn't have a situation exactly like yours, but did have a 17 1/2 year old Life Scout racing the clock once. Scamming, cutting corners, parsing the truth, etc. Worse yet, his father was his inspiration for this nefarious behavior. I could write a book on this kid and his dad, but I won't do that here.

 

What I will say is that in the eyes of many, silence equals concurrence. That is, if what he's doing is unacceptable to you, that must be communicated to him, immediately and in a crystal-clear fashion, or else he'll think he's doing fine. Also, he must understand that there are advancement implications for his behavior, and he must be given a "way ahead" to complete those advancement requirements. If that's not possible (i.e., must do 6 months' POR with only 3 months until he ages out), he must be told.

 

Good luck.

 

KS

[Eamonn]

While many of us have seen the Lad that for whatever reason leaves everything to the last minute. I see the Lad here as a bully.

Eagle Scout or not. He is a bully.

Eamonn.